Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House

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ajzepp

Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« on: 21 May 2019, 09:24 pm »
So I just finished putting together a theater room, and I was planning on buying a Furman Elite PFI-15, but after some research, I found that it's not really a product that many in home theater advocate. So then I reached out to Torus and Dave (the Uber Buss guy), as those were two options that were more highly recommended, I was hit with some additional concerns. When Torus figured my "maximum" draw, they calculated it to be 28a. My circuit is 15a. Ive reached out to the manufacturers for confirmation on this, but going with those numbers, I'm assuming I need to probably either reduce the potential max draw or add a dedicated circuit. Electrons aren't my thing (in terms of expertise, that is...nothing against them personally), and I do understand that max draw would only be for short, transient bursts, but I'm trying to gather as many reliable opinions as I can. This forum has always served me well, so I wanted to pick some brains on what I should do.

One of the biggest "offenders" on the list they used to calculate potential draw was the Outlaw Audio 7075. This is a class A/B amp, 7 channels, but it's only being used to drive four Atmos height channels (moderately efficient speakers). They're saying max draw of 10a, but I seriously doubt it'll ever come near that.

The room I have the gear in is on the other side of the lower level of my home as the breaker box, so while I did have a dedicated line installed in another location a decade ago, and it wasn't all that expensive, I'm guessing this install would be a bit pricier given the location of the breaker.

Anyway, just curious how some of you would proceed given this situation. I'm already over budget, so cost is a variable, but safe operation of my gear is the priority.

Thanks

PS. The subwoofer manufacturer also pointed out that 15a circuits are typically designed to pass 30-60a in short 5-10sec duration(s), so I guess that's another variable at play.

jeffreybehr

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Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #1 on: 21 May 2019, 11:13 pm »
So I just finished putting together a theater room, and I was planning on buying a Furman Elite PFI-15, but after some research, I found that it's not really a product that many in home theater advocate. So then I reached out to Torus and Dave (the Uber Buss guy), as those were two options that were more highly recommended, I was hit with some additional concerns. When Torus figured my "maximum" draw, they calculated it to be 28a. My circuit is 15a. Ive reached out to the manufacturers for confirmation on this, but going with those numbers, I'm assuming I need to probably either reduce the potential max draw or add a dedicated circuit. Electrons aren't my thing (in terms of expertise, that is...nothing against them personally), and I do understand that max draw would only be for short, transient bursts, but I'm trying to gather as many reliable opinions as I can. This forum has always served me well, so I wanted to pick some brains on what I should do.

One of the biggest "offenders" on the list they used to calculate potential draw was the Outlaw Audio 7075. This is a class A/B amp, 7 channels, but it's only being used to drive four Atmos height channels (moderately efficient speakers). They're saying max draw of 10a, but I seriously doubt it'll ever come near that.

The room I have the gear in is on the other side of the lower level of my home as the breaker box, so while I did have a dedicated line installed in another location a decade ago, and it wasn't all that expensive, I'm guessing this install would be a bit pricier given the location of the breaker.

Anyway, just curious how some of you would proceed given this situation. I'm already over budget, so cost is a variable, but safe operation of my gear is the priority.

Thanks

PS. The subwoofer manufacturer also pointed out that 15a circuits are typically designed to pass 30-60a in short 5-10sec duration(s), so I guess that's another variable at play.

Some thoughts in no particular order:
1. For normal operations, the idea that you'd seldom use even half of that 28-Amp maximum draw is probably plenty OK, but...
2. ...understand that drawing even 14 Amps thru a 15-Amp circuit could well pop the breaker.
3. The "...15a circuits are typically designed to pass 30-60a in short 5-10sec duration(s)" concept does not sound right to me.. I believe that if a 15-Amp circuit was asked to deliver 30 Amps for 10 seconds, some part of it would be burning or at least smoking or melted...or the breaker would open.. That said, you just might be able to operate all of your HT system on that single 15-Amp circuit for years without having any trouble; that depends on just how much current all that power-hungry equipment draws in actual use.. So if you listen loudly and often, probably you'll pop the breaker often.
4. IMO you need at least another 15-amp branch circuit feeding your HT system, and that might be easy to get; an electrician can determine if a different, little-used branch circuit is close and is on the same leg (known often but incorrectly as a 'phase') of the two in your home.

