[markC]

Mark,
See here:

http://db.audioasylum.com/scripts/t.pl?f=cables&m=71447

It appears that I have been duped! Funny thing is, the guy at AA describes exactly the thin sound that I heard from my amp. Piss me off, I could have bought a decent cord for the money I wasted on the 2 Absolutes. Oh well-live and learn I guess.

[markC]

try Ernie's DIY PC: http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?cablpowr&1050380500Y. Easy to build, cheap to buy and they work great. Check out Ernie's system on Audiogon: he is a little nuts about good power

These seem interesting, anyone else tried them?

[OBF]

audioengr,

So, wouldn't designing amps with larger caps solve much of the problem you describe where they drain under dynamic transients and can't recharge fast enough?  I realize large caps aren't cheap, but maybe cheaper than 3 or 4 figure power cords.

Something else I've noticed recently since installing a voltage regulator with output meter, is that even under very LOUD spl levels, my entire system barely draws one amp.  I was very surprised by this, although I was using fairly efficient speakers and a class D amp.

[Carlman]

try Ernie's DIY PC: http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?cablpowr&1050380500Y. Easy to build, cheap to buy and they work great. Check out Ernie's system on Audiogon: he is a little nuts about good power

These seem interesting, anyone else tried them?

Yes! I have them and would recommend them.  I tried a few different cords, Volex, Kimber, and one I can't remember.  They all sounded a little better than stock.  The only component I heard a large difference on was my preamp.  All of a sudden it had a thicker sound, better midrange, and a little more detail.  In order of notable change from most to least: Belden, Kimber, Volex, the one I can't remember.  Sorry I can't remember the other cable.  It was one of the popular recipes resold by some guy on Audiogon.  

However, like I said in an earlier post, I have really clean power so, my results may be less drastic than someone with more electonic noise in their environment... and/or worse electrics.

I bought a lot of this cable, made a power strip, upgraded my outlets, etc....  I went through a lot of trouble to see what all the fuss was about.   I found the fuss was about the difference of replacing a good IC to a better one.  

I expected more... in the end, good equipment sounds better than good cables.  I guess I got caught up in the power cord 'craze'...  I experimented, inhaled, I even believed!!!  But, now it's just a power cable, they make a nice little difference in what I've heard.  For the money, Ernie's kits are the best.

-Carl

[markC]

try Ernie's DIY PC: http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?cablpowr&1050380500Y. Easy to build, cheap to buy and they work great. Check out Ernie's system on Audiogon: he is a little nuts about good power

These seem interesting, anyone else tried them?

Yes! I have them and would recommend them.  I tried a few different cords, Volex, Kimber, and one I can't remember.  They all sounded a little better than stock.  The only component I heard a large difference on was my preamp.  All of a sudden it had a thicker sound, better midrange, and a little more detail.  In order of notable change from most to least: Belden, Kimber, Volex, the one I can't remember.  Sorry I can't remember the other cable.  It was one of the popular recipes resold by some guy on Audiogon.  

However, like I said in an earlier post, I have really clean power so, my results may be less drastic than someone with more electonic noise in their environment... and/or worse electrics.

I bought a lot of this cable, made a power strip, upgraded my outlets, etc....  I went through a lot of trouble to see what all the fuss was about.   I found the fuss was about the difference of replacing a good IC to a better one.  

I expected more... in the end, good equipment sounds better than good cables.  I guess I got caught up in the power cord 'craze'...  I experimented, inhaled, I even believed!!!  But, now it's just a power cable, they make a nice little difference in what I've heard.  For the money, Ernie's kits are the best.

-Carl

Have you ever tried removing the "Ernie Cords" and going back to stock and copare them?

[Carlman]

No, but I intended to do just that....  Sounds like I've got this weekend's experiment!
I'll report back or PM you.
I've still got the Kimber and the Volex cords... The Belden should be broken in by now.... (about 2 months of constantly on...)

[markC]

No, but I intended to do just that....  Sounds like I've got this weekend's experiment!
I'll report back or PM you.
I've still got the Kimber and the Volex cords... The Belden should be broken in by now.... (about 2 months of constantly on...)

Thanks Cman, I'd appreciate that. Now that I've heard the difference, I just HAVE to get some new power cords!

[BlackCat]

See the posts in the Lab circle on DIY powerbox, and several on DIY powercords.  There's lots of DIY recipes out there, check out the ones at TNT:

http://www.tnt-audio.com/clinica/diycables.html

or the DIY powerbox at:

http://www.audiotweaks.com/diy/ac_outletc/page01.htm

or the ones at DIYCable (have their own circle here).

You can have a new cheap hobby making and evaluating all these PCs.

