Tools most useful for a new builder

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summitradio

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Tools most useful for a new builder
« on: 22 Apr 2020, 02:01 am »
Hello All

I'm a new builder and I have a few woodworking tools and have much electronic experience and tools.

What tools made your builds easier?

What would you recommend to a new builder

What wood materials would you recommend?

Thanks!

jmpsmash

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #1 on: 22 Apr 2020, 12:07 pm »
a table saw, a router w/ a circular jig, and a LOT of clamps.

jgerber4

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #2 on: 22 Apr 2020, 01:29 pm »
I have also been thinking about this.  Table saws are large and relatively expensive, with a huge range in cost and features.  Can anyone offer suggestions as to what is most important in deciding on a table saw purchase?

G E

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #3 on: 22 Apr 2020, 02:08 pm »
I have also been thinking about this.  Table saws are large and relatively expensive, with a huge range in cost and features.  Can anyone offer suggestions as to what is most important in deciding on a table saw purchase?

The quality of the fence.  Essential for making accurate cuts.

Check out some of the woodworking enthusiast magazines, they sometimes have reviews and shootouts.  Our local library has several publications and they have back issues too.  You can also browse the magazine section at the big box stores like Lowes and Home Depot.

Peter J

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #4 on: 22 Apr 2020, 03:08 pm »
I'm a tool junkie, so my objectivity may be compromised.

One probably needs to define a couple of things before jumping on the tool train.

1. Budget. Good tools should serve you for a lifetime, but may be a waste for a single project.

2. End game. Is this a hobby you want to develop? Remodeling the house, framing a photo, making pens, gun cabinet, family heirlooms?

FWIW, I see tools as a means to an end. And that end is creating stuff. Ideas to finished item. Very fulfilling for me, but maybe not for everyone. I've been thinking of ways to demonstrate how to build a speaker with minimal tools and think a track saw would be as good or better than a table saw for many folks. Takes little space and is versatile at the price of some convenience.

Sometimes it's easier to define the task at hand and flesh out tools to get that done. Next project, add a tool or two and so on. In retrospect and in my case, that's mostly how my shop and tool arsenal evolved, but it's not everyone's dream.


glynnw

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #5 on: 22 Apr 2020, 03:38 pm »
Bandaids.

mlundy57

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #6 on: 22 Apr 2020, 04:08 pm »
To elaborate on Perer's points, If you are only going to use it once or very occasionally, the least expensive would be a circular saw, two clamps, and a 2x4 for a straight edge. A step up from that would be a circular saw with something like a Bora clamp guide and circular saw adapter. With this you get better control for the cuts at the added expense of the guide clamp and adapter. The next step up would be a track saw. If you plan on doing more projects that could benefit from a table saw, a job site saw would be the entry point for table saws. These are compact and most have a stand that folds up and rolls away when not in uses. Because of this they don't take up much floor space when not in use. I built a lot of speakers with a $560 RIDGID job site saw. Job site saws come in a wide range of quality and price. The cheapest ones are way underpowered, flimsy, won't hold settings, and have crappy fences that won't stay in place. Stay away from these at all costs.  The best ones, like a Sawstop has the same fence system and provides the same quality of cuts as their full size cabinet saws. Sawstop also has a safety feature that prevents serious injuries. The downside is all that comes at a hefty price. Sawstop jobsite saws go for $1,400. So pick your poison based on what you plan to do with it, how much you plan on using it, and on what you can afford.

If your router didn't come with a plunge base, get one.

For wood MDF is a good choice. It's readily available, cuts and machines easily, and is inexpensive, especially compared to Baltic Birch plywood. Stay away from any plywood except Baltic or Finish Birch. All the other plywoods have too many voids in them.

S Clark

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #7 on: 22 Apr 2020, 04:09 pm »
Router and table saw for anyone making more than two pairs of speakers.  Otherwise, contact one of the guys that build flat packs for Danny's kits. Or get the store to cut it for you, and buy a front baffle from the flat pack guys (mlundy57, do you sell front baffles?).  Buy a bunch of cheap chinese clamps and glue. 

Now if you are going to do more, get better than cheap tools.  But don't fall into the tool trap.  I have a close friend that has a shop full of very nice/expensive tools... and few completed projects.

Hobbsmeerkat

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #8 on: 22 Apr 2020, 04:10 pm »
I'd also recommend a soldering kit for the crossover, but they're also really useful for small repairs/mods on most electronics. But its a pretty nice tool/skill to have, and it doesn't take too much effort to learn!


I originally ordered mine to mod an original Game Boy Advance to work with the backlit display of the later AGS-101 model.




WGH

Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #9 on: 22 Apr 2020, 05:02 pm »
A flat pack would be the way to go or...
 
A skill saw, MDF, butt joints at the edges attached with Woodmaster square drive woodworking screws. Use Bondo to fill screw holes. Belt sand the entire box, paint or wrap with vinyl wood. Nope, not going to be pretty at all but will work for your first project or...

