Tonearm recommendations?

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S Clark

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Tonearm recommendations?
« on: 13 Oct 2018, 10:05 pm »
I"ve got a Victor TT-81 coming in a week or so.  I'll need a tonearm to put in a pod.  I'd like to keep the cost in the $400-750 range.
Options that I've looked at are the Jelco 750-10" or 12" , SME 3009 series II at $450-550... and after that I could use some recommendations.
Anyone familiar with Tokyo Sound ST-14? 

sunnydaze

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #1 on: 14 Oct 2018, 01:45 am »
I think the Jelco 10 incher is a great choice at that price point.  I have one and like it very much.  So far I've used Denon 103R and Dyna xx2 Mk2 carts on it, both sound VG.  With the introduction of the new series of Jelco arms,  I bet if you shop carefully you can likely get it used for under $400.

As a point of reference, I've also owned the following arms:  Linn Ittok, Rega RB30, Graham 1.5 t/c, SME V, Kuzma Stogi Reference,  Kuzma Stogi "s",  Moerch UP-9, Hadcock 242, Origin Live Encounter Mk3C.......and probably a few more I've forgotten about.

« Last Edit: 14 Oct 2018, 03:00 pm by sunnydaze »

S Clark

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Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #2 on: 14 Oct 2018, 03:06 am »
I"m leaning toward the 750.  They're being discounted in Canada more that I can find in the US... 12" at around $550.   Would anyone pick  the SME 3009 over a new Jelco? 

WireNut

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #3 on: 14 Oct 2018, 02:48 pm »
Hi S Clark,

I'd also like to get a new arm for my TT-71 (JVC QL-7). It currently has a JVC/Victor ua-5045.
BTW, I'm currently replacing all the Electrolytic Caps in mine due to leakage.
You might want to have a look at yours when it comes in.
I plan on making a new plinth for it this winter.
Here's a picture of mine.






 

vinyl_lady

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #4 on: 14 Oct 2018, 03:10 pm »
I"m leaning toward the 750.  They're being discounted in Canada more that I can find in the US... 12" at around $550.   Would anyone pick  the SME 3009 over a new Jelco?
I would. I really like SME tonearms. 

Johnny2Bad

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #5 on: 14 Oct 2018, 03:27 pm »
Consider what cartridges you intend to use; of those you are considering the Jelco would be my choice for medium to low compliance cartridges and the SME if you want to be able to run high compliance cartridges.

S Clark

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Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #6 on: 14 Oct 2018, 04:57 pm »
Good advice, Johnny.  My cartridge collection that might go on this arm include a Dynavector 10x5, a Blackbird, and a Quintet Blue.  The Dyna and Sumiko are 12x10*-6  and the Quintet is 15.  The Jelco 750L eff. mass is 11g, the Jelco750E (10") is more at 13.25.   THe SME series II is 12.5.   In the series II Improved mass drops to 6.5, which should work on the blackbird but not a good match for the others. 

S Clark

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Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #7 on: 14 Oct 2018, 05:06 pm »
Wirenut,  after my TT81 arrives and get a prelim testing, I plan on recapping. 
So, you're planning on letting your Victor tonearm go?  I was actually looking at one on Fleabay for just over $100, thinking it was a good deal.  I think they are early Jelco arms?? What is your experience with yours?  If you have the upgrade bug, what are you hoping to improve? 

sunnydaze

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #8 on: 14 Oct 2018, 05:25 pm »
Good advice, Johnny.  My cartridge collection that might go on this arm include a Dynavector 10x5, a Blackbird, and a Quintet Blue.  The Dyna and Sumiko are 12x10*-6  and the Quintet is 15.  The Jelco 750L eff. mass is 11g, the Jelco750E (10") is more at 13.25.   THe SME series II is 12.5.   In the series II Improved mass drops to 6.5, which should work on the blackbird but not a good match for the others.

Since I own the 10 inch Jelco 750E I've done tons of research on effective mass and cartridge matching.....

For some ridic reason there is nothing definitive on its effective mass and "opinions" are all over the map.  I've seen figures from 13g to 22g.  The consensus seems to be it is on the heavier side, closer to 22g, and that it performs best with heavier and stiffer MC carts.  Hundreds of accounts out there about how well the Denon 103R works on it.

The 13g you quote puts it in the medium mass camp of most common modern arms: Rega and all its variants, Ittok, Kuzma, etc.   Are you sure of that figure?  Source?

PS:   I'm a bit confused.....how can the 12" L be heavier than the 10" E?

WireNut

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #9 on: 14 Oct 2018, 06:01 pm »
S Clark,

I have the upgrade bug but no funds at this time for a new arm.

Known problems with the Victor UA-5045/7045 arms are the sagging counter weight assembly.
I fixed mine but haven't tried it yet since I'm changing out the caps.
Also, one of the tiny set screws in the round collar broke because it was so tight, maybe with loc-tite. Not a big deal really, just aggravates me that I broke it.

It does have good followings and have adjustable VTA.

Other arms you may want to look at are the Fidelity Research arms, FR-54 is one of them.

Here's a couple before and after pics.

How do you like my dial indicator setup to help me adjust VTA, pretty cool you think  :D











WireNut

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #10 on: 14 Oct 2018, 06:42 pm »
A few more photos of the UA-5045.

Deteriorate rubber causing sag, that little tiny steel collar is only 3/16" long and has to hold up the entire counter weigh assembly (more sag),
plus it's 0.012 smaller in diameter then the hole in the arm, (even more sag), should be a slight press fit into the arm IMO.

If you can get one for $100.00 in good condition I'd go for it.












S Clark

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Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #11 on: 14 Oct 2018, 07:07 pm »
Since I own the 10 inch Jelco 750E I've done tons of research on effective mass and cartridge matching.....

For some ridic reason there is nothing definitive on its effective mass and "opinions" are all over the map.  I've seen figures from 13g to 22g.  The consensus seems to be it is on the heavier side, closer to 22g, and that it performs best with heavier and stiffer MC carts.  Hundreds of accounts out there about how well the Denon 103R works on it.

The 13g you quote puts it in the medium mass camp of most common modern arms: Rega and all its variants, Ittok, Kuzma, etc.   Are you sure of that figure?  Source?

PS:   I'm a bit confused.....how can the 12" L be heavier than the 10" E?

I have no idea how accurate the table below really is:


sunnydaze

Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #12 on: 15 Oct 2018, 01:28 am »
Read about the confusion and all the conflicting statements coming straight from the mfr in this short thread:

https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=60600

and another:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/effective-mass-of-jelco-tonearms

and another:

https://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?14911-Jelco-effective-mass

Dozens more of a similar vein all over the web -- google on "jelco effective mass".

Dunno why it's so hard for Jelco to provide accurate straightforward info on their arms. 
To my knowledge, this confusion does not exist for any other tonearm.

 :scratch:    :dunno:


S Clark

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Re: Tonearm recommendations?
« Reply #13 on: 15 Oct 2018, 01:56 am »
Thanks Sunnydaze, I read all  of those links... and they were... helpful, maybe...possibly... :roll:

I don't know.  I'm going to go listen to some records.  I'll think about tonearms tomorrow.