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I just tested a gentleman's hearing with tone generator, and he couldn't even hear 1kHz tone What frequencies and tones need to be heard to create "soundstage"?https://onlinetonegenerator.com/
Bass plays a major role in soundstage production.
After 25 years in this hobby, I formulated two bold conclusions:1. Nearly all audiophiles have hyper-artificial systems that are “pseudo-musical.” The reference for “real music” is live music. However, we’ve become accustomed to the sound of studio recorded music which is constrained and polite, at best. It’s analogous to the difference between the attending a rock concert vs. watching it on TV. 2. For an improved stereo sound, you need at least four speakers plus multiple subs. Just like an audiophile has separate components to improve the sound quality, you need separate speakers. For two-channel listening, you need two things to replicate real music -- a humungous soundstage and incredible dynamics. Two speakers simply won't get the job done, no matter how high end they are. Look at it this way -- if you go to a small jazz club, it will have at a bunch of speakers from the ceiling to the floor. At home, you're trying to duplicate live music with only two speakers, and often with a pair of puny bookshelf speakers. Not gonna happen. Some speaker designers resort to tricks to re-create ambient sound such as rear firing drivers, supertweeters, open baffle, etc., but all of these attempts are insufficient. Just like HT enthusiasts, many audiophiles have already experienced the benefits of multiple subwoofers. However, the 2-channel guys haven’t yet recognized the value of expanding their main speakers. Audiophiles should learn lessons from HT enthusiasts regarding the use of presence speakers along the front stage. Personally, I use Audiokinesis LCS speakers and they’re a game changer. There's more bass, more dynamics, and a broader sound. Simply amazing. I'd like to see audiophiles experiment with presence speakers to get more ambient sound from their systems. My audiophile buddy recently purchased an inexpensive pair of presence speakers and placed them on the floor alongside his open baffle speakers. It was immediately apparent that the presence speakers significantly improved the sound across the entire spectrum. Literally a night & day difference. Don’t believe me? Just ask the HT crowd.
Also we are talking multi-channel stereo or the use of HT sound codecs?
For me the perfect speaker would be open baffle, with the same radiating pattern to the front and to the back because the back of the driver is a mirror image of the front side of the driver. The mids and tweeters need to both be this way. Then open baffle bass that goes down to 20hz with power. And, since I listen to a lot of live orchestral music, it would need to be a line array in order to properly convey the huge halls with massive acoustic space that orchestral music takes place in.
Presence speakers are fairly easy to implement, most of us is have enough spare equipment lying around to try it. LeJeune has some specific ideas on how to do it, more involved than tipping up a spare set of bookshelves in the corner.
I guess I should have asked for some basic guidance before throwing a couple of speakers in the corner. That said, what I did hear is interesting and pleasing. I'm pretty insensitive to most tweaks so my impressions may not be the most informative. I can't explain exactly what I heard with the second set of speakers on, but what I sensed was a depth, particularly vocals. The closest I can describe it is something along the lines of reverb. It was somewhat difficult for me to really attribute the difference to the presence speakers as turning them on/off resulted in ~ +/- 1.5 dB difference that may have contributed to what I was hearing.I got the "forbidden post" message last night when trying to up load pics of the set up. I'll try editing this post with images.Set up:Mains Spatial M4 Sapphires (4 ohm)
FWIW, YMMV, IMO, etc. Late Ceiling Splash is for monopole speakers, not dipole/bipole speakers.
Similar to AllanS's experience, both of my audiophile buddies have full dipole setups with speakers positioned out in the room and have benefitted from presence speakers.
I think the integration of LCS speakers should be physically as close to the main speaker as possible.
In your opinion are presence speakers and LCS the same thing?
Yes. I'm not using "late ceiling splash (LCS)" because that's a term Audiokinesis coined, I believe, and their version is more sophisticated, as mentioned earlier. In the HT world, presence speakers supplement the front speakers with ambient effects, and they're typically installed on the front wall, not lying on the floor as we're describing here. I don't know what to call these speakers -- "ambient floor monitors???"
Where are the speakers placed in your audiophile buddies systems?
