[gregfisk]

Hey Greg,

Did you ever get a chance to compare a Class D amp to your other amp? If so, which Class D amp and what was the outcome?

Funny you mention this today, Michael is getting his amp shipped to him tomorrow. Like Jack mentioned I have been using the amp for a few months now and really enjoying it. I just ordered a 1200as2 based amp from Rogue Audio in Italy today. They call it the Studio 10 and I really like the looks of it. The amp I currently own is a Butler 2250 which is a hybrid amp with a tube in each channel at the output stage. I like this amp and have owned it for a long time now. The main difference between the two is Micheal's amp has more transparency and detail. They both have a warmish presentation and plenty of power to run most speakers with ease.

Mine will be balanced which works a lot better with my balanced Lampi Atlantic. I had the opportunity to hear a Takachi cased amp which was balanced and Micheal's single ended Mivera SE amp together and the balanced amp sounded better with my Atlantic. 

I didn't get to hear the Don Sach amp which is also Micheal's along side the SE and I really can't guess which one I like better. I do know I really liked Don's amp thou like I mentioned earlier in this thread. I remember thinking I would love to have it but didn't like the idea of all those tubes. For how good that amp sounds it is probably worth it thou.

Take Care,

Greg

[JackD]

who?me?

My ST-10 has been a great amp with both the M3TS and the M3TM's and I would expect the new mono's to be even better with some of the circuit improvements they have made.  I am running the Mivera Purepower balanced with the M3TM's for now and while like the Nord (NC-500) it does a good job I can't tell you that it betters the Nuprime. Any of the three would be an acceptable stopping point depending on which "flavor" you prefer. 

[Wind Chaser]

I am running the Mivera Purepower balanced with the M3TM's for now and while like the Nord (NC-500) it does a good job I can't tell you that it betters the Nuprime.

Well that's very interesting considering all of Mivera's hyperbole.

[Tyson]

who?me?

My ST-10 has been a great amp with both the M3TS and the M3TM's and I would expect the new mono's to be even better with some of the circuit improvements they have made.  I am running the Mivera Purepower balanced with the M3TM's for now and while like the Nord (NC-500) it does a good job I can't tell you that it betters the Nuprime. Any of the three would be an acceptable stopping point depending on which "flavor" you prefer. 

Felt the same way about his DAC when I had it in my system.  Good but definitely not better than the Auralic Vega.

[Wind Chaser]

I didn't get to hear the Don Sach amp which is also Micheal's along side the SE and I really can't guess which one I like better.

How much price difference between Don's amp and the 1200 you ordered from Rogue?

One thing for sure the Rogue will run much cooler. Also no tubes means more reliability. I would also bet that it will be faster, more transparent and detailed. I would also suspect better bass but that's sort of a moot point since you have specialized amps specifically for that task.

[Wind Chaser]

Felt the same way about his DAC when I had it in my system.  Good but definitely not better than the Auralic Vega.

Which DAC was that?

[dspringham]

who?me?

My ST-10 has been a great amp with both the M3TS and the M3TM's and I would expect the new mono's to be even better with some of the circuit improvements they have made.  I am running the Mivera Purepower balanced with the M3TM's for now and while like the Nord (NC-500) it does a good job I can't tell you that it betters the Nuprime. Any of the three would be an acceptable stopping point depending on which "flavor" you prefer.

Jack,

I was wondering when you would be posting your impressions of the Mivera Purepower. It seems that it is in the wheelhouse with the Nuprime and Nords, however I don't get the impression from you the it "blows the doors" off of everything else in it's catagory (despite all of the hype).

I have a pair of M3 TM's on the way and will try them first with my Vinnie Rossi DHT LIO using the internal Mosfet amp. Next will be the Nord One UP SE's NC500. Also have a JOB 225 but I'm concerned the high gain may be an issue. Have you ever tried your JOB on the M3's?

Wish I hadn't sold my DAC10/St-10 combo a while ago. Of course that was before I bought the M3's.

