MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3

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rajacat

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MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« on: 14 Aug 2016, 10:18 pm »
I presume that these two devices perform a  similar function. Has anybody compared the sound quality?
The RedNet definitely has more inputs and outputs but it only works to 192k sample rate whereas the microRendu supports much higher rates up to 768k.
The RN is more commercially oriented. It seems to be a little overkill in the number of ports provided and it costs more. No DSD support too.

firedog

Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #1 on: 15 Aug 2016, 08:15 am »
They don't really perform the same function.

mRendu: ehternet>USB converter. Converts only to USB. Specially designed to optimize the USB connection, be low noise, and intended to plug into your USB DAC. Has an OS designed only for audio playback - stripped down for its hardware. Has apps installed that let you interface with pretty much every common type of playback software used by audiophiles: Roon, HQP, SqueezeBox, Mpd, Airplay emulator, DLNA. It's main purpose is to get you the cleanest signal possible from the favorite playback software running on your computer/server to the USB input on your DAC. In reality, a software to HW device.

RedNet3 is more of a ethernet>digital converter for pro audio. No USB, has the digital outs commonly used in pro audio. Isn't oriented toward playback per se. Is more designed to connect a network computer to pro audio HW (not software) such as master clocks and other processing units. It's really intended as a HW to HW device.

If you forget that one device is for USB and the other is for other digital inputs, you could sort of say that they do the same thing: ethernet>other digital conversion. So in that sense they are interchangeable. If your DAC has the right inputs, you could use either. But they aren't really intended for the same purpose - different types of signal paths, and a different concept of what you are doing with your digital audio. I'd use each one for the purpose it was intended, and not for the one it isn't. I don't think the RedNet would be the most useful device in an audiophile system, and I don't think the mR would be the best tool to use in a pro environment.

Vincent Kars

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Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #2 on: 15 Aug 2016, 10:32 am »
Rednet is a completely different beast.
It is designed for pro use, be it recording, life performance, etc.
Avoiding yards of analog cabling by using Ethernet as a transport.
It allows for AD and DA.
You can hook up a couple of mics, intruments, etc and record.
If you run out of inputs, add a second unit.
Ultra-low latency is very important.

The Rendu is playback only.
It is what you can do with a small computer.
DLNA/ AIRplay if you go the streaming way (high latency).
MPD/Squeese if you want to use it as a music server.
Roon/HQ  are a bit like Dante as you stream audio in real time from a player to an end point.


wushuliu

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Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #3 on: 19 Aug 2016, 06:57 pm »
IIRC on head-fi those few who were able to compare both preferred the RedNet or found them equal. For me the tip-off vs. the Rendu is the fact that the Rendu has an optional $1500 power supply. To me that says there is still a bottleneck to be dealt with in terms of sound quality. My experience with the RedNet was I didn't even think twice about does it need a better power supply (although I think it could be taken up a notch as can anything that uses an smps). The RedNet will have an uphill battle for acceptance because it is pro-audio oriented and does not have any audiophile buzzwords or software affiliation to commend it. You just have to hear it. It made for a genuine 'whoa' moment.

RedNet expands the soundscape, completely remove digititis, has tremendous depth and separation. It's just... different. Even with a $30 dac it sounded terrific.

The tradeoff is convenience. If sound quality is the priority, I am willing to bet the RedNet wins out. If you're in the U.S. Sweetwater has a terrific return policy and there is no shortage of buyers on head-fi if you sell it used.

It's a component that I think every audiophile with the funds should hear.