[Carlman]

See the posts in the Lab circle on DIY powerbox, and several on DIY powercords.  There's lots of DIY recipes out there, check out the ones at TNT:

http://www.tnt-audio.com/clinica/diycables.html

or the DIY powerbox at:

http://www.audiotweaks.com/diy/ac_outletc/page01.htm

or the ones at DIYCable (have their own circle here).

You can have a new cheap hobby making and evaluating all these PCs.

To me, this is an overwhelming amount of research to be done.  I can't buy them all and test them.

I think many new IC and PC makers have gotten started by being a hobbyist and then deciding to make it a business.  It's tough to distinguish the copycats from the innovators.  Some know a lot and some know less than me!  Some know a lot about one design that has worked for them in their personal experience.

I would say find out who has used your equipment in designing a cable and what the results were.  That way you're not stabbing in the dark.  If you try cheap recipes yourself, it's not too bad.  But, if you buy into the 'religion' of some of these 'manufacturers' you might end up with a lot less money and no improvement in sound.

I haven't tried TNT or Bolder... or Empirical.. but, most of the companies here seem fairly technical and definitely seem to be of the honest variety.  I can't say the same for what I've seen at Audiogon.  Most offer money back guarantees but, if you don't know what to expect, how do you know if you're satisfied?

I'll do my experiment this weekend.  However, it will only be with the amp.  I realized after typing that response that my preamp is permanently soldered... and my DAC is in Canada getting upgraded.  My turntable still has the original cord.  The DAC will be getting a new PC when it gets home.  I'll compare that when I get it back.

[eric the red]

http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?accspowr&1053252367. Here's a cheap way to try some Belden cords

[eric the red]

(edit) http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?accspowr&1053252367. Here's  some over-priced broken-in, heavy gauge Belden cords that can be found on line for less than half what the seller is asking according to Josh :mrgreen

[JoshK]

Eric,

Those same exact cables I can get online for ~ $4.50 a pop.  They actually sound pretty decent.

[markC]

I'm going to do some research b4 I buy anything, leaning toward diy. Mainly because I'm cheap, but also because I enjoy it. With the help of folks on this site such as Carlman and others, I'm sure I'll come up with an informed decision rather than a spur of the moment one fueled mainly by a manufacturer's hype. Has anyone tried Chis Venhaus's pc's? I am using his fine silver ic's and quite enjoy them.

[Psychicanimal]

I was shocked at the diffence in sound between power cables. I bought a Groneburg for my stereo Stratos-didn't really hear a difference over the stock cable, but thought hey what the hell' it's made for it. Then I got an Absolute cord to replace the flimsy one that came with my cdp. Here, I heard better bass response, so I bought another one for my pre-they're resonably priced. Didn't hear much difference. Now that I have my Dual Mono I've ordered another Groneburg. Now to the point. I came home from work this aft. and spun a few tunes, finished up with some Diana Krall. I thought rather than have one stock cord and one Groneburg on the DM, I'd have two the same, so I swapped out the two Absolutes from the cdp and pre and put them on the DM. I put the Groneburg on the cdp and the stock Stratos on the pre. Turned everything back on and went and had dinner. I came back about an hour later and put Diana back on. Something was terribly wrong! She was screaming at me and the bass player left the room. I didn't think power cords could do this. So I switched everything back the way it was and voila all was right again. Now it's got me wondering if these Absolute cords are junk, or are they just not good on amps? Maybe I should try some diy cords. Any suggestions for the cdp and pre?

Mark,

The Absolute Power Cord is extremely good at what it does.  I have seven of them.  In an A/B comparison in my system, a cryoed version outperformed both the BMI Whale ($400) and the BMI Shark ($650) power cords.

However, in my Forté 4A power amp I use a Jena Labs cryoed Tice PC3 power cord (with a Highwire Wirewrap tuning device).  I like it better there...

Most people do not understand how to properly use power cords.   I hold the point of view that a power cord is no substitute for proper power stabilization and filtration.   You will notice that comments in favor of expensive power cords come almost exclusively (if not always) from people with mediocre or non existing power stabilization/filtration rigs.  My friend Deano uses a variant of the Chris VenHaus power cord with his Lamm monoblocks.  Deano is a power conditioning freak and ended up making his own power conditioner, though...

My suggestion to you is to send your Absolutes to cryo treatment ($9-10/ lb) and then break them in by running your refrigerator through them for about ten days.

[Carlman]

How much you wanna bet they're 'Belkin' and not Belden.