Dave

[JackD]

Dave

My impressions of the Mivera are strictly confined to my perception of how it sounds with the M3TM's in comparison the the Nord (with both the Sparkos and SI op amps) and the ST-10.  The W4S mAmps were only here for the M3TS version. How the Mivera would stack up with a different loudspeaker I have not attempted to find out as the Class D amps were for use in that system due to size and ability to operate cooly in a "cabinet environment.  In this setup with the OPPO 203, DAC-10 and Auralic Aries. I prefer the Nuprime.  Part may be synergy with the speaker or with the DAC-10.  While it was breaking in in my Office system with the Reynaud Twin Signatures I honestly didn't pay much attention to it plus I was using the OPPO Sonica as Streamer/DAC and preamp in this setup and it's preamp section using the ESS Chipset is average to below at best.  I have not tried it in the Main system as in the Spatial based system the amps are run from the balanced outputs of the DAC-10 and the Rythmik subs from the SE outputs at line level.  In the main system the Rythmik subs are run speaker level which you can't do with the Class D amps so it would require me to rewire and re-calibrate the subs for a "test run" and as of now I have felt that was too much trouble though I may change my mind at some point.  If it worked well with the Nola's or the incoming Verity Otello's it would cut down on the heat in the scorching Florida heat. 

As to your question about the Job 225 and the Spatial's I don't think I ever tried it.  Based on it's sonic signature it should work well sound wise with the M3TS.  My only concern would be if you pushed it too hard with really loud steady volume as it always seemed uncomfortable with low impedance loads and stress.  If your just talking about "normal" levels it should be fine and the gain would only be an issue if you were using the LIO as preamp only and it had a high gain number which I don't think it does as the specs show 6-9 db at the max and with the integrated's outputs maybe 0db. 

With the Spatial's the Mivera reminds me most of the Nord with the Sparkos op amps and with the Spatial's the SI op amps work better.

[gregfisk]

How much price difference between Don's amp and the 1200 you ordered from Rogue?

One thing for sure the Rogue will run much cooler. Also no tubes means more reliability. I would also bet that it will be faster, more transparent and detailed. I would also suspect better bass but that's sort of a moot point since you have specialized amps specifically for that task.

The Rouge Studio N10 is $1030.00 to my door from Italy. It is a very attractive price for what you get. I don't know how much the Don Sach amp costs but of course it is more. All of your points are spot on but the Don Sach amp really did sound good in my room. I do like the idea of not dealing with a bunch of tubes and having the amp so much lighter and cool running. The Studio N10 is nice looking in my opinion but isn't near as sexy as Don's tube amp. I did get the LED switch on the front to match my Lampi Atlantic LED switch so that was a big bonus .

Jack, it is very interesting you find the 3 class D amps you mention similar in sound quality considering the price differences between them. I didn't realize the ST-10 was as good as the others so I learned something about that.

[JackD]

Greg

To my ears with the Spatial's at least the Nuprime is that good and worth a try if you can get John or somebody to let you try one that is broken in.  There is also a brand new one for sale from a dealer in Ontario for a good price that includes shipping and Paypal fees. With the Nola's the Nord with the Sparko's and the Modwright LS-100 was a better combo. Therein is the advantage of the Nord in some cases with the ability to "tune" it with the op amps. I don't know if Michael did any more comparison between his base Mivera and the ST-10 before he came home but you might ask him. 

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lis8jfj4-nuprime-st-10-power-amplifier-new-warranty-incl-insured-shipping-paypal-solid-state?refsource=hifishark

[Tyson]

Which DAC was that?

The Purestream.

[gregfisk]

Thanks for the link Jack, that is a very good price for sure. After having Michael's SE in my room I wouldn't want to have any less headroom than what that amp can give me. On most recordings I had more than enough power but on some it was nice to have more, probably because of the size of my room. 

To the OP, if monoblocks are a must the 1200as2 boards are stereo but apparently the 1200as1 boards will be out soon. I know at least Rouge will be selling them as monoblocks shortly. The NC500 amps by Nord can be purchased as monoblocks as well. Someone else would have to tell you whether Nuprime has the ST-10 in a monoblock configuration as I don't know.

NOTE: I just looked to see who the OP was and realized he hasn't been back here since starting this thread? Well, at least the rest of us are entertaining ourselves

Greg

[JackD]

The ST-10 mono's have been out a couple of months now.

[Wind Chaser]

The new Nuprime Evolution is supposed to be quite a step forward for Nuprime, those are the mono blocks I’d like to hear, but I am perfectly content happy with the Maraschino mono amps. They are clearly the best amps I’ve heard regardless of price and a perfect match for M3ts.

[OzarkTom]

Confucius says:

He who shouts the loudest not necessarily the best.

Oh. not Confucius?