New Poster, Long Time Lurker!

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Chewbacca

New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« on: 2 Apr 2021, 04:25 pm »
Hello All!

As my title suggests this is my first post, but I've lurked around AudioCirlcle since about 2012. I grew up in a family that was huge into music, my dad having as many speakers as possible in the living room blasting Pink Floyd for the most of my childhood. When I moved out on my own in 2011 I really wanted to have a nice stereo system. I didn't even know the difference or why someone would want a 2 channel system compared to a "as much sound as you can have" system like my dad. This quickly changed when I picked up one of my first piece of audio equipment (I believe an Emotiva CD player). I knew I was possibly in for a treat when I saw this gentleman's house was the largest I have ever been in. He brought me down into his listening room, which was purpose built, and after the visit once I looked up the price of some of his equipment, and we're talking a system that's WELL into the 6 figures. I had the pleasure of listening for about an hour. I was simply awestruck. I couldn't comprehend what I was hearing. Every instrument had their own complete space. Depth well into 8' and imaging 2' or so left and right of the speakers. The grain in the voices, the friction of strings as the bow runs against them. The separation of the bass, and tightness of it. I was simply in awe... I've been chasing this sound ever since.

Being a 30 year old making OKAY money, my system has been quite limited by my budget. I have done a lot of research on brands that give the best bang for the buck... DODD Audio (RIP Gary, your presence is missed), Odyssey Audio (Klaus, you're the man!), Ascend Acoustics (Dave F, you have helped me a lot in my search for good sound), Eastern Electric (Alex Yeung, sad to see you leave the audio industry), Rythmik Audio, Tekton Design, and now of course... I truly feel my next step is the include Danny and GR Research in getting my system to the next step. In fact, I believe this has been LONG overdue.

Unfortunately I am currently limited to a CRAP room. The system is not perfectly placed symmetrically left and right in the room, and since I took down a wall in the living room the ceiling is of different heights too. I have no room treatments, which I know will be a huge help going forward... any suggestions of what would be the most efficient would be well appreciated! The speakers are about 8"-6" apart, 2'-6" off of the back wall, and about 9' from the listening position. I understand going open baffle I would need to push the speakers out about 3' from the back wall, which is of little issue. I just cannot go much further than that.



I think the NX-Oticas would be a wonderful add to my system, and could possibly be the end all speakers for me. I have also been tossing around the idea of the NX-Studio speakers... but I think this would almost be a side step to the Ascend Sierra-2's that are currently in my system. Honestly these speakers truly make magic. But unfortunately I have had issues in the past with pushing them beyond their limits even with the Odyssey monoblocks. So a more efficient speaker is a must as well. If I did go the route of the Oticas, I would most likely get (2) dual 12" open baffle servos about a year or two after the speakers. In the meantime, keep the F15HP which has proven PHENOMINAL in it's own right.

Any suggestions on routes to go, reasons to try the Studios, etc. would be greatly appreciated! This may be a slightly slower process due to some health issues as of late, but I would expect to buy a kit in 2021!

Thanks for the time all!

RonP

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #1 on: 2 Apr 2021, 08:24 pm »
Hello All!

As my title suggests this is my first post, but I've lurked around AudioCirlcle since about 2012.


Welcome!

I grew up in a family that was huge into music, my dad having as many speakers as possible in the living room blasting Pink Floyd for the most of my childhood.

Pink Floyd you say? Your dad sounds like a good man with good taste in music.  :thumb:

mkrawcz

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #2 on: 2 Apr 2021, 11:58 pm »
Welcome! Unless you have the space to move the speakers out away from the front wall 3-4 feet, you really cannot go with open baffles. This is where the NX-Studios come in. Your room is perfect for them. They are the best 2 way loudspeaker in the world at any price IMO and I think you would find them to be a significant upgrade to your current monitors.

Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #3 on: 3 Apr 2021, 12:58 am »
Welcome!

Thank you!

Pink Floyd you say? Your dad sounds like a good man with good taste in music.  :thumb:

Indeed! I lucked out on having parents of awesome taste in music. My Dad saw Pink Floyd 4 times. I can only hope that Gilmour does another tour!

Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #4 on: 3 Apr 2021, 01:06 am »
Welcome! Unless you have the space to move the speakers out away from the front wall 3-4 feet, you really cannot go with open baffles. This is where the NX-Studios come in. Your room is perfect for them. They are the best 2 way loudspeaker in the world at any price IMO and I think you would find them to be a significant upgrade to your current monitors.

You're most likely correct in saying the NX-Monitors would be best suited for the room. Especially since I do have a boxed sub currently, that will mesh nicely with the boxed woofer of the studio. I would be able to get the speakers out 3' (front face of the speaker) off the back wall, maybe a bit more... That's why I almost wanted to just make the jump to the Oticas. I foresee me staying in this house for maybe another 4-5 years, and my next I'm going to make sure has a dedicated space. I've always been a "if you can take it to 11, take it to 11" kinda guy. So once I move I know the Oticas will be in a sufficient space. But until then; would you believe the studios to actually do better in the room compared to the Oticas? Or just dollar per dollar, a much better bang?

Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #5 on: 3 Apr 2021, 01:20 am »
Here's a fisheye of the room to give a better idea of what I'm working with. Again speakers 8'6" apart, 2'6" from back wall (can move out more)... no WAF at the moment... and 9' from listening position. LH speaker 4'-6" from left wall, RH speaker 6'6" from right wall. LH speaker has 7'9" ceiling and RH speaker has 8'6" ceiling. I truly believe a room is about 1/3 of the performance of a system, so I'm extremely limited by that. I also have a huge spike at 50hz in the room, which I'm somewhat able to correct with the PEQ on the back of the sub. But only so much... I am running the speakers in full range, and maybe if I do a 80hz crossover I can eliminate the spike that speakers create in the room, and then fully flatten it out with the PEQ on the sub. Any thought on that? Or possibly the best bang for my buck room treatments? Both?




Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #6 on: 3 Apr 2021, 01:23 am »
Dyslexic with my speakers... RH speaker 4'-6" from right wall, LH speaker 6'6" from left wall. RH speaker has 7'9" ceiling and LH speaker has 8'6" ceiling  :duh:

Sonicjoy

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #7 on: 3 Apr 2021, 03:03 am »
Welcome! You have come to a great place to learn and share your audio adventure.

Can you tell us more about your room? Maybe a couple more photos? Dimensions including height. How much space behind the seating position? Based on the one photo, the first thing I see is the TV. Having a reflective surface between the speakers will mess with the imaging. You could cover it with a blanket. Of course better to not have one there at all. Covering all the windows helps. Also, you can move the seating closer to the speakers a little. 7-8 feet works fine most of the time and moving the speakers closer together. That pulls you and the speakers away from the walls. Anyway just a couple thoughts to start with. The NX Studio's are incredible, but they will not have the power and dynamics of the NX Otica's. Both of course will need the subs. If you don't listen loud the Studios may be enough.

Cheers!

Sonicjoy

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #8 on: 3 Apr 2021, 03:05 am »
The Oticas will likely be an end game speaker for you so go for it!  :thumb:

mkrawcz

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #9 on: 3 Apr 2021, 10:45 am »
Owning both the Studios and the Oticas, I can say that the Oticas are on a much higher level from the Studios. If you can move them out so the drivers are 3 feet from the wall and put some treatment behind them, I’d say go for it. With the size of that room, they will also provide some really good bass response on their own. You will likely find that you will not want the bass from that subwoofer with them because it will sound very unnatural and sloppy in comparison to the fast open baffle bass of the Oticas.

Shives

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #10 on: 3 Apr 2021, 12:31 pm »
Welcome welcome welcome!!

Open baffle speakers, as mentioned like some room to breath behind them to sound right. If you can do 3-4 feet, that would be around the min. Smaller rooms may not need a sub, depending on what you listen to for music and setup.  Maybe as suggested choose the smaller version... More so if you plan to stay here for a while. If you can treat the walls and setup so you have the room for the larger set... or planning to move rooms to a larger one.. The. I would say do the larger versions.

You need some room for these to really open up. I’ve had the chance recently to visit Danny in his home and office! His setup brought me to tears! (Good music gets me what can I say)

Couple things you can do to help, treat the room a bit more. For behind you, that opening you can use a heavy curtain. Windows, put up some curtains as well. No matter, your going to want some more treatments. (Half the battle)  Open baffle helps minimize this But you still want to cover the basics!

The line of speakers are some of the best I’ve ever heard! For lurking so long, you’ve kept to the right place!

Best of luck!

Tyson

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #11 on: 3 Apr 2021, 04:17 pm »
I'd do the NX-Otica MTM in that room with dual OB subs underneath them as stands.  They are about as big a speaker as you can fit in that room, and as someone mentioned they would be 'end game' level quality, FAR above what you have in there now.  The Ascend Acoustic speakers are actually very nice speakers!  But the NX-Otica MTM and servo OB subs are some of the very best speakers in the entire world. 

The other nice thing re: the 3 feet thing, it's 3 feet from the front baffle.  So if you measure your current speakers from their front baffle, it looks like they are already pretty close to the 3 feet needed by something like the NX-Otica MTM. 

hawkeyejw

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #12 on: 3 Apr 2021, 04:27 pm »
I'd do the NX-Otica MTM in that room with dual OB subs underneath them as stands.  They are about as big a speaker as you can fit in that room, and as someone mentioned they would be 'end game' level quality, FAR above what you have in there now.  The Ascend Acoustic speakers are actually very nice speakers!  But the NX-Otica MTM and servo OB subs are some of the very best speakers in the entire world. 

