[randytsuch]

Hope this is right forum.

We have had some recent burglaries on our normally quiet street, so wife instructed me to install a security camera system.

Looking at three cameras to start with, front door, driveway/entrance to side gate, and rear of house to cover two back doors.

I started looking at packages systems from Costco, Amazon, etc, but then found ipcamtalk.com, and spent the weekend researching what they recommend and use there.
Decided to buy the pieces myself, so I can get exactly what I want.

Now I'm looking at a Dahua NVR4208 as the recorder.  Could also go with a PC, but they are not too expensive, and figure it's easier to just buy this.

And maybe Dahua turret style cameras.  Still researching cameras at the moment, lots of choices.  But they recommend using the same manufacturer DVR and camera.

BTW, Hikvision is the other big chinese DVR/camera source, and probably better known, but I've read good things about Dahua support and DVR's.  Cameras are supposed to be about the same.  Dahua looks to be cheaper too.  Lots of the brands you can buy here is rebranded Hikvision or Dahua.

Want the system to record and send email alerts on movement, with ability to filter out areas.  So, if anyone comes up the front steps, and into the driveway, I get an email alert.

Also want to be able to monitor cams from my android phone, or wife's iphone, but securely.  I don't want my cam feeds on the internet lol.

For mounting the cameras, I started with wifi so would only need power, but I looked at my house this weekend, and decided to run them as POE instead.  Then I don't have to worry about reception and bandwidth.  Just have to make sure no exposed wires, everything in conduit.
The two in front can be wired through the garage without too much problem, and I think I can get help from my handyman to pull the one to the back from the garage, without breaking into drywall.

Any advice would be welcome.

Randy

[ACHiPo]

Anxiously awaiting learning.  It's something I've been toying with for a while, but not seriously.

[Phil A]

Probably won't find them in warehouse clubs, but when I had the house built, I had it prewired. I have Digital Watchdog (App) and a VMAX DVR. I've found their support very good.

[Phil A]

btw - this is their website - http://digital-watchdog.com/

[randytsuch]

Thanks Phil

As with many things these days, there is a choice here of inexpensive Chinese stuff with minimal tech and warranty support.
There are some US distributors I think, like Newegg and BH, add some cost for warranty support.

Or you pick what is likely rebranded stuff, but with possible better software, tech and warranty support.

Depends on your ability to make it work, and whether you think it's worth your time to get the cheaper stuff working.

I'll look into both.  I also talked to Scott F. yesterday and he recommended Acti cameras, said he uses them all the time, but honestly I am cheap and will likely go with cheap Chinese stuff.

I also changed my mind about NVR, planning to build a PC, have almost all the parts from previous projects, except may need to upgrade processor, and also need another windows license. 

Randy

[gregfisk]

Hi Randy,

I'm in the alarm business and we install HIK Vision all the time...

Very good product for the money and you are correct they make a ton of OEM for everyone one else. We have had great luck with the product with almost no failures. One NVR that failed and two cameras which were bad out of box. This is with around a hundred or more installs so far. The picture is very good and night vision is actually better that most. We use the low cost bullet cameras which are 720p but you can get the 1080p cameras for a little more. I don't think I would build a computer, the NVRs have a lot of great features and are made for pretty much plug and play operation.

I don't know what this stuff costs on line but I get it on sale from my vendor all the time and would be happy to sell it at cost as long as you pick up the shipping. Or depending on where you live I can send you to my vendor and you can pick it up.

Let me know if I can help.

Greg

[randytsuch]

Hey Greg
Thanks so much, now another thing to consider 

I've been looking most at 2mp IP cameras.  I'll figure out a hikvision part number, would be great if you can get the cost from your vendor.  Maybe one turret style, and a bullet style.  I guess I'll price a NVR too. 

I'll PM you when I figure out the numbers.

Randy

[srb]

If you already have a Synology or QNAP NAS, or were planning on getting one for media server and backup duties, they both have surveillance apps.

Running on a lower power 24/7 Linux-based NAS is probably a more efficient platform with less maintenance than using a PC.  Synology Surveillance Station supports 4700 camera models from 90 manufacturers and the maximum number of cameras will depend on the model chosen.

