Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 1912 times.

Angaria

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 344
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #20 on: 9 Jul 2018, 12:29 am »
Frankly you should buy the four 10" woofers I have available - DLP-10 - designed for open baffle.

Hearhead

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 12
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #21 on: 9 Jul 2018, 03:09 am »
So far I count only 3 recos (the Dayton Classic, GRS and the DPLs) any more recos?

Just read somewhere about a minimum QTS value to follow for OB?

Will the woofers above and to follow strictly follow these parameters?

JohnR

Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #22 on: 9 Jul 2018, 11:34 am »
The DPL-10s are nice woofers...

AJinFLA

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 1034
  • Soundfield Audio Loudspeakers
    • Soundfield Audio
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #23 on: 9 Jul 2018, 03:25 pm »
Thinking of buying two plate amps for this (got a passive pre and an SET tube amplifier at 18watts for the full range mids) eq and crossover to be handled by dsp.

I can be happy at an average loudness of 85db

If the grs subs are really on the money for this setup i can allocate some of the funds for an amp so Im open to any suggestions that can handle the low end pretty well.

Are the GRS subs articulate if I cross them at 200-300hz and aim for them to reach flat to at least 40to45hz?

Just read somewhere about a minimum QTS value to follow for OB?
With DSP, you can use just about any woofer you want. The key as I noted earlier, is clean displacement capability.
The woofer I suggested, the GRS, has a Q of around 0.65, but more importantly, 8.5mm xmax, a 2" VC and 34hz resonance. It's also relatively low inductance and mms, so yes, you will get clean articulate bass comfortably in your SPL range and low end extension.
With plate amps, the DSP requirements become minimal, as there are some with built in bass boost that will compensate nicely for the LF roll off /baffle loss. The PE Yung line with 6db bass boost are also budget friendly. The only wild card would be their low pass filters are 200hz max, but that is electrical. The combined electro-acoustic filter response will be higher, but 300hz might be cutting it close, even with a flat baffle (the best for symmetrical upper end response).
If I can find a baffle on hand in storage I'll cobble something up later to show actual response.
Another option in your budget range is the Peerless SLS10. Similar specs to GRS, around $60ea...and nicer looking IMO, if that matters.
Both, with 4 total drivers, will easily meet your stated requirements.
Make sure to post build pics.

cheers,

AJ

Hearhead

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 12
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #24 on: 10 Jul 2018, 09:40 am »

With plate amps, the DSP requirements become minimal, as there are some with built in bass boost that will compensate nicely for the LF roll off /baffle loss. The PE Yung line with 6db bass boost are also budget friendly. The only wild card would be their low pass filters are 200hz max, but that is electrical. The combined electro-acoustic filter response will be higher, but 300hz might be cutting it close, even with a flat baffle (the best for symmetrical upper end response).

cheers,

AJ

Hi! Does this mean I have to cross the fullrange driver to at least 150hz? Thanks Again!

AJinFLA

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 1034
  • Soundfield Audio Loudspeakers
    • Soundfield Audio
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #25 on: 10 Jul 2018, 01:14 pm »
Hi! Does this mean I have to cross the fullrange driver to at least 150hz? Thanks Again!
No, you can cross >200hz...just maybe not 300hz as explained above...if using the inexpensive Yungs with their 200hz max electrical filters.
If for example, you splurged on the Dayton SPA250DSP, you could cross as high as 400hz. With the sub amps DSP low pass in "Bypass", the FR extends to around 400hz -6db iirc (have measurement buried somewhere on another device).
An 8" fullrange should have no issue crossing >150hz, though higher is recommended if you keep the baffle around the 8 very narrow for best off axis. Keep in mind the lower you cross, the higher your excursion requirement, the higher, vice versa.

cheers,

AJ

JeffB

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 487
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #26 on: 10 Jul 2018, 11:04 pm »
I recommended the Dayton 10s, because
1) They are not too much money
2) I thought the specs looked pretty good with a low fs and what I thought was decent xmax for the price.
3) The reputation of Dayton being pretty good.
4) I once wondered if I could get away with 4 of these per side on a narrow baffle.
Actually I still wonder.

I should add that the Qt is lower than ideal and that I have never actually heard them.

I just looked at the specs for the DPL 10 suggested above and the DPL10 looks much better on paper.
Huge xmax, low fs, .76 Qt. XBL motor.
It does have a very low SPL though.


I have a flat open baffle using a Warrior 15" on 18" wide baffle.
That combo makes some really great sounding articulate bass.
I have my doubts about 2 10s per side being able to produce adequate bass on a narrow baffle.

AJinFLA

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 1034
  • Soundfield Audio Loudspeakers
    • Soundfield Audio
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #27 on: 11 Jul 2018, 01:40 am »
Hearhead,

Here are 2xGRS10sw-4 on a smallish 12"w x 30"h flat baffle, driven by a Yung SD200-6 (6+ db boost at 35Hz). No DSP eq, measured at 1m, plate amp low pass filter at max 200hz.



You should be able to cross a 8" fullrange >200hz

cheers,

AJ

Hearhead

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 12
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #28 on: 11 Jul 2018, 02:23 am »
Hearhead,

Here are 2xGRS10sw-4 on a smallish 12"w x 30"h flat baffle, driven by a Yung SD200-6 (6+ db boost at 35Hz). No DSP eq, measured at 1m, plate amp low pass filter at max 200hz.



You should be able to cross a 8" fullrange >200hz

cheers,

AJ

Now that’s enlightening!!!!

Thanks so much for the help!!

Now to pull the trigger on this build!

gab

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 498
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #29 on: 11 Jul 2018, 04:20 pm »
deleted

AJinFLA

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 1034
  • Soundfield Audio Loudspeakers
    • Soundfield Audio
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #30 on: 11 Jul 2018, 04:34 pm »
AJ - those GRS drivers are 4 ohm. Does that Yung amp handle a ~2 ohm load or did you wire them in series for an 8 ohm load?

these https://www.parts-express.com/grs-10sw-4-10-poly-cone-subwoofer-4-ohm--292-482.
The pole vent is a bit small but a pair in series is an easy amp load and the 8.5mm xmax might be sufficient unless you need fairly high SPL.
Series  :)

gab

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 498
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #31 on: 11 Jul 2018, 04:35 pm »
Yeah - I read the first page and tried to hit delete real quick!  :D

JohnR

Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #32 on: 12 Jul 2018, 04:13 am »
The thing with plate amps is you would need to build enclosures for them. You don't want the back exposed anywhere someone could stick their finger on it.

Another possible option: old AV receiver with analog inputs. Nobody wants 'em but the amps are still good. Then you would use one channel per driver. The GRS driver needs about 60W to Xmax at 40 Hz (according to unibox).

Just a thought - as they are likely around cheap or possibly even free. May take a bit more work to locate a good one (analog input, decent power, won't blow up with 4 ohm load).

Hearhead

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 12
Re: Value For Money 10" Dual Woofers for Open Baffle
« Reply #33 on: 16 Jul 2018, 09:06 am »
The thing with plate amps is you would need to build enclosures for them. You don't want the back exposed anywhere someone could stick their finger on it.

Another possible option: old AV receiver with analog inputs. Nobody wants 'em but the amps are still good. Then you would use one channel per driver. The GRS driver needs about 60W to Xmax at 40 Hz (according to unibox).

Just a thought - as they are likely around cheap or possibly even free. May take a bit more work to locate a good one (analog input, decent power, won't blow up with 4 ohm load).

Interesting! I can hunt for a decent used power amp that can go down to 4ohm and at least 80 watts so I can fully use the GRS' potential.