Good luck.

ajzepp

Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #2 on: 21 May 2019, 11:26 pm »
Some thoughts in no particular order:
1. For normal operations, the idea that you'd seldom use even half of that 28-Amp maximum draw is probably plenty OK, but...
2. ...understand that drawing even 14 Amps thru a 15-Amp circuit could well pop the breaker.
3. The "...15a circuits are typically designed to pass 30-60a in short 5-10sec duration(s)" concept does not sound right to me.. I believe that if a 15-Amp circuit was asked to deliver 30 Amps for 10 seconds, some part of it would be burning or at least smoking or melted...or the breaker would open.. That said, you just might be able to operate all of your HT system on that single 15-Amp circuit for years without having any trouble; that depends on just how much current all that power-hungry equipment draws in actual use.. So if you listen loudly and often, probably you'll pop the breaker often.
4. IMO you need at least another 15-amp branch circuit feeding your HT system, and that might be easy to get; an electrician can determine if a different, little-used branch circuit is close and is on the same leg (known often but incorrectly as a 'phase') of the two in your home.

Good luck.

Thanks man, that info is very much appreciated.

srb

Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #3 on: 22 May 2019, 12:15 am »
Looking at a typical Eaton / Cutler-Hammer 15A Breaker Time/Current Curve, it looks like it could pass

10X current (150A) for ~ .8 seconds
5X current (75A) for ~ 2 seconds
2X current (30A) for ~ 11 seconds

These would be minimums without overheating.

ajzepp

Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #4 on: 22 May 2019, 12:30 am »
Looking at a typical Eaton / Cutler-Hammer 15A Breaker Time/Current Curve, it looks like it could pass

10X current (150A) for ~ .8 seconds
5X current (75A) for ~ 2 seconds
2X current (30A) for ~ 11 seconds

These would be minimums without overheating.

Thanks SRB...I've only had the gear set up for the last 48hr and have been running it pretty hard with some demo tracks...hasn't seem to make the Tripp-Lite conditioner even flinch, as far as I can tell. It has some sort of voltage regulation in it, but nothing substantial.

I'll probably have the electrician come out anyway, but perhaps I would be okay with a Torus unit or something similar without all that?

Big Red Machine

Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #5 on: 22 May 2019, 12:34 am »
You would be surprised how few amps you really draw. Spend $30 and get on of these to find out for yourself





5 years ago I measured barely 3 watts being pulled form the wall for everything at full tilt (stereo).

TomS

Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #6 on: 22 May 2019, 12:35 am »
I regularly use one of these "Kill A Watt" meters to get a rough idea of the idle and full tilt current draw of my devices.

https://www.amazon.com/P3-P4400-Electricity-Usage-Monitor/dp/B00009MDBU

It is cheap, easy, and quite educational. Most of this gear draws very little current most of the time. Not enough to kick a breaker unless something is seriously malfunctioning, which is the intent of circuit protection.

ajzepp

Re: Need Advice...Don't Want to Explode the House
« Reply #7 on: 22 May 2019, 01:00 am »
I regularly use one of these "Kill A Watt" meters to get a rough idea of the idle and full tilt current draw of my devices.

https://www.amazon.com/P3-P4400-Electricity-Usage-Monitor/dp/B00009MDBU

It is cheap, easy, and quite educational. Most of this gear draws very little current most of the time. Not enough to kick a breaker unless something is seriously malfunctioning, which is the intent of circuit protection.

Ah, thanks for mentioning that. The Torus rep also suggested that, so I guess I need to get one since it seems to be a pretty consistent recommendation.