[paleo12]

I am thinking of buying two 7B3s which would be placed about 3 meters away from the BP26.  I want to connect them with XLR leads.  At present, my 4B2 is connected to the pre-amp with pure silver leads, which I bought a long time ago, and which are no longer made.  Silver gets a bit expensive over longer runs.

Can anyone recommend XLR leads they think are particularly suitable?  As so often, there is a lot of conflicting information on the internet: some say as long as the cable is competently made, all is well; others that only a cable made of unobtainium isolated with unicorn hair will lead to audio nirvana.

[kernelbob]

It's likely that responses will run the gamut from "it doesn't matter" to "brand X is the only one to use".  In my experience, the best test is to insert a cable in your system and use it for at least a solid month or longer before forming an opinion.  That will give it time to settle into your system.  It will also give you time get used to the new "normal" of your system's sound.  Some vendors provide longer trial periods...  90 days is a good sign.

First impressions are not to be trusted.  Any change may initially perceived as an improvement.  e.g. "I hear more detail in the high end".  Similarly, new cables may sound rolled off in the bass, treble, or both.  Burning in the cable by the vendor cannot be relied upon to allow a short evaluation.

Once the cables have settled into your system, make a point to not move them... at all.  After you've become accustomed to your system's changed sound, you should be able to hear the difference in the sound after even small disturbances (at least I do in my system).

[JLM]

Most recording studios use Mogami and don't worry about break-in or moving cables.  Mogami is middle of the road stuff, but well known.  The professionals worry more about how robustly the cable is made, especially the connectors.  Worry more about how the sending/receiving gear is made in regards to balanced design.  Only audiophiles think about silver versus copper and similar nonsense.  Moving to balanced design of gear/XLR is a move to the professional (big) leagues and a move away from fussing over minutia.

[Early B.]

You're considering spending thousands of dollars on a pair of 7B3's, so why hook them up with cheap cables??? Recording studios and road crews aren't audiophiles, so their gear and needs are quite different. Buy the quality of cables commensurate with your gear.   

[paleo12]

It's likely that responses will run the gamut from "it doesn't matter" to "brand X is the only one to use".  In my experience, the best test is to insert a cable in your system and use it for at least a solid month or longer before forming an opinion.  That will give it time to settle into your system.  It will also give you time get used to the new "normal" of your system's sound.  Some vendors provide longer trial periods...  90 days is a good sign.

First impressions are not to be trusted.  Any change may initially perceived as an improvement.  e.g. "I hear more detail in the high end".  Similarly, new cables may sound rolled off in the bass, treble, or both.  Burning in the cable by the vendor cannot be relied upon to allow a short evaluation.

Once the cables have settled into your system, make a point to not move them... at all.  After you've become accustomed to your system's changed sound, you should be able to hear the difference in the sound after even small disturbances (at least I do in my system).

Thanks for your thoughtful advice.  I am trying to gather a bit of advice from people who have connected the specific amps I am thinking of using XLR cables they felt happy with.  I'm not sure how easy it would be to borrow 3m XLRs here in the UK.

[paleo12]

Most recording studios use Mogami and don't worry about break-in or moving cables.  Mogami is middle of the road stuff, but well known.  The professionals worry more about how robustly the cable is made, especially the connectors.  Worry more about how the sending/receiving gear is made in regards to balanced design.  Only audiophiles think about silver versus copper and similar nonsense.  Moving to balanced design of gear/XLR is a move to the professional (big) leagues and a move away from fussing over minutia.

Thanks.  There is a lot I don't know about cables, but I am under the impression that not all cables sound the same. I have come across the idea that the metal cables are made of might make a difference.  I'm not sure what the precise definition of "audiophile" is but I may well have tendencies in that direction, which is why I joined this (audiophile?) forum to seek advice.

[paleo12]

You're considering spending thousands of dollars on a pair of 7B3's, so why hook them up with cheap cables??? Recording studios and road crews aren't audiophiles, so their gear and needs are quite different. Buy the quality of cables commensurate with your gear.   

Indeed, that is my aim.  I am doing a bit of preliminary looking about for cables that would constitute a reasonable return for the money spent.  The most expensive interconnect I found at my hi-fi dealer costs £21,000 for 1 meter.  Amazon will sell an interconnect for a couple of pounds.  I'm aiming somehwere in between, and closer to the latter than the former.  To me a price between £500 and £1000 for a 3 meter pair would seem worth looking into.  The Brystons here cost about £13,500 a pair.

