Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S

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kazsud

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Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« on: 22 Jul 2018, 11:49 pm »
My source is the Schiit Yggdrasil and pre-amp if needed will be a Schiit Freya.

I’m familiar w/ Nuforce and NuPrime as ive had the Dac100 and hap100 if I remember correctly. I also had the Icon HDP w/ the S-1 and W-1.

The Argon1 will be here in two days and will have a PS Audio Sprout 100 for a couple days from a friend just to be able to here the speakers.
« Last Edit: 23 Jul 2018, 05:07 pm by kazsud »

zoom25

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Re: Best amp for Aphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #1 on: 23 Jul 2018, 12:20 am »
Give the Amphion Amp100 a try. I preferred it to other amps I've tried with my Amphion One15. Most of the folks using Amphions really like the Amphion amps. They've been put up against lot of top Class A and AB, with the Amphion coming off as sounding 'right.' I agree. I leave it on 24/7 and it sounds perfect. The Anaview modules for the Amphion amp was designed by Anaview while using Amphion speakers as their reference. Made for each other.

kazsud

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Re: Best amp for Aphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #2 on: 23 Jul 2018, 11:45 am »
Thanks.

I've heard a lot of good things about it but info on it isn't out there. I had to email Amphion just to find out it's class D.

A few years ago Amphion and Nuforce at the time did a lot of cross promotion because the two sound good together, that's why I decided to check here.

My end game pre-amp is the P-20 but that's not gonna happen anytime soon.


Genez

Re: Best amp for Aphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #3 on: 30 Jul 2018, 03:18 am »
Give the Amphion Amp100 a try. I preferred it to other amps I've tried with my Amphion One15. Most of the folks using Amphions really like the Amphion amps. They've been put up against lot of top Class A and AB, with the Amphion coming off as sounding 'right.' I agree. I leave it on 24/7 and it sounds perfect. The Anaview modules for the Amphion amp was designed by Anaview while using Amphion speakers as their reference. Made for each other.

I have also a Yggdrasil....  I tried the Freya and found it too dull sounding for my tastes.  I also listened with a TDSS modded NuForce HAP 100, and a NuPrime HPA 9. Both sounded decent, and the HPA9 was a bit smoother sounding.  Then,  I found that the ST-10 really likes tubes. I am now enjoying a Pro-Ject NS Box Tube preamplifier that sounds much more distinct and detailed than the Freya.  The ST-10 should play those Amphion speakers beautifully with (IMO) a tube front end.  If you find the Freya sounding a bit dull, you might want to look at the Pro-Ject RS Box preamp. I run the tube preamp with balanced cables.  Balanced with the Yggdrasil is about as good as balanced gets.   

I was hoping that NuPrime would offer a balanced/tube preamp, because the Nuprime proprietary volume control is one of the best made.  But, since it was not to be found? I had to seek my tube preamp elsewhere.

zoom25

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Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #4 on: 30 Jul 2018, 02:48 pm »
There's a lot of info on the Amp100 and Amp500 pairings with the Amphion monitors on Gearslutz.

This is the main thread: https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/949764-amphion-beautiful.html

Genez

Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #5 on: 30 Jul 2018, 03:56 pm »
There's a lot of info on the Amp100 and Amp500 pairings with the Amphion monitors on Gearslutz.

This is the main thread: https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/949764-amphion-beautiful.html

Gearslutz is about studio mixing work.  Not home audio.  They are similar, but also different in objectives.

Amphion began as a generic OEM D amp module from another company that has been spiced up by Amphion to their taste.  Its not the same thing as what NuPrime has done, which is to perfect their own proprietary unit. It was NuForce (pre NuPrime) that set Class D in a position to be taken seriously by the Hi End critics. But, not the other companies (who were around at that time) that make generic D units for others to use in their amps. 

I recently tried a PS Audio S300 which uses the B&O class D module that PSA tweaked to their taste. It sounds like that Gearslutz review said about the Amphion...  The NuPrime ST10 simply runs a considerable circle around it.  Yes... the PSA sounds nice and impressive liker the Amphion.. as long as its not compared.  But, the ST10 has a soul that simply sets it apart.  I never heard the Amphion amps.  But, evidently, Amphion does not have the expertise to manufacture their own class D.  That says something as well. 

zoom25

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Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #6 on: 30 Jul 2018, 05:03 pm »
The modules inside the Amphion amps are from Anaview (AMS0100 - Amphion Amp100 or AMS1000 - Amphion Amp500). The guys from Anaview designed those amps while using Amphion speakers as a reference. Anssi (owner of Amphion) tested out a lot of amplifier designs before settling on those. Lots of users have tried amps from stuff like Parasound, Bryston, ATC, Hypex, and Naim. I've tried a few myself. The Amphion amp gets it right for long term listening.

There are lots of people using those pro Amphion speakers for casual home use and hi-fi listening at home with great results.