The other nice thing re: the 3 feet thing, it's 3 feet from the front baffle.  So if you measure your current speakers from their front baffle, it looks like they are already pretty close to the 3 feet needed by something like the NX-Otica MTM.

This was a big realization for me. You don’t have to be out much further than most box speakers when you think about it, in order to take advantage of that open baffle sound.

mkrawcz

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Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #13 on: 3 Apr 2021, 04:56 pm »
This was a big realization for me. You don’t have to be out much further than most box speakers when you think about it, in order to take advantage of that open baffle sound.
I agree, you just have to stop the reflection off the wall with some foam so the time smearing doesn’t occur. Not being further in the room just means they are not quite at their potential. But it’s still better than anything else.

Early B.

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #14 on: 3 Apr 2021, 05:55 pm »
I'd do the NX-Otica MTM in that room with dual OB subs underneath them as stands.  They are about as big a speaker as you can fit in that room, and as someone mentioned they would be 'end game' level quality, FAR above what you have in there now.

Just do this! No further deliberation is required.

Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #15 on: 3 Apr 2021, 07:14 pm »
First off, I would like to thank each and every one of you for the warm welcomes, and helpful and thought out responses!  :thumb: It's a mystery to me why I haven't been personally active on this forum in the past!

I feel like I have not been very concise in any of my posts; which I apologize!  :duh: Below is a quick sketch of the space so no one needs to search around previous posts for room sizes:




It would be quite easy to make the speakers symmetrical Left and Right, but it would simply look out of place. Right now I have the TV between the two windows. If I centered everything the TV would be partially covering a window... Just wouldn't look right, and it would really block an already cramped walking space. I need to draw the line somewhere  :lol:


Tyson

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #16 on: 3 Apr 2021, 07:25 pm »
Asymmetrical rooms is actually a very good reason to go with an OB speaker.  OB speakers aren't affected by the uneven loading of oddly shaped rooms in the same way that box speakers are.  In this respect, they are a lot more flexible re: placement than box speakers.  I only know that because I lived for years with box speakers in a difficult room and when I finally gave OB a try, it was a revelation how much better they sounded, even when placed non-symmetrically. 

Also, consider getting rid of the TV and getting a projector that you can mount out of the way on the ceiling instead.  With a retractable screen, it takes up way less space than a TV and gets out of the way completely when not in use.

Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #17 on: 3 Apr 2021, 07:27 pm »
Now I feel like I have an even harder decision to make...

NX-Monitors:
Pros:
     1.)Inexpensive. Can buy soon, and would nearly pay for themselves when I sell the Ascends.
     2.)Easiest build.
     3.)Sealed Mid Woofers would integrate the best with the current sealed servo sub (F15HP)
     4.)Would most likely eventually move into a bedroom system... I have an old turntable that would be put to use. Probably buy an inexpensive integrated tube amp. These should be efficient enough.
Cons:
     1.) Not the end all speaker.

NX-Otica MTM:
Pros:
     1.)Overall (with subs) a more inexpensive option compared to the Non-MTM.
     2.)Could be the "end all" speaker.
Cons:
     1.)Most likely the biggest initial investment? Need MTM kit, & (2) dual servo subs off the bat.
     2.)Probably 90% of what the Non-MTM version? (nothing to prove that, just assuming)
     3.)May not be able to fill as much space with sound... aka next house will have an unknown space. Could be large.
     4.)Couldn't move into a room by itself without a sub (bedroom system) ...I assume

NX-Otica:
Pros:
     1.)Can buy speakers without subs to start.
     2.)Would be the end all.
Cons:
     1.)Would be without open baffle subs for maybe a year or two.
     2.)Biggest investment overall.


Thanks for making my decision harder all!  :lol: :lol:

Tyson

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #18 on: 3 Apr 2021, 07:40 pm »
I don't think you have room for the full NX-Otica towers and the separate tower OB subs in that room.  Much better is the NX-Otica MTM because it actually doesn't take up much more floor space than your current speakers.

If you sell your Ascend speakers and your current sub, does that get you closer to being able to build the NX-Otica MTM?

Re: the NX-Studio Monitor, it's definitely a BIG step up in quality from the Ascend speakers, so that's a big plus.  But in a room like your's, box bass is always going to be problematic.  Best, IMO to bite the bullet and go full OB as soon as possible.  I promise you, once you are full OB, you will wonder what the hell you waited so long for!

Chewbacca

Re: New Poster, Long Time Lurker!
« Reply #19 on: 3 Apr 2021, 07:44 pm »
I agree, you just have to stop the reflection off the wall with some foam so the time smearing doesn’t occur. Not being further in the room just means they are not quite at their potential. But it’s still better than anything else.

It's funny you mention this, I was falling asleep last night and I realized this... You're going to get an immediate reflection off the back wall with the OB! Thanks!