[Bendingwave]

Thank you, I accept your apology, and although I do not think my questions are nearly as aggressive as the videos posted at youtube for the whole world to see--nonetheless we are all human and I'm sure there are better ways to say things, myself included.

If I do not try to be particularly objective, I would say that Magnepan is a very nice company, that is remarkably good to its customers both in pricing and service. The internet is full of testimonies of Maggies going back to Minnesota after decades of use and being serviced for very reasonable fees. There is a huge forum on another site where the users have been carrying out modifications since before some of us were born. Their attitude as well as their work deserves to be respected, and in my opinion, alterations of their products should be properly documented.

If I try to be more objective, I think it is important not to encourage people to get in over their heads. If Maggies were easy to come by, or easy to service, the risk would be lessened. But the situation is that people have to wait for months just to receive a new pair. I can only imagine the reaction at Maggie central when someone needs to have their speakers serviced due to their DIY attempt while others are patiently waiting for months to receive a new one. That would be reason enough for me not to even think about doing such a thing.

Some see it differently, and are willing to try. The video showing how the recommended modification was actually performed by the person recommending it would only help the people that are already paying GR Research $$ for the kit, and I do not see a good reason for the reluctance to help those people. It would help the community at large as well, I'm sure.

Being aggressive is "TELLING" someone what they should do instead of "ASKING". 

[westly197]

I was checking my LRS and found a few things that were better than expected. First the metal plate on the panel is non-magnetic, I’m  thinking it’s Aluminum. The connectors are also non-magnetic, only the set screws are magnetic, so perhaps Magnepan has changed the materials they are using. The jumpers however are still steel, so replacing them is a good idea. The kit will not fit without some trimming, but may be very minor, but would still likely void warranties. I ordered the kit and will further evaluate when the parts come. I bought my near new LRS used, so not sure I have a warranty anyway, has anyone had experience with Magnepan and their warranty policy? I believe mine are less than a year old and were purchased from a dealer, but I got no receipt or proof of purchase from the original owner so I’m likely without warranty anyway. I saved about $250 off what I would have paid new, so that will pay for the upgrade.

[Danny Richie]

As for this kit, everything that is needed comes with the kit.

Crossover assembly is the easiest part of the kit. It only has three parts. One is in the woofer circuit and two in the tweeter circuit. So shooting a video showing how to twist together two parts used in the tweeter circuit is really not necessary.

This one should all fit inside the speaker.

We get a lot of feedback from our customers that buy this kit. So far, no one has mentioned not being able to figure out the crossover assembly.

We are here and available anytime someone has one of our kits and has additional questions. Walking a customer through the steps of assembly is not a problem.

[westly197]

I installed this kit last weekend and wow, what a difference! I will admit I lost a little of that Maggie sound, the vocals are not pushed up like before, but are now balanced and accurate. The detail is massively improved, depth and imaging are much better, I just didn’t expect the improvement to be this big, the performances of good recordings are so much more believable. I’ve also ordered Magna-risers, but they are many months out. It was a challenge to make the kit fit and I did acquire my LRS used, so warranty was not an issue. I could not make the Sonicap fit, so if you can’t hide it make it the showpiece!


 


Removed This: The set screws and nuts on the connectors are ferris metal as is the jumper and fuse holder.







And made this fit: Ideally inductors should be at a 90 to each other, but since they would not fit that way, I moved them as far apart as possible.



The paint is flat black, but had not dried yet in the photo. I had to remove the zip ties of the large inductor, I used glue to assure it doesn’t come loose.







I plan to clean up my schematic to show the stock wire colors and connections, but have not had the time yet… more to come.



There are two rows of staples at the bottom, I pried them out one at a time with this modified flathead screwdriver.



I pried up the trim piece on one side only, carefully pulling through the first two finish nails only. I pried the finish nails once the trim was lifted, carefully with needle nose pliers, wiggling it first to loosen.



The back cover is made from ABS Plastic I got from Amazon, the specific item was selected because it was same day delivery, got it 3 hours after ordered! I only used part of 1 sheet of the 6 included, $4 per sheet.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08R9W4NZW?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

[fre11111]

Goodjob🙂👍

[Danny Richie]

Wow, nice work. Nice touch on making the Sonicap a show piece too.