[JLM]

You're listening to material recorded by studio professionals, so why try to go above and beyond what they use?

The essence of XLR cables and balanced design is in the design itself.  If you want to satisfy a urge to have the best, go ahead and spend more but it's not necessary.  As James Tanner explained in a 2004 posting here:

Hi Hifiet,

Good question (what are the advantages of balanced design?) and one I get asked at least once a day.

Point 1- Cables in an audio system are antennas to the outside world.

Point 2- The advantage of balanced lines in audio systems has to do with "COMMON MODE NOISE REJECTION" Balanced lines have 3 conductors (instead of the 2 in single ended cables, ground and positive - popular name RCA). With Balanced lines there is a Ground a Neutral and Positive so any electrical magnetic energy stricking the interconnect cable (and there is plenty of it out there) gets shunted to ground rather than allowed to enter the audio system through the ground on the 2 wire RCA system.

Point 3 - the down side of balanced lines is you need a sending amplifier
(at the source) and a recieving amplifier at the input. So you have two more amplifier stages in balanced circuits than you have with single-ended circuits like RCA cables There are cheap ways to provide balanced circuits, like transformers and IC chips - Bryston uses fully discrete balanced circuits so the quality of the two amplifier circuits are state of the art.

So after all this I guess my advice is to always use balanced circuits when you have long lengths of interconnect - like from the preamp to the amp, because the longer the length the more antenna. Balanced lines are less likely to provide benifits in short lenghts like from a source component to a preamplifer ( 1 Meter or so) and it could be argued that there is a down side with short lengths because of the 2 additional amplifier stages required.

Hope this helps. I also have a more detailed answer in the Newsletters on the Bryston website.

james

[Early B.]

Indeed, that is my aim.  I am doing a bit of preliminary looking about for cables that would constitute a reasonable return for the money spent.  The most expensive interconnect I found at my hi-fi dealer costs £21,000 for 1 meter.  Amazon will sell an interconnect for a couple of pounds.  I'm aiming somehwere in between, and closer to the latter than the former.  To me a price between £500 and £1000 for a 3 meter pair would seem worth looking into.  The Brystons here cost about £13,500 a pair.

To get the most for your money, look for someone who makes high-quality cables on the side or make them yourself. Another option is to buy the materials and have someone assemble them for you. In fact, talk to Elon here on audiocircle. With your budget, you can build a nice pair of 3-meter, pure silver cables with high-quality connectors.

I recently went through what you're talking about. I started off with "cheap" XLRs between my monos and preamp. Then when I upgraded, the improvement in sound far exceeded my expectations. Eventually, I replaced those XLRs with Hapa Audio cables and they took the sound to another level. 

Oh, one more thing -- you're definitely an audiophile if you're considering 7B3's and talking to strangers on an audio forum about which cables to purchase.   

[djpk]

I've been buying my XLR cables from Pro Audio LA for a few years. I don't know that they "sound" any better than any other cables, but they have a good selection to choose from at various price points. I have six 2-channel systems at my residence including a Bryston BP-26 preamp in one of the systems and I'm very happy with Pro Audio LA. I've also used XLR cables from Markertek and Signal Cable and they are fine as well. You may want to take a look at AntiCables. I've been happy with their RCA and speaker cables.

[I.Greyhound Fan]

I use Belden 8402 XLR's.  They bested my Cardas Parsec's and AQ Columbia 72v DBS XLRS both of which cost around $400.  They are nothing special to look at but they have a nice neutral sound with a black background, good detail and little in the way of sibilance.

https://btpa.com/MIC-XLR/Standard/IC8402XLR-XX.html

They ship world wide.

[paleo12]

You're listening to material recorded by studio professionals, so why try to go above and beyond what they use?

The essence of XLR cables and balanced design is in the design itself.  If you want to satisfy a urge to have the best, go ahead and spend more but it's not necessary.  As James Tanner explained in a 2004 posting here:

Hi Hifiet,

Good question (what are the advantages of balanced design?) and one I get asked at least once a day.

Point 1- Cables in an audio system are antennas to the outside world.

Point 2- The advantage of balanced lines in audio systems has to do with "COMMON MODE NOISE REJECTION" Balanced lines have 3 conductors (instead of the 2 in single ended cables, ground and positive - popular name RCA). With Balanced lines there is a Ground a Neutral and Positive so any electrical magnetic energy stricking the interconnect cable (and there is plenty of it out there) gets shunted to ground rather than allowed to enter the audio system through the ground on the 2 wire RCA system.

