[SteveFord]

https://www.psaudio.com/article/industry-viewpoint-are-audio-dealers-in-trouble/

I've made suggestions in the past, maybe someone has better ideas?

[JohnR]

I'm having a little trouble understanding what the question is... For one thing, around here I think there are more B&M stores than there were a few years ago. However, I don't know if any have Magnepan on the floor. Maybe Magnepan should figure out why and do something about it. I don't see how consumers without access to the actual numbers can provide any help on this, it's all on them.

....?

[Letitroll98]

I'm having a little trouble understanding what Magnaplanar can do about B&M stores and retail stores in general crashing and burning.  I'm lucky in that one of the great Maggie dealers is literally one mile from me, Butch's Sounds and Vision (former Sound Shack).  But the rest of Western PA is bereft of high fidelity sales under roof.  Several decades ago there were dozens to choose from.  Almost all new companies are going direct sales or through online dealers.  I haven't heard Magnaplanar is hurting for sales, but if they were you'd see them on Amazon tomorrow.

[Craig B]

I don't want to downplay Wendell's complaint - the dealer network is nothing like it was 40 years ago. But they're still around, just not in the numbers they used to be. I'm OK with a 2-3 hour drive to a dealer if necessary, as long as I think I'm going to be able to hear what I want, and any sort of service I receive there is decent. But I think Wendell's bigger problem is that the hi-fi dealer network in general is so economically fragile that almost no shop can invest in a floor model 30.7, or even a 20.7, for auditions. That leaves his well-heeled potential customers out in the cold. And the less expensive Maggies are so popular currently that stores can't keep them in stock, and the factory has 8-10 week lead times, which, despite legendary Magnepan customer loyalty, is not a good thing either, when it comes to bringing new people into the fold.

To me, the whole thing is the result of a combination of listening habits of younger generations, and to a lesser extent the stratospheric prices of a lot of equipment these days. Even if we couldn't afford it ourselves, those of us who entered the hobby in the '70s were comfortable with the idea of top-of-the-line costing the equivalent of a nice car, maybe even a Cadillac. But today that paradigm has shifted to the cost of a Ferrari.

How to turn any of that around is anyone's guess. But the price thing is only a small part of it. Even in the heyday of the industry, you weren't ever likely to find an Avantgarde or a Wilson Audio dealer in, say, Peoria, Illinois. The uber-expensive goods go where the money is most concentrated. But there is enough really good, modestly priced gear out there that even entry level buyers could be well served across the country if the dealer network were robust and wide. The underlying issue is lack of a large customer base, and, say what you will about the deleterious effect of MP3s and earbuds on the audio industry, I think the bigger cause is the general decline of the role music plays in everyday life. It's societal changes that are at the root of the dealer problem, and society evolves in ways that are difficult to direct or even influence. Until a critical mass's perceived "need" for music once again becomes more central to their lifestyle than just providing background noise or a dance beat, the industry will continue to wither. No one needs quality to produce background noise, and no one want to turn their home into a club. If those are the only perceived needs for music, then spending money on good home equipment is not only unnecessary, most would consider it foolish.

It seems to me that the industry grew from the '50s through the '80s because of two things: the technology and its effects were new enough that it was attractive to older buyers who were already established music consumers via classical concert attendance and who loved the sound so much they wanted to reproduce that experience in their homes; and younger buyers, who viewed art (especially music) as a tool for social change, granting it status as a central theme in their lives, which made it important to be able to reproduce it as faithfully as possible at home, for the greatest emotional impact. That first group has long since died off, and the second is now sitting around lamenting the declining base of the industry. About the only music that has taken up the mantle of "driver of social change" is rap, and as near as I can tell, that's not a genre in which reproducing an auditory illusion of reality is seen as a goal, or even a relevant thing.

Not only do I not know what the answer is, I'm not sure any longer that there is one. Just my opinions.

[timind]

Sorry folks, there's no going back, you can't put the genie back in the bottle, time marches on. Pick a metaphor as they all apply. B&M stores aren't coming back to anywhere near 1980 levels. 

Magnepan has it even worse than most hi-end companies. As good as they sound, they are as inconvenient as any speaker you can think of to sell, buy, or own. And that 8-10 week lag time for speaker delivery is just ridiculous. If business is that good, increase your production capability.

[ketchup]

Okay, I read everything that was posted in that link, but what the hell did I just read?  It seemed kind of like incoherent rambling.  What was the point?

[Wind Chaser]

I think the new business model going forward will have to bring the end user into a paid sales/demo role...