[corndog71]

Nice job!

Others might want to orient the inductors at 90°.  I’ve known this for a while but this video shows what happens.

https://youtu.be/N5U5fp1zlsk

[emailtim]

Nice mod. 

What did you use to "pot" the inductor coils ?

[westly197]

Corndog71, yeah I know about the 90 degree thing and I mentioned it in my post, but the speaker is 1 inch thick, so the space is about an 8th less than an inch. That’s why I could not fit the large inductor without removing the zip tie, the zip tie was too thick. Putting the small inductor at a 90 would mean it too would extend out more than the cap does, so that’s why I just separated them as far apart as possible, as a next best solution that fits. I would also point out a small influence on this speaker should not matter, remember the tweeter film is attached to the same piece of Mylar as the woofer traces. If I was going to use an external box I’d upgrade to foil inductors and copper caps, but didn’t want to go there. This is a huge improvement and I feel was a better result then I could have gotten just copying the original design of the crossover. I feel Magnepan designed it to fit in the space, be low cost, and leave a lot on the table to differentiate it from higher models. Danny’s design brings a whole lot of improvement in a simple and relatively small size taking the LRS up several levels.

Emailtim, I used hi temp adhesive gluesticks to adhere them in. I’ve used it in automotive speaker installs in the past and it held well for many years without issue. I did make an error my first round and had to remove some of it to correct, so it can be removed with patience and time if needed. I also imbedded friction tape over connections which helps you pull it apart if required while also making sure it’s protected.

I still plan to write up the wiring, between the left and right being mirror images and the panel connections being on the front while the crossover being on the back it’s easy to cross something.

[Merckx1]

Westly! Nice primer on this mod!
If you are still around, or anyone with experience, what feedback can anyone provide? Is anyone here still preferring this mod? Did anyone need to add resistors to pad the tweeter? If one likes the "Maggie Sound", what is the best way to preserve it while exploring the enhanced resolution that better crossover parts can provide?

FWIW, I recently tried upgrading the speaker connections to Rhodium plated binding posts on my LRS and they added a significant bump in resolution. I ended up removing them. It was too much for my ears.

Thanks!
Mike

[Hobbsmeerkat]

We haven't gotten any negative feedback about the LRS kit needing a resistor, that has only been a complaint for the larger 1.7(i) from maybe 2-3 people who added a 1ohm resistor to the tweeter circuit, similar to what we did on the newer LRS "plus" kit, and it's possible to add them to the standard LRS kit as well.

If you like the "Maggie sound" and just want to upgrade parts quality, I would recommend replacing the tiny iron-core with a good quality air-core of at least 16 gauge (or 14 gauge if it will fit to keep the DCR value low)
Then for the 110uF Bundle, I would replace the the cheap cap bundle with a pair of 56uF poly caps wired in parallel which will get you to 112uF, which is still within typical +/-5% spec, and prevents a phase shift within the audible range. You could also add a 0.1uF cap as a bypass to further improve clarity, or tune the sound to taste if you go with a copper foil bypass.

Next, I would get rid of the stock input plate/terminal as it's loaded with steel/ferrous materials, using better quality binding posts, and put the fuse into a better quality mount, hopefully made from brass.

Lastly, I would consider replacing the wire with better quality alternatives, and solder the connections to the driver terminals.
I would personally avoid anything "silver plated" as we find it tends to push the treble "forward" compared to a copper-only wire.

Hopefully that gives you some ideas to consider.

[wgallupe]

We haven't gotten any negative feedback about the LRS kit needing a resistor, that has only been a complaint for the larger 1.7(i) from maybe 2-3 people who added a 1ohm resistor to the tweeter circuit, similar to what we did on the newer LRS "plus" kit, and it's possible to add them to the standard LRS kit as well.