I'd give Anssi an email and ask him what he recommends for the models you are interested in.

rustydoglim

Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #7 on: 30 Jul 2018, 05:21 pm »
As far as I know, in Class-D amps, Hypex is the only credible competitor to Nuprime today, and there are fundamental reasons that we have moved passed them:
1. business model - NuPrime is in the business of making our own amp at whatever cost/price we want to push. So in that regards, we can continue to push the envelope of class D amp design as we see fit. The result is rapid innovation that resulted in many variations of amps, and finally Evolution One (unmatched by any amp regardless of class).
Hypex on the other hand, is in the OEM business. i.e. designs are made for cost and volume considerations. It is not in their business to design something with only 500 units of annual production. That will not make financial sense.
The difference is between a high quality restaurant chain versus a gourmet restaurant.
2. Companies who are using Hypex modules can only do incremental improvement - sure, it can still be quite dramatic improvement when you upgrade the power supply, Opamps, some passive components along the signal path.
But common sense tells you that these can only be incremental improvement.  You can't change the fundamental design.

In our opinion, the most advance Class-D amp like the Evolution One has already surpassed almost all Class A, AB, tube designs. Those technologies can only go so far relying on device characteristic.
In the most advance class-D design, we can combined device characteristic (ie using Class A transistors circuit) with innovative architecture.

rustydoglim

Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #8 on: 30 Jul 2018, 05:24 pm »
By the way, this is a NuPrime circle.
So, lets not turn this into a NuPrime versus Amphion Amp debate.
Otherwise I have to delete this thread.

Anssi is my friend and I am in no way disparaging Amphion Amp. I am sure some NuPrime amps would sound just as good as Amphion amp when pairing with their speakers. So it is up to the users to choose what he likes to hear.

Genez

Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #9 on: 30 Jul 2018, 05:50 pm »
By the way, this is a NuPrime circle.
So, lets not turn this into a NuPrime versus Amphion Amp debate.
Otherwise I have to delete this thread.

Anssi is my friend and I am in no way disparaging Amphion Amp. I am sure some NuPrime amps would sound just as good as Amphion amp when pairing with their speakers. So it is up to the users to choose what he likes to hear.

Ironically... Amphion in its earlier days used to endorse the NuForce line of amps.   Its where I learned about Amphion when learning about NuForce.  Amphion knows the value of good class D.   

I am happy with my ST-10 TDSS amplifier.  An audiophile quality tube preamp is something I would recommend for enjoying a synergistic feast with the two.  The ST-10 was born for tube preamps.  IMHO. 
« Last Edit: 7 Aug 2018, 04:07 am by Genez »

Genez

Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #10 on: 7 Aug 2018, 04:08 am »
Here is that Amphion Nuforce (pre-Nuprime) article I spoke about....


http://highfidelity.pl/@main-370&lang=en

kazsud

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Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #11 on: 12 Dec 2018, 09:28 pm »
The modules inside the Amphion amps are from Anaview (AMS0100 - Amphion Amp100 or AMS1000 - Amphion Amp500). The guys from Anaview designed those amps while using Amphion speakers as a reference. Anssi (owner of Amphion) tested out a lot of amplifier designs before settling on those. Lots of users have tried amps from stuff like Parasound, Bryston, ATC, Hypex, and Naim. I've tried a few myself. The Amphion amp gets it right for long term listening.

There are lots of people using those pro Amphion speakers for casual home use and hi-fi listening at home with great results.

I'd give Anssi an email and ask him what he recommends for the models you are interested in.

Yeah I got the Amp100 and it's not really fun sounding enough for me so I'm looking again.

kazsud

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Re: Best amp for Amphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #12 on: 12 Dec 2018, 09:29 pm »
By the way, this is a NuPrime circle.
So, lets not turn this into a NuPrime versus Amphion Amp debate.
Otherwise I have to delete this thread.

Anssi is my friend and I am in no way disparaging Amphion Amp. I am sure some NuPrime amps would sound just as good as Amphion amp when pairing with their speakers. So it is up to the users to choose what he likes to hear.

I'm sorry.
I posted looking for Nuprime/Nuforce recommendations.

kazsud

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  • Posts: 44
Re: Best amp for Aphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #13 on: 12 Dec 2018, 09:33 pm »
I have also a Yggdrasil....  I tried the Freya and found it too dull sounding for my tastes.  I also listened with a TDSS modded NuForce HAP 100, and a NuPrime HPA 9. Both sounded decent, and the HPA9 was a bit smoother sounding.  Then,  I found that the ST-10 really likes tubes. I am now enjoying a Pro-Ject NS Box Tube preamplifier that sounds much more distinct and detailed than the Freya.  The ST-10 should play those Amphion speakers beautifully with (IMO) a tube front end.  If you find the Freya sounding a bit dull, you might want to look at the Pro-Ject RS Box preamp. I run the tube preamp with balanced cables.  Balanced with the Yggdrasil is about as good as balanced gets.   

I was hoping that NuPrime would offer a balanced/tube preamp, because the Nuprime proprietary volume control is one of the best made.  But, since it was not to be found? I had to seek my tube preamp elsewhere.

I'm considering the ST-10 TDSS but I saw a single used Ref20 for 900 so the thought of Ref20s is giving me goosebumps. If I can find a pair used for around 2k I can sell some random stuff to get end gamed  :D

Genez

Re: Best amp for Aphion Argon1, possibly Argon 3S
« Reply #14 on: 12 Dec 2018, 10:21 pm »
I'm considering the ST-10 TDSS but I saw a single used Ref20 for 900 so the thought of Ref20s is giving me goosebumps. If I can find a pair used for around 2k I can sell some random stuff to get end gamed  :D

What you saw was Nuforce, or Nuprime?  The ST-10 by design improvements is quieter than the original Nuforce Ref20's.  TDSS modding the Nuforce Reference 20's should bring them to their full potential.