Point 3 - the down side of balanced lines is you need a sending amplifier
(at the source) and a recieving amplifier at the input. So you have two more amplifier stages in balanced circuits than you have with single-ended circuits like RCA cables There are cheap ways to provide balanced circuits, like transformers and IC chips - Bryston uses fully discrete balanced circuits so the quality of the two amplifier circuits are state of the art.

So after all this I guess my advice is to always use balanced circuits when you have long lengths of interconnect - like from the preamp to the amp, because the longer the length the more antenna. Balanced lines are less likely to provide benifits in short lenghts like from a source component to a preamplifer ( 1 Meter or so) and it could be argued that there is a down side with short lengths because of the 2 additional amplifier stages required.

Hope this helps. I also have a more detailed answer in the Newsletters on the Bryston website.

james

Well, it is partly ignorance and wishful thinking on my part, and partly experience.  Ignorance in that I am not a techie, and don't understand the many variables in cable design.  Why does the Oydaide Focus XLR connector have 3 or 4 different metals?  I just don't know.  Is it to create expensive audio jewellery or does it make a useful difference?  Wishful thinking in that I hope that maybe in some cases, there may be a positive correlation between price and quality and I might find a sensibly priced cable that makes a difference.  I am not altogether convinced that in the long process between the source (guy with guitar in studio say) and my speakers, the overiding limitation is the quality of the cables used in the studio and that no cable further up the chain can make a positive difference.  I think this because I replaced an XLR cable connecting my CD player to my pre-amp earlier this year with another XLR cable, and heard an increase in sound quality.

I appreciate your point about the intrinsic quality of XLR cables (the noise rejection) being the same for all competently made cables, but I am not sure that this is the only determinant of  sound quality.

[paleo12]

To get the most for your money, look for someone who makes high-quality cables on the side or make them yourself. Another option is to buy the materials and have someone assemble them for you. In fact, talk to Elon here on audiocircle. With your budget, you can build a nice pair of 3-meter, pure silver cables with high-quality connectors.

I recently went through what you're talking about. I started off with "cheap" XLRs between my monos and preamp. Then when I upgraded, the improvement in sound far exceeded my expectations. Eventually, I replaced those XLRs with Hapa Audio cables and they took the sound to another level. 

Oh, one more thing -- you're definitely an audiophile if you're considering 7B3's and talking to strangers on an audio forum about which cables to purchase.   

Thanks, that's very useful.  I had a chat with the guy who made my 1 meter silver XLR interconnects here in the UK.  He said he could not make cables longer than 2 meters as he could not pull the cables through the sleeve.  I might well be able to find sleeved cables, and I have a techie friend who might be willing to attach the connectors.  I'll have a look at Hapa.

[paleo12]

I've been buying my XLR cables from Pro Audio LA for a few years. I don't know that they "sound" any better than any other cables, but they have a good selection to choose from at various price points. I have six 2-channel systems at my residence including a Bryston BP-26 preamp in one of the systems and I'm very happy with Pro Audio LA. I've also used XLR cables from Markertek and Signal Cable and they are fine as well. You may want to take a look at AntiCables. I've been happy with their RCA and speaker cables.

Thanks for that; will have a look.

[paleo12]

I use Belden 8402 XLR's.  They bested my Cardas Parsec's and AQ Columbia 72v DBS XLRS both of which cost around $400.  They are nothing special to look at but they have a nice neutral sound with a black background, good detail and little in the way of sibilance.

https://btpa.com/MIC-XLR/Standard/IC8402XLR-XX.html

They ship world wide.

Thanks; I'll have a look.

[Big Red Machine]

Your price range is definitely not in the "unicorn hair" range. More like "monkey butt hair".

I prefer gold wire like Gabriel Gold, Jade, or Stealth PGS because they are full bodied and smooth. How about Dave's Zenwave cables here? IMO, round copper wire by 10 manufacturers is seldom going to sound different from one another because it's round copper wire. But since you are working your way up, any decent round copper wire with good construction might be the place to start. Don't blow your budget for sure. Worry about tweaking after everything is broken in. But stay away from the cheapo stuff since you are investing heavily in good gear. And look for used. I rarely, if ever, buy new cables.