[markC]

I was shocked at the diffence in sound between power cables. I bought a Groneburg for my stereo Stratos-didn't really hear a difference over the stock cable, but thought hey what the hell' it's made for it. Then I got an Absolute cord to replace the flimsy one that came with my cdp. Here, I heard better bass response, so I bought another one for my pre-they're resonably priced. Didn't hear much difference. Now that I have my Dual Mono I've ordered another Groneburg. Now to the point. I came home from work this aft. and spun a few tunes, finished up with some Diana Krall. I thought rather than have one stock cord and one Groneburg on the DM, I'd have two the same, so I swapped out the two Absolutes from the cdp and pre and put them on the DM. I put the Groneburg on the cdp and the stock Stratos on the pre. Turned everything back on and went and had dinner. I came back about an hour later and put Diana back on. Something was terribly wrong! She was screaming at me and the bass player left the room. I didn't think power cords could do this. So I switched everything back the way it was and voila all was right again. Now it's got me wondering if these Absolute cords are junk, or are they just not good on amps? Maybe I should try some diy cords. Any suggestions for the cdp and pre?

Mark,

The Absolute Power Cord is extremely good at what it does.  I have seven of them.  In an A/B comparison in my system, a cryoed version outperformed both the BMI Whale ($400) and the BMI Shark ($650) power cords.

However, in my Forté 4A power amp I use a Jena Labs cryoed Tice PC3 power cord (with a Highwire Wirewrap tuning device).  I like it better there...

Most people do not understand how to properly use power cords.   I hold the point of view that a power cord is no substitute for proper power stabilization and filtration.   You will notice that comments in favor of expensive power cords come almost exclusively (if not always) from people with mediocre or non existing power stabilization/filtration rigs.  My friend Deano uses a variant of the Chris VenHaus power cord with his Lamm monoblocks.  Deano is a power conditioning freak and ended up making his own power conditioner, though...

My suggestion to you is to send your Absolutes to cryo treatment ($9-10/ lb) and then break them in by running your refrigerator through them for about ten days.

With all do respect, just what does it do extremely well? If they sounded as bad as they did on MY amp, why would I spend more money on them to get them cryoed? In my mind, a cable would fist have to sound good to get it cryoed-then it should sound better. But, if it sounds bad to start with, I don't believe cryo treatment could fix it.

[eric the red]

Break in your power cords by running your refrigerator through them for 9-10 days?? Is that some kind of audiophile-audition refrigerator with an IEC socket? Why not just cryo them in your audiophile refrigerator's freezer?

[Jay S]

Break in your power cords by running your refrigerator through them for 9-10 days?? Is that some kind of audiophile-audition refrigerator with an IEC socket? Why not just cryo them in your audiophile refrigerator's freezer?

Meat and vegetables stay fresh for longer when I use a good audiophile PC on my ref.  

Seriously, I do believe in good PCs - I've got Bolders' all of my components (well, except for the eAR amp since the cave is very tight and Wattgate IECs won't fit -- I've got a molded Belden cable that does and may try Peter's new PC that he is raving about).

[Psychicanimal]

With all do respect, just what does it do extremely well? If they sounded as bad as they did on MY amp, why would I spend more money on them to get them cryoed? In my mind, a cable would fist have to sound good to get it cryoed-then it should sound better. But, if it sounds bad to start with, I don't believe cryo treatment could fix it.

Mark:

Just because when you use a particular piece of gear you get bad sound does not automatically mean that component is bad.     The component may actually be so good is revealling other weaknesses in the chain.

When one of my friends tried the same 65 cents/ft tin plated copper, Teflon speaker wire that I use he complained things sounded brighter and harsher than with his Kimber 8TC.  He later founfd out the problem was due to improper damping/isolation of his DAC.  The new speaker wire was revealling a weakness in the system.  He put up for sale the Kimber's.

Get the point?

The Absolute Power Cord is indeed a very revealling component.  It does not artificially alter bass response, soundstage or filter high frequencies.  It actually has very wide bandwith.  If you don't have your line conditioning right it will let you know--especially on your digital front end.  Also, it is a *tuned* design--that's why it's only available in 8 ft lengths.

Cryo treatment is a slow, computer controlled process.  It takes like a day to lower the temperature to something like (-300 F), one day at that temperature and one day to bring the temperature back to ambient.  Cryo treatment is, without a doubt, the most cost effective audio improvement.  Cryo treated products do take longer to break in.  Running my refrigerator to break in outlets and power cords speeds up the process.  It works.  Spend $45 on an ACME silver plated, cryo treated receptacle or similar and find out for yourself.

[markC]

But the Absolute was an improvement over the stock cord on my cdp, as I mentioned in my first post. Surely your not suggesting that one would have to spend large on power conditioning to enjoy the benefits of a power cord.