[Elizabeth]

THe main problems FOR MAGNEPAN.. are
 #1 their markup. Magnepan has a SMALLER MARGIN than most HiFi gear. So dealers do not want to carry it.
#2 Magnepan (specially the larger ones) are HARD TO SHIP.
So.. For Magnepan, the problems of dealers is magnified.
As for normal audio retail? ALL RETAIL is dying. 100% across the board. When Amazon. And sooner or later Amazon will hit the wall, and wither.
So in general, RETAIL is dying. and audio stores being within the set of Retail is doing what all other retail is doing. Darwin wins..
SO what.
Why DO YOU CARE? Do you feel the need to 'save' the retail past? 'Cuz that is what is the goal here it seems...
If you LOOKED FORWARD, (like gee PS AUDIO) and went to online and direct sales.. You might survive. (even Magnepan with the LRS is waking up and smelling the future)

So yeah the question then is just the: how the H' can I go LISTEN???
Solutions are: Shows. Audio clubs. just buy and trade if displeased.
(PS back in the day BEFORE the internet, before TAS and Stereophile. Audio dweebs were IN THE SAME BOAT. Few brands and no info. Sure there were stores. but no info to make informed decisions. you BOUGHT whatever the salesman sold you. Do not pretend otherwise. Yeah maybe YOU got lucky and HAD a great saleman who steered you to good gear. Most did not, and bought whatever had the most bling.
So we had a "Golden Age' say from the mid 80's to the late 2000s... Where audio was informed, relevant, had places to buy...
Get over it.
Stop whining "Someone MOVED MY CHEESE" and find new cheese

[Tyson]

I think manufacturers are generally going to have to go direct sales and offer better demo/return policies as just part of the cost of doing business. 

And as an audiophile, really a home demo is the best way to do it, anyway. 

Shows are great because you can listen to a lot of gear and get an idea of the house sound of various manufacturers.  That's how I first stumbled across a bunch of different great brands, like Daedalus and Spatial.  It also lets you see/hear that the big boys in audio (Wilson, Dynadio, B&W) aren't really any better sounding than well built products from smaller manufacturers.  That's a really valuable lesson, IMO.

[rollo]

 Magnepan needs to rethink their presence. Dealers are just that. They will sell the product that makes them the most money. Does Magnepan offer the same dealer cost percentage as other speaker Manufacturers ?
  Maybe consider a trade-in program. Where there would be previously owned models available for new customers. Similar to the Auto industry. Trade in program with allowance towards a new model. Allowing enough for resale by Magnepan.
   Or maybe a Magnepan STORE in major Cities. Magnepan could hook up with other Manufactures to demo systems. Than without dealers speaker less could cost less, say 30% less. Included a Magnepan Truck that delivers bought and demo pieces. BRILLIANT !!


charles
   

[mcmusicman]

 Another problem is largely self inflicted. Price.  Baby boomers are leaving rapidly now and they are the few who can afford the most offerings.  People, especially younger, buy what they can afford. To survive, a dealer needs traffic.  Door knobs turning.  Why go to an audio store when everything is 4-5 figures and you don't have that kind of coin? It is not unreasonable or too much ask for the manufacturers to all put out quality entry level gear to get people started.  I called Audio advice just to see how the interest has been and they are out 15 weeks or so on the LRS. Maybe manufacturers should support dealers with a consignment model, floor planning inventory much like the Gas companies do with the modern day convenience store and provide high margin tweaks & accessories ?  Back to Elizabeth's point, how many full service gas stations do you see today? Change Happens.  There are mattress stores on every block, why not furniture/chair or home furnishing stores which also partner with Audio Hifi ?  Some items we buy just need a tangible experience before purchasing and that is where a more logical partnership could be formed. Sonos,Bose,Elac saw the writing on the wall and focused on the viable traffic stores like Best Buy and Costco. They also made sure entry level is affordable.  If Banks can set up branches in Walmart, Music Stores could set up "micro" dealership branches in high traffic areas?   I can see it now, Bed Bath and Beyonce. 

[smargo]

I think manufacturers are generally going to have to go direct sales and offer better demo/return policies as just part of the cost of doing business. 

And as an audiophile, really a home demo is the best way to do it, anyway. 

Shows are great because you can listen to a lot of gear and get an idea of the house sound of various manufacturers.  That's how I first stumbled across a bunch of different great brands, like Daedalus and Spatial.  It also lets you see/hear that the big boys in audio (Wilson, Dynadio, B&W) aren't really any better sounding than well built products from smaller manufacturers.  That's a really valuable lesson, IMO.

agree 100% - no peanuts to offer here - all the posts make a lot of sense