Steve

[gregfisk]

Hey Greg
Thanks so much, now another thing to consider 

I've been looking most at 2mp IP cameras.  I'll figure out a hikvision part number, would be great if you can get the cost from your vendor.  Maybe one turret style, and a bullet style.  I guess I'll price a NVR too. 

I'll PM you when I figure out the numbers.

Randy

Randy, I'm happy to help.

The NVR we use is the 7604 (4 channel) or 7608 (8 channel)

The HX 2032 series is 3mp and they work really well.

The thing is about using the NVR is it is so easy and I can't imagine you could save much money, they are just not that expensive.

If you are not in a hurry they go on sale all the time and pricing is really good.

An example: The 7608 with 2TB HD is $440.00, the 3mp dome cameras this month are $110.00 each. Pretty darn good pricing and it's all very impressive. That's for this month, every month something else from them is on sale. I'm not a big fan of turret cameras, I like the bullets or the domes myself.

[randytsuch]

That is a good price for a 3mp dome.

As far as turrets, its what the "gurus" at ipcam like, and they know more than me lol.

For the PC, I have most of the parts already, that's why its cheap for me.
Otherwise, yes it would cost more than $440.  I need to cost the hard drives, and figure out how much it would cost me for the PC vs that price for a NVR.  If I get a NVR, I wanted a 8 ch one, and 2 tb sounds good.

Randy

[gregfisk]

That is a good price for a 3mp dome.

As far as turrets, its what the "gurus" at ipcam like, and they know more than me lol.

For the PC, I have most of the parts already, that's why its cheap for me.
Otherwise, yes it would cost more than $440.  I need to cost the hard drives, and figure out how much it would cost me for the PC vs that price for a NVR.  If I get a NVR, I wanted a 8 ch one, and 2 tb sounds good.

Randy

Hey Randy,

I'm not trying to talk you into anything because well, I'm not making any money But it seems like a lot of work to get a PC to do what the NVR already does out of the box. It is literally plug and play. The cameras are all powered from the NVR, just put RJ45 ends on your cat5e and plug the cameras in. The turret cameras are cheaper but that's exactly why I don't like them, they seem a lot cheaper when you put them in.

Anyway, the NVR is on sale this month and my guess is next month the other camera types will probably be on sale, or at lease one of the two other types. These prices are about 30% off my normal price so you will want to buy them on sale.

Just let me know if I can help. Also, let me know where you live, we might get lucky and you can pick them up, so no shipping.

[rif]

Check out Ubiquiti.  I'm very happy with their wifi and router, i have no reason to doubt their surveillance gear.  You don't need to use their nvr - they give you the software for free.

https://www.ubnt.com/enterprise/#unifi-video

[randytsuch]

Check out Ubiquiti.  I'm very happy with their wifi and router, i have no reason to doubt their surveillance gear.  You don't need to use their nvr - they give you the software for free.

https://www.ubnt.com/enterprise/#unifi-video

Most of their cameras are 720p, they have one 1080p 3mp camera, but its expensive.

Its the issue I discussed before, you pay for rebranding, tech support and hopefully better SW, but I'm not willing to pay the premium.  Maybe I'll regret it, but we will see.

[rif]

Most of their cameras are 720p, they have one 1080p 3mp camera, but its expensive.

Its the issue I discussed before, you pay for rebranding, tech support and hopefully better SW, but I'm not willing to pay the premium.  Maybe I'll regret it, but we will see.

Just to clarify, their latest cameras the G3 3rd generation are 1080p and under $150.  Not sure what you mean by rebranding.

[tvyankee]

Hey,

Just as a heads up when looking at your cameras just make sure you know what you are getting as far as manual zoom and focus as opposed to motorized zoom and focus and make sure there are at least IP 65 or 66. You want on the wide end to go at least 2.8 not 3.6

Also you may to consider panoramic view as you get more ground covered as well as how well they do in low light night time as you want to use them outside. Also consider you mounting options as a ceiling mount type camera does not do well on a side wall sometimes it pays to get the right mounts. Also you may want to consider if you audio as well.  I will say there is some good ip camera software out there but as said before the nvr thing does make it pretty easy. Also if you get a nvr you may need a POE switch. 

Also with the ubnt sometimes their stuff is 24volt not 48 volt . something to consider

Lots of things to consider to make sure you do it right the first time.