Unfortunately companies like Audioquest, Synergistic Research, Cardas, MIT, and Transparent (and more like them) mass market gizmos and fancy looking cables that are overpriced and sometimes just plain lousy.

I think Morrow makes a great cable for the money (MA4 or 5's range), Kubala Sosna are too expensive, used Purist Audio maybe. You can sort by XLR on US AudioMart or the UK version of it.

[dwmaggie]

I started out with Monoprice XLRs, fairly well made, for the price decent quality and sound.  Tried a couple of Morrow M4 and M5 cables, well made but 8 or 9 levels of sound quality, the more you spend, the better the sound.  Lately, I have been replacing all my XLRs with Audio Envy, price is affordable, sound quality was way above the others.  I can't afford Ferrari priced, jewel like cables.  Audio Envy seems to work best for me.  Sounds like we need the old Sears and Wards catalogue descriptors, Good, Better, Best.

[paleo12]

Your price range is definitely not in the "unicorn hair" range. More like "monkey butt hair".

I prefer gold wire like Gabriel Gold, Jade, or Stealth PGS because they are full bodied and smooth. How about Dave's Zenwave cables here? IMO, round copper wire by 10 manufacturers is seldom going to sound different from one another because it's round copper wire. But since you are working your way up, any decent round copper wire with good construction might be the place to start. Don't blow your budget for sure. Worry about tweaking after everything is broken in. But stay away from the cheapo stuff since you are investing heavily in good gear. And look for used. I rarely, if ever, buy new cables.

Unfortunately companies like Audioquest, Synergistic Research, Cardas, MIT, and Transparent (and more like them) mass market gizmos and fancy looking cables that are overpriced and sometimes just plain lousy.

I think Morrow makes a great cable for the money (MA4 or 5's range), Kubala Sosna are too expensive, used Purist Audio maybe. You can sort by XLR on US AudioMart or the UK version of it.

Interesting suggestions, thanks.  I did not know gold cables actually are a thing.

[paleo12]

I started out with Monoprice XLRs, fairly well made, for the price decent quality and sound.  Tried a couple of Morrow M4 and M5 cables, well made but 8 or 9 levels of sound quality, the more you spend, the better the sound.  Lately, I have been replacing all my XLRs with Audio Envy, price is affordable, sound quality was way above the others.  I can't afford Ferrari priced, jewel like cables.  Audio Envy seems to work best for me.  Sounds like we need the old Sears and Wards catalogue descriptors, Good, Better, Best.

I had a look at Audio Envy and they seem quite affordable.  I'm a bit reluctant to order directly from the USA but they might be an option.

[R. Daneel]

Choose something with minimal capacitance.

A thing to keep in mind is that there are two basic variants of balanced cables - twisted pair (2-conductor cable) and star-qiad (4-conductor cable). The former is typically less immune to interference but generally has lower capacitance. It is the opposite for the latter.

In a typical HI-FI / AV setup, there is really no need to use a star-quad cable. They are also less flexible and therefore more difficult to manage. Star-quad is typically more suited for professional use, live and in a studio, where additional protection against interference typically produced by power lines and lighting systems can add up to audible noise with long cable runs. That's probably not you so I'd use a high-quality twisted pair variant.

In no particular order, some examples of these are:

Van Damme Tour Grade Classic XKE Microphone cable - extremely flexible and generally an excellent value at 2€/meter

Mogami W2549 - lowest capacitance of any balanced cables that I know of but less flexible than the Van Damme, shielding effectiveness is comparable to the Van Damme and it is a good value at 4€/meter

Belden 1800F - somewhat stiff but has a very good performance overally, also suitable for AES/EBU digital standard because of it's 110 Ohm chracterstic impedance, difficult to obtain in my area

You will not go wrong with any of these. Remember that one of the benefits of having separate mono block amplifiers is to have a longer run of cable between the preamp and the power amp so that the speaker cable can be as short as possible as this is where capacitance becomes less important and resistance becomes more important. Shorter cable means lower resistance.

There are no secrets here. Electricity is something that we do know a great deal about and have known it for many years so you need to be as sensible as possible when choosing cables.

This, however, does not mean I am against all and every commercial cable out there. I am only recommending what I am familiar with. For example, QED and Atlas make some nice-looking cables and the manufacturers do specify some of their electrical and mechanical characteristics so if you're into that sort of a thing, by all means. But they will cost more.

Hope this helps.

Cheers - Antun