Cut cabinet cabinet pieces very precisely and use a Corner Lock Miter Bit router bit (1/4" or 1/2" shank) for clean, sharp corners
https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-Corner-Lock-Miter-Bit-1-4-Shank/C1711
or...

Buy a kit with cabinet plans and hire a cabinet shop to cut the pieces, it would be more affordable than buying all the tools you need. I have been woodworking for 45 years and cheap tools do not work, they just make the job harder and you are more likely to get hurt. Assembly, sanding and finishing is something you can do. Sanding and finishing can take as much time or more than actual construction, doing that part yourself saves a bunch of money and makes the project your own.

I noticed that Philharmonic Audio/Dennis Murphy is back with the BRM Philharmonitor kit sold through Meniscus Audio. This would be an excellent sounding first speaker to build.
https://meniscusaudio.com/product/phiharmonic-audio-bmr-speaker-kit/

AVS Forum has a thread regarding this speaker, go to the last 12 pages or so, go back and forth to find the parts you like to read:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-speakers/1348949-philharmonic-audio-dennis-murphy.html



Specs: http://www.philharmonicaudio.com/

WGH

Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #10 on: 22 Apr 2020, 05:46 pm »
Opps, just noticed this is in the GR Research Circle, Danny's speakers are excellent too  :oops:

DrJ-10

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #11 on: 22 Apr 2020, 05:57 pm »
I'll disagree mildly with the direction this conversation is taking.

Woodworking and machining services can be hired, and are available everywhere.  What is not is good electronic and acoustic measurement.  So I think that this is where one should invest.

S Clark

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #12 on: 22 Apr 2020, 06:15 pm »
I'll disagree mildly with the direction this conversation is taking.

Woodworking and machining services can be hired, and are available everywhere.  What is not is good electronic and acoustic measurement.  So I think that this is where one should invest.
Acoustic and electrical measurement is mostly beyond the scope of a beginner... that's why you start with a kit or a tried and true design.   Even if you can take electrical measurements, they don't tell you as much as the acoustic. 

DrJ-10

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #13 on: 22 Apr 2020, 06:22 pm »
Acoustic and electrical measurement is mostly beyond the scope of a beginner... that's why you start with a kit or a tried and true design.   Even if you can take electrical measurements, they don't tell you as much as the acoustic.

Perhaps.  For me it is the most interesting part of building speakers.  Then again, I probably am one of the few who studies theoretical acoustics as a hobby.

S Clark

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #14 on: 22 Apr 2020, 07:33 pm »
It's important, but ultimately, it's how a speaker sounds... as long as impedance doesn't fry an amp.
FR graphs and waterfall plots tell me what the response is going to be.  Then off axis testing.  Then it's shape by ear. 
And nearly all of this is beyond the beginner without some guidance. 

mlundy57

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #15 on: 22 Apr 2020, 08:00 pm »
I'd guess a lot of folks looking at kits are like me. I can build and finish a cabinet, follow instructions to wire up a crossover and install the parts, but designing a good sounding speaker is way beyond my skill set. I wish I could design, but this old dog has no intention of learning that new trick so I let the people who are good at designing do it and I stick with what I can do. Which for me means woodworking tools that fit my skill level and needs. Both of which have evolved over time.

DrJ-10

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #16 on: 22 Apr 2020, 08:23 pm »
I understand that people's interests differ.  If I cannot build something that betters my old Quads or big Beveridges then I don't bother.  But that probably is a far outlier.

AlexH

Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #17 on: 22 Apr 2020, 09:22 pm »
I'd guess a lot of folks looking at kits are like me. I can build and finish a cabinet, follow instructions to wire up a crossover and install the parts, but designing a good sounding speaker is way beyond my skill set. I wish I could design, but this old dog has no intention of learning that new trick so I let the people who are good at designing do it and I stick with what I can do. Which for me means woodworking tools that fit my skill level and needs. Both of which have evolved over time.

Amen!

Jon L

Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #18 on: 22 Apr 2020, 09:51 pm »
Woodworking and machining services can be hired, and are available everywhere. 

This has been quite difficult to find IME, for audiophile speaker projects.  If anyone knows of good woodwork-for-hire services in SoCal, please do let me know.  I'm especially in need of enlarging driver holes in 3" thick front baffle at the moment..

Sonicjoy

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Re: Tools most useful for a new builder
« Reply #19 on: 22 Apr 2020, 09:56 pm »
I'm right there also Mike. I can build almost anything but designing speakers I will leave to Danny and others who are into that.

There is a lot to learn about woodworking and power tools. Table saws especially are dangerous if you don't know how to use them. I would agree that unless you are planning to learn woodworking and do more in the future you would be better off waiting for the flat packs to become available then all you need is clamps and sandpaper and a few basic hand tools. You could as mentioned find a cabinet builder or carpenter locally that can help you. You may be able to rent some tools as well.

If you do decide to build them yourself be sure and have some extra MDF because you will most likely make some mistakes cutting out and fitting parts.