If you like the "Maggie sound" and just want to upgrade parts quality, I would recommend replacing the tiny iron-core with a good quality air-core of at least 16 gauge (or 14 gauge if it will fit to keep the DCR value low)
Then for the 110uF Bundle, I would replace the the cheap cap bundle with a pair of 56uF poly caps wired in parallel which will get you to 112uF, which is still within typical +/-5% spec, and prevents a phase shift within the audible range. You could also add a 0.1uF cap as a bypass to further improve clarity, or tune the sound to taste if you go with a copper foil bypass.

Next, I would get rid of the stock input plate/terminal as it's loaded with steel/ferrous materials, using better quality binding posts, and put the fuse into a better quality mount, hopefully made from brass.

Lastly, I would consider replacing the wire with better quality alternatives, and solder the connections to the driver terminals.
I would personally avoid anything "silver plated" as we find it tends to push the treble "forward" compared to a copper-only wire.

Hopefully that gives you some ideas to consider.

Hi, Been following this thread...

Wondering what you mean by 'prevents a phase shift within the audible range'? I ask because there are not many 56uF caps available. Would it be a problem to use bundles like  50/50/10uF or 33/33/33/10uF as examples? These seem to be more readily available. Thanks in advance.

[Tyson]

Hi, Been following this thread...

Wondering what you mean by 'prevents a phase shift within the audible range'? I ask because there are not many 56uF caps available. Would it be a problem to use bundles like  50/50/10uF or 33/33/33/10uF as examples? These seem to be more readily available. Thanks in advance.

Caps should be of equal value if you parallel them.  In this case, 2 caps of 27uf gets you to 54uf which is close enough.

[Hobbsmeerkat]

Hi, Been following this thread...

Wondering what you mean by 'prevents a phase shift within the audible range'? I ask because there are not many 56uF caps available. Would it be a problem to use bundles like  50/50/10uF or 33/33/33/10uF as examples? These seem to be more readily available. Thanks in advance.

Caps of different values (and types) discharge at different rates, and using a 10uF poly cap in parallel with with a 100uF electrolytic cap, like Magnepan uses, will cause a phase shift which is essentially a smearing of the signal as the caps are discharging the same signal at different rates. Swapping the 100uF electrolytic caps for a 100uF poly cap would help as they're much faster than the electrolytic cap, but they're often quite large and would push against the sock, so using multiple polycaps in parallel would work to keep the height limited.

So you want to keep any caps wired in parallel as similar of a value as possible, as Tyson noted, you could wire 4x 27uF caps in parallel to get 108uF, which is still within the typical +/- 5% tolerance. some of Magnepan's higher-end models like the 1.7 and 3.7 use multiple polycaps in parallel.

With bypass caps you're essentially pushing the smaller cap to a really small size, (0.1uF or smaller) where the phase shift is going to begin at or above 20KHz.

[wgallupe]

Thanks guys. It makes perfect sense now.

[wgallupe]

Hi again   Now thinking about bypassing, I have a new question. If I want to bypass a bank of four 27uF caps, do I add one 0.10uF cap as a bypass for the whole bank or do I bypass each 27uF cap with a 0.10uF cap? In other words, one bypass cap or four?

[Tyson]

Just one.

[wgallupe]

Thanks Tyson.

[cz_disp]

Sorry to bother you all. I am curious to know, once you remove the fuse holder backplate screws and the plate comes off, the factory crossover is accessible directly under it correct?

So, why would one need to unstaple and remove the sock, remove the trim and so on? 

[Hobbsmeerkat]

Sorry to bother you all. I am curious to know, once you remove the fuse holder backplate screws and the plate comes off, the factory crossover is accessible directly under it correct?

So, why would one need to unstaple and remove the sock, remove the trim and so on? 

Correct, the crossover is directly behind the crossover but the cutout is only ~3x3" (the input plate is 4x4") so you're going to have a really hard tome accessing the components to remove them. The hole is maybe big enough to squeeze one hand into, plus the crossover cavity is much wider than the hole.

You need to un-staple and partly remove the sock/trim so you can access the driver terminals which are on the front of the speaker, and make crossover removal much easier, which you'll never be able to see or reach from the 3" cutout on the back of the speaker.