The Only 3 Knives You Really Need

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 3490 times.

S Clark

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 5475
  • measurement? We don't need no stinkin measurement
Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #60 on: 5 Oct 2018, 04:59 am »
I spoke to a Japanese knife vendor a couple of days ago who point blank said if I was cutting pumpkin don't use a Japanese knife. If true, that puts paid to the idea that you can use one knife 80-90% of the time (unless it's not Japanese) ? But what do the Japanese use :scratch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1G4-GCvA8KE&t=109s
A cleaver, or something with a softer blade that won't chip as easily.  A serrated bread knife should also do nicely. 
I suspect that a 63 hardness steel plunged with a bit of torque into something like a pumpkin could end badly. 

rollo

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 4036
  • Rollo Audio Where Home demo rules
Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #61 on: 5 Oct 2018, 03:55 pm »
  Chefs Knife, bread knife, parring knife. The most important thing is they are extremely sharp. Dull kinifes cause injury.

charles

Photon46

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #62 on: 5 Oct 2018, 09:30 pm »
I spoke to a Japanese knife vendor a couple of days ago who point blank said if I was cutting pumpkin don't use a Japanese knife. If true, that puts paid to the idea that you can use one knife 80-90% of the time (unless it's not Japanese) ? But what do the Japanese use :scratch:

This instead  :lol:




ctviggen

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 5063
Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #63 on: 6 Oct 2018, 09:44 am »
Since I don't eat bread (no wheat at all, causes chest congestion, asthma, and allergies for me), I use my "bread" knife to cut meat.  It does a better job on beef liver, for instance, than does a "normal" knife, as liver can be quite squirmy.  I use it for any boneless meat now. 

We have two different chef's knives and both have benefits and detriments.  One is thicker and heavier, and this is nice when you're trying to cut a block of cheese. But if you're trying to get a fine dice on an onion, I'll use the thinner one. 

JohnR

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #64 on: 10 Oct 2018, 05:24 pm »
We've been thinking about the problem wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAGrPiPshH0


JohnR

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #65 on: 10 Oct 2018, 05:26 pm »
Dull kinifes cause injury.

Hm, I'm not sure I believe that... I've never hurt myself with a dull knife...

jules

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #66 on: 10 Oct 2018, 11:00 pm »
The youtube clip raises a point ... blade thickness.

Here's my most used but quite boring knife on my very special wooden board:



Cutting a pumpkin with something thick, like a cleaver or heavy chefs knife is quite heavy duty and almost explosive. It works best if you use the blade like an axe or hammer, raising it high and delivering a massive blow but a thin blade is usually more surgical.

The Kiwi above is a reasonable compromise. It's easy to sharpen in 30 seconds using a whetstone [I use a round, two sided one, designed for racing axe sharpening, hand-held, under running water]. The knife edge can also be encouraged between stone sharpenings with a steel. Steels don't go down well with Japanese knife aficionados but they have their place.

Thin, light blades will race through some things, like mushrooms, even if dead blunt. They also cut quite a few vegetables when semi-sharp.   

JohnR

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #67 on: 12 Oct 2018, 08:50 am »
Well, those Kiwi knives certainly don't break the budget! I will get one to try. The special board seems like it would be easy on the edge....

I'm starting to think that Japanese knives are not for the casual user... at least in terms of sharpening - https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/a-basic-explanation-of-asymmetry.33951/

JohnR

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #68 on: 12 Oct 2018, 09:01 am »
Handles. I handled a Wusthof classic the other day and was surprised at how small the handle was. This was on a 10" breadknife, so not a little knife. I guess it takes a while to learn what you like, very hard to tell from photos.

jules

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #69 on: 14 Oct 2018, 09:32 pm »
Some thoughts on the kitchen knife forum clip ...

The images in the article aren't to scale so it's impossible to know how significant the bevel is but bevels on the edge of a blade are a form of bluntness, even if they have a sharp edge. A beveled edge just doesn't cut in the same way as the same blade with a natural form to the edge. There was a period when many top level kitchen knife makers sold their knives with a pronounced bevel on the edge. First task of any buyer was to remove the bevel. In addition, when a bevel gets blunt it gets really blunt! A bevel makes a less chip prone edge but that doesn't mean it holds its edge better.

The asymmetry idea depends a lot of how much you hate stickage Personally I'd prefer to have a certain amount of stickage rather than the inevitable "turn" that comes from a single sided blade [used for something other than what it was designed for] or an asymmetric sharpen. As the article says, it's only partly possible to counteract the "turn" with a bevel.

Yes, it's odd about bread knife handles. Why so many manufacturers have agreed to small handles on bread knives and ham knives I don't know. Wusthof chefs knives don't suffer from the same problem.

The board I use is Huon pine. I feel a little guilty about using such a rare timber but it's far and away  the best surface I've ever used. Same timber as I used for the GK-1 pre-amp in my avatar.


JohnR

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #70 on: 18 Oct 2018, 06:20 am »
I didn't realize the Wusthof were different size handles (except for large/small knives in general). I figured out why square handles shaped with finger indents are so awkward (for me anyway) - the handle shape works only if you hold the knife like a hammer, however you never hold the knife that way. (*) Even if you only hold the handle (sometimes called the "hammer grip" it seems), you have to rotate the knife a lot from the actual hammer grip. Anyway I guess I'm much preferring round handles.

I've also discovered that knives are not always straight  :o

(*) Except for a cleaver I guess.
« Last Edit: 18 Oct 2018, 10:23 am by JohnR »

jules

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #71 on: 18 Oct 2018, 09:54 pm »

I've also discovered that knives are not always straight  :o


Ooops yes, I should have said something about that. I've seen some Kiwis that have a bend in them when new. It's nearly impossible and very scary trying to bend them back to straight. Hmm, maybe it is impossible. I can't remember ever having succeeded in the task.

Rob Babcock

  • Volunteer
  • Posts: 9125
Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #72 on: 19 Oct 2018, 06:02 am »
You do often get blades that aren't flat, especially very thin knives.  Nothing is more frustrating than spending an hour trying to sharpen a knife and not getting anywhere, then realizing it's not flat! :duh:

IMO the handle doesn't need to be very big.  The correct technique is the 'pinch grip' where you have you hold the knife with your thumb and forefinger; the other fingers just kind curl under the handle out of the way, just light pressure.

MaxCast

Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #73 on: 19 Oct 2018, 09:12 am »
Is the pinch grip proper for all cutting and chopping?

roscoe65

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 659
Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #74 on: 19 Oct 2018, 11:38 am »
The pinch grip is one grip that is proper for cutting and chopping.  It generally is suitable when using a western-style chef's knife with a rocker.

Rob Babcock

  • Volunteer
  • Posts: 9125
Re: The Only 3 Knives You Really Need
« Reply #75 on: 20 Oct 2018, 05:59 am »
Is the pinch grip proper for all cutting and chopping?

Yeah.  It's all about control.  Pick up a pencil as if you're going to write your name; how are you holding the pencil?  In a "hammer grip" where you use your fist how would you like to write a letter that way?  Same principle with the knife.  If you were going something that requires a bit of muscle (and we're going to stipulate you're being very careful) you might use a hammer grip to bring more force to bear.  Maybe cutting through a leg bone or halving a squash for example, that would maybe a rare case for using a hammer grip.