[Norman Tracy]

If you are like me we tend to think of High-End HiFi as a post-WWII thing that really gained steam and exponentially increasing prices in the past 25 years. Then I saw this article in the current issue of PS Audio's online mag Copper https://www.psaudio.com/copper/article/vertical-integration/.

Specifically this Victrola ad from 1913.



Notice the 1913 price range "$10 - $500". In 2021 US$ that is $269 to $13,478(!). Our great-great-grandparents were willing to spend some serious coin on their tunes just as we are. Every generation has its music lovers, I find comfort in that fact about the human race.

Also note the cost of needles to play your 78s, "steel 5 cents per 100, fiber 50 cents per 100 (can be repointed and used eight times". Before the advent of diamond tipped stylus the careful user replaced the steel needle every time you played a record. Your Victrola featured a cup near the tonearm to hold a supply of needles for that purpose.  Failing use a fresh needle and your records wore out quickly as the steel needle dulled and chiseled away the grove. The 'fiber' option was actually harvested cactus thorns of the correct size that were much more gentle on your records. Of course they wore out faster than steel but a gentleman could impress the ladies with his blade skills using his pen knife to sharpen the needle before playing each record. All to get about 3 to 3 1/2 minutes of music per 78 side.

[aldcoll]

Just think if you could have had the record clamp business in 1913?  And why not be there with a better spring and crank handle.  Even go so far as different materials based on you music?

Sorry I got kinda wound up after reading the add.

Alan

[SET Man]

Hey!

    I have a Victor Type E outside horn talking machine. Mine still have the original paper sticker on the bottom show that it was made in 1902 and cost $30. This model was near the bottom of the line back then. And yes, just like today's audio, if you want deeper bass you will have to buy bigger machine with a bigger horn. "Victrola" were name given to the inside horn machine introduced around 1906 I think. One of the reason Victrola became popular and pretty much faded out the outside horn machines because they look more like a beautiful furniture. Most women hate the look of the Victor erected outside horns machine. So, yes the "WAF" have been around since the dawn of home audio.

    I love my Type E. It is a beauty. And it is a hoot to listen to those old "acoustical recording" of which the actual voice of the singer and the sound of the instruments directly cut the wax! Talk about ultimate direct-to-disc. It always make me smile every time I crank it up and put on discs with sound recorded over 100 years ago. Even today I'm still amazed that it actually works! My machine sit next to the 1971-2 Transcriptor Hydraulic Reference turntable, which operate on the same principle of needle wiggling in a groove!

    Anyway, yes, you do replace the needle after each play. Today you can still buy new steel needles to play those old acoustical 78rpm discs, around $5-10 for 100 needles. And there are many type of needles also, "Soft Tone" "Medium Tone" and "Full Tone" and also "Fiber" ... I tried the fiber by using bamboo toothpick that I sharpened it with X-acto knife and it work with very soft tone with rolled off high frequency. 

   If anyone have a chance to hear one, a real one not a reproduction machine from India,  and assuming the reproducer "aka soundbox" is in good shape go for it. It is fun. Don't expect the sound to be anything like we have today. But even that being said, there's something very special about these old acoustical recorded 78rpm discs play back on acoustical machines. Must of have been like magic when people heard it for the first time back then.

Buddy
   

[Norman Tracy]

... I have a Victor Type E outside horn talking machine. ..... next to the 1971-2 Transcriptor Hydraulic Reference turntable, which operate on the same principle of needle wiggling in a groove!...

 

Buddy a.k.a. Set Man is awarded my Maximum Respect Award May 25, 2021 in honor of his work maintaining these two important artifacts for humanity.

The Transcriptor Hydraulic Reference turntable rose to fame outside of HiFi first for its London Design Centre award and then forever immortalized thanks to its walk on part in the classic movie A Clockwork Orange.



On display MMO in 1969.



And she's ready for her closeup.



Insert smiling green with envy emoji here 

[SET Man]

Buddy a.k.a. Set Man is awarded my Maximum Respect Award May 25, 2021 in honor of his work maintaining these two important artifacts for humanity.
.....

Hey!



     Thank you Norman for the award. And now I want to thanks.... just kidding A snapshot of those two today. 

     I'm a bit of a history buff. And when I got interested in audio in my early teens, I've always been fascinated by how people listen to music in the past. There used to be a store dealing with vintage and antique audios and TVs here in NYC. I remembered walking around looking around, the store owner was very nice and just let me look at thing even though I was young and couldn't afford those stuffs. Sadly the store is long gone but it left a great impression on me.
   
    Anyway, I bought my Victor back in around 2006, and in 2008 after 100+ years one of the spring broke so I got it cleaned and replaced both springs. Now it should work for another 100 years. It is indeed a historical "audio" artifact and I do play it sometime, also it is a good workout. Crazy how Caruso belting out opera arias sounds on this old machine! You can still find these old outside horn machines come up for sale, but finding one in original good to mint condition can be hard. But if you just want to experience those old acoustical recording 78s play back the way it was intended, you can look for Victrola machine which are cheaper, although there are a few exceptions. Since some Victrola are big, sometime you can find one locally. There are also a portable one like the Victrola VV-50 from the '20s which is very pretty. Well, if people can spent $2000+ for a pair of 1M cable I can't see why they can't afford one of these old machine, if you're into this of course.

    As for the Transcriptor Hydraulic Reference turntable. I've known about this for years and always admire the look and design. Yes, I've seen it at MoMA many times when it was out on display. It is a beauty, an audio's "Objet d'art" Back in 2011 one came up for sale close enough for me to pick it up. At first I bought it for the look but it turned out to sound better than I expected, so it is now in my system. Mine have the design award stick on the acrylic dust cover so it is dated to 1971-72 before JA Michell took over the manufacturing of these. I might get a new turntable someday, but I'm definitely keeping this one.

    By the way, I also have a 1935 Philco 84B Cathedral radio that still works and yes I sometime listen to the news, like when I'm cleaning my room.

Buddy