A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?

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pinkfloyd4ever

A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« on: 19 Oct 2020, 08:59 pm »
So I'm looking at the different traditional "box"-style floorstander kits from GR. The A/V-3, X-SLS Encore, X-MTM encore, and the N3 (provided I can find somewhere that will sell me just the Neo3 tweeter deep back cups).

I need something that's good for a crappy room (combined living/dining/entry room), can be placed fairly close to the front wall (12-18" from rear baffle to wall), 8 ohm impedance and relatively high efficiency (roughly 90 dB or better). Unfortunately, anything open-baffle is out of the question due to space constraints. The speakers get pulled out and pushed back every time I listen, and we have a little dog that likes to play on the rug in front of the speakers, so standmounts are also not an option.

I plan on using these with my DIY MyRef RevC, Fisher 500C (P-P tube, 25-30 WPC), as well as a 25wpc SS DIY Class A design in the future, like a Pass Aleph J. Hence the requirement for higher efficiency, 8 ohm speakers. Also can't rule out a DIY SET tube amp in my future, although I know that may require even higher efficiency speakers than those in question here.

From what I've read all of the above (A/V-3, X-SLS Encore, X-MTM encore, and the N3, which is unfortunately not on Danny's new site) could fit the bill. So besides the obvious, (i.e. different tweeters, the X-SLS uses 1 mid-woofer vs the X-MTM's 2 mid-woofers), what are the differences in sound (frequency response and soundstage/imaging), components, construction difficulty, specs, etc? And are there any other possible contenders from GR research that I'm overlooking?

I have a fair amount of experience building DIY audio electronics. And I installed Danny's upgrade kit in my Insignia NS-B2111 book shelves. But this will be my first time building DIY speakers. My BIL is an experienced woodworker though, and I'll have his help with the cabinets. So together I think we should be able to get through it ok.

Thanks!

Hobbsmeerkat

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Re: A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« Reply #1 on: 19 Oct 2020, 09:28 pm »
If you try to go the N-3 route, the hard part will be finding the Neo3 PDR with a deep back cup. Most of the deep-cup models available are the non-PDR which are more sensitive & don't have the better off-axis response.
It's one of the reasons I've been working on a deep-cup mod, but its slow going right now since I need to make some adjustments to fit both the standard BG Neo3 PDR & the GRS-3" clone models.

Otherwise, I imagine both the A/V-3 or X-MTM will give you a little better low end than the X-SLS, but depending on how tight your space constraints are, the A/V-3 will be better if space is really an issue, since they're a little smaller overall thanks to the smaller M-130 woofer, but I imagine they're going to sound quite similar, tho the tweeter will have a slightly different response, since it uses the AV tweeter instead of the X-series model, but i haven't heard both to know how the compare side by side.

pinkfloyd4ever

Re: A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« Reply #2 on: 19 Oct 2020, 10:25 pm »
Does anyone know if the GR Neo3 fits the BG deep back cup perfectly?

If so, I'm thinking I could buy the BG Neo3 (non-PDR) tweeters with deep back cups, try to sell the BG tweeters and keep the deep back cups to use with GR Neo3s.

Not ideal of course, but then again,

« Last Edit: 20 Oct 2020, 01:39 am by pinkfloyd4ever »

mlundy57

Re: A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« Reply #3 on: 19 Oct 2020, 10:49 pm »
Does anyone know if the GR Neo3 fits the BG deep back cup perfectly?

If so, I'm thinking I could buy the BG Neo3 (non-PDR) tweeters with deep back cups, try to sell the BG tweeters and keep the deep back cups to use with GR Neo3s.

I can't say for certain but that should work.

The X-MTM has a higher sensitivity, fuller midrange, and plays lower compared to the X-SLS. The X-MTM is designed to be -3dB at 40Hz but, depending on room gain, can play down into the mid to low 30's.

If you can get the deep back cups the N3s are an option. They are physically smaller compared to the X-MTM Encores. Here's a pic of the two side by side:



Both the N3 and X-MTM Encore are excellent choices especially if you upgrade the crossover parts.


pinkfloyd4ever

Re: A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« Reply #4 on: 19 Oct 2020, 11:56 pm »
I can't say for certain but that should work.

The X-MTM has a higher sensitivity, fuller midrange, and plays lower compared to the X-SLS. The X-MTM is designed to be -3dB at 40Hz but, depending on room gain, can play down into the mid to low 30's.

If you can get the deep back cups the N3s are an option. They are physically smaller compared to the X-MTM Encores. Here's a pic of the two side by side:

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Both the N3 and X-MTM Encore are excellent choices especially if you upgrade the crossover parts.

Cool thanks! That is definitely helpful. I know you've built just about every GR research speaker there is.

I should've mentioned, I only plan to use these speakers for 2 channel music listening. (OT Side note: I'm pretty happy with my Vizio soundbar as my budget HT sound system.)

EDIT: Oh, 1 more question: can any of the above NOT be made front ported?

corndog71

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Re: A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« Reply #5 on: 20 Oct 2020, 12:32 am »
The only down side to following Danny and his excellent speakers is the rare occasion when parts become unavailable.  It’s not Danny’s fault.  But it happens. I’m still kicking myself for not getting the N3 kit when I had the chance.  Prices also go up.  So, the lesson here is think long and hard about what you want.  But not too long so you can get them while you can.

In my experience you get better power handling and better lower midrange from the MTM designs.  Still, you might find the X-SLS Encore to be all that you need.  You might find any GR speaker will make that soundbar sound like a toy.  :lol:

Hobbsmeerkat

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Re: A/V-3, X-SLS, X-MTM, or N3?
« Reply #6 on: 20 Oct 2020, 12:58 am »
Does anyone know if the GR Neo3 fits the BG deep back cup perfectly?

If so, I'm thinking I could buy the BG Neo3 (non-PDR) tweeters with deep back cups, try to sell the BG tweeters and keep the deep back cups to use with GR Neo3s.

Not ideal of course, but


It should, you just need a silicon adhesive to attach the cup to the back of the GR driver. But it will still have the same increased sensitivity vs a PDR version which will likely require some adjustments in the crossover.

I still need to adjust my mod's designs to fit all 3 versions of the Neo3, including Danny's custom model, and the GRS3 clone.
that's something ill work on this week.

That said, I dont know how well Danny's model fits the BG face plate, cuz the GRS3 clone certainly doesnt fit properly without also trimming away the guides that keep it aligned when mounting the driver.