Hope some of this helps you out.

Peace

[randytsuch]

Just to clarify, their latest cameras the G3 3rd generation are 1080p and under $150.  Not sure what you mean by rebranding.

I stand corrected, for some reason when I looked this morning, I only saw one 1080p camera, and it was expensive.

Rebranded for these means they are buying chinese cameras, and having them packaged for Ubiquiti.  Also having custom SW installed.
Hikvision anh Dahau are both OEMs, they actually make the stuff.

Randy

[randytsuch]

Hey,

Just as a heads up when looking at your cameras just make sure you know what you are getting as far as manual zoom and focus as opposed to motorized zoom and focus and make sure there are at least IP 65 or 66. You want on the wide end to go at least 2.8 not 3.6

Also you may to consider panoramic view as you get more ground covered as well as how well they do in low light night time as you want to use them outside. Also consider you mounting options as a ceiling mount type camera does not do well on a side wall sometimes it pays to get the right mounts. Also you may want to consider if you audio as well.  I will say there is some good ip camera software out there but as said before the nvr thing does make it pretty easy. Also if you get a nvr you may need a POE switch. 

Also with the ubnt sometimes their stuff is 24volt not 48 volt . something to consider

Lots of things to consider to make sure you do it right the first time.

Hope some of this helps you out.

Peace

So I was thinking about getting a manual zoom, which I could adjust to the focal length I decide I like.  I read the problem with wide angle is it is hard to make out details, so you may not be able to see enough to tell who the person is. 
Motorized zoom would be nice, but you pay for it obviously.  And more to break.

Since I've never had a camera, its hard to figure out what fixed lens would be good, I've read 3.6 is good but you are saying it's not wide enough lol.

I may get one cheap varifocal and play with it, to figure out what I need in the different locations.

And I am worried about night performance, luckily in the front I'm across the street from a street light, so front is fairly well lit.
I'll have sensor floods in the back to light up the yard, and see how that works.

The NVR's I'm looking at have POE, but switches are not that expensive, or I can get a POE power injector.

And now I'm wondering if there is any way to use my cell phone to approximate what 2.8 or 3.6mm would look like, there must be a way!

Thanks for the advice
Randy

[randytsuch]

Hey Randy,

I'm not trying to talk you into anything because well, I'm not making any money But it seems like a lot of work to get a PC to do what the NVR already does out of the box. It is literally plug and play. The cameras are all powered from the NVR, just put RJ45 ends on your cat5e and plug the cameras in. The turret cameras are cheaper but that's exactly why I don't like them, they seem a lot cheaper when you put them in.

Anyway, the NVR is on sale this month and my guess is next month the other camera types will probably be on sale, or at lease one of the two other types. These prices are about 30% off my normal price so you will want to buy them on sale.

Just let me know if I can help. Also, let me know where you live, we might get lucky and you can pick them up, so no shipping.

Hey Greg,
Turns out I was not looking at IP Dahua cams, so I thought they were cheaper than they are lol.
Makes your dome price look really good now, but per my previous post, I don't know what lens is best for my applications.

Randy

[gregfisk]

Hey Greg,
Turns out I was not looking at IP Dahua cams, so I thought they were cheaper than they are lol.
Makes your dome price look really good now, but per my previous post, I don't know what lens is best for my applications.

Randy

As mentioned above a dome camera needs to be mounted horizontally and not on a wall. As far as lenses go we jump between 2.8 and 4.0 which are the norm for HIK. The camera night vision does really well at half of what they are rated but that is in dark conditions, they are much better if you have some light. I like the 4mm lenses for most applications because 2.8 is fairly wide so the object has to be pretty close to the camera before you can get a good look. The 4mm lens is of course more narrow but it is much better as seeing the detail of an object for a much longer distance. Regarding the price, when the bullet cameras are on sale they are the same price.   

[randytsuch]

For mounting a dome, I was going to get an exterior, metal version of something like this
http://www.hikvision.com/us/Products_1_10666_i8811.html#prettyPhoto

I figured that it would be "safer" (less likely to be stolen and damaged) than a bullet.

This is for by the front door.

The driveway cam will be under the eaves, and can be a bullet.  Same for back of house.

Randy