Mike-48

Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #4 on: 22 Aug 2016, 07:29 am »
Is there an article somewhere that covers integrating Rednet into a typical home network audio system? As an experienced user of a DLNA setup, I don't quite see how I could use Dante-based components to replace DLNA (not that I'm a huge fan of the latter . . . but it's what we have).

firedog

Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #5 on: 23 Aug 2016, 06:44 am »
IIRC on head-fi those few who were able to compare both preferred the RedNet or found them equal. For me the tip-off vs. the Rendu is the fact that the Rendu has an optional $1500 power supply. To me that says there is still a bottleneck to be dealt with in terms of sound quality. My experience with the RedNet was I didn't even think twice about does it need a better power supply (although I think it could be taken up a notch as can anything that uses an smps). The RedNet will have an uphill battle for acceptance because it is pro-audio oriented and does not have any audiophile buzzwords or software affiliation to commend it. You just have to hear it. It made for a genuine 'whoa' moment.

RedNet expands the soundscape, completely remove digititis, has tremendous depth and separation. It's just... different. Even with a $30 dac it sounded terrific.

The tradeoff is convenience. If sound quality is the priority, I am willing to bet the RedNet wins out. If you're in the U.S. Sweetwater has a terrific return policy and there is no shortage of buyers on head-fi if you sell it used.

It's a component that I think every audiophile with the funds should hear.



Again, it's comparing apples and oranges. Just because something fits your specific needs and preferences doesn't make it better or worse than another component. Pro audio components can be very good, but aren't always suitable for home environments. That is one of the reasons they often aren't accepted by audiophiles - it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with buzzwords, etc.

RedNet might be great, but it doesn't fit in my home setup - not in terms of size, looks, or in terms of connections - the ethenet>USB connection is critical for me and lots of other home users. In addition, the "software affiliation" aspect that you dismiss is exactly one of the important selling points about the mR for many home users. I understand that may not matter to you, but it's important to lots of people.

Doesn't mean the RedNet isn't great, it means that for a lot of home users it just isn't a fit. That's why it's an apples and oranges comparison.   Different people have different needs. You write as if the two products are basically identical in terms of form and function - and compare them on that basis: The problem is that that they aren't identical in either form or function. The mR wouldn't be a good device in a pro setup, and the RedNet3 is not an ideal device for a domestic audiophile setup.

As far as relative sound quality, I'd bet it is system and setup dependent over which one works better. People have also reported "whoa" moments with the mR. I'm glad you love your device. Assuming it is better than another device you haven't heard doesn't mean much.

The "$1500 power supply" comment is sort of a red-herring comment. The mR is sold without a PS, and there are something like 7 "recommended" supplies, starting at less than $50 dollars.  How is that a "bottleneck"? Audiophiles tend to buy an improved PS for just about any component, and often already  own multiple "audiophile" power supplies, so Sonore left it up to the buyer what PS to use.

Pro audio users don't tend to by fancy add on power supplies, so it isn't sold that way.
Products intended for different markets are sold differently. No other significance to either component being sold with or without any PS.

If the RedNet comes into fashion with audiophiles, I guarantee you that posts will start appearing about which upmarket PS to use with it. That doesn't prove anything about the RedNet or any other unit.


firedog

Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #6 on: 23 Aug 2016, 06:55 am »
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wushuliu

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Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #7 on: 23 Aug 2016, 12:28 pm »


Again, it's comparing apples and oranges. Just because something fits your specific needs and preferences doesn't make it better or worse than another component. Pro audio components can be very good, but aren't always suitable for home environments. That is one of the reasons they often aren't accepted by audiophiles - it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with buzzwords, etc.

RedNet might be great, but it doesn't fit in my home setup - not in terms of size, looks, or in terms of connections - the ethenet>USB connection is critical for me and lots of other home users. In addition, the "software affiliation" aspect that you dismiss is exactly one of the important selling points about the mR for many home users. I understand that may not matter to you, but it's important to lots of people.

Doesn't mean the RedNet isn't great, it means that for a lot of home users it just isn't a fit. That's why it's an apples and oranges comparison.   Different people have different needs. You write as if the two products are basically identical in terms of form and function - and compare them on that basis: The problem is that that they aren't identical in either form or function. The mR wouldn't be a good device in a pro setup, and the RedNet3 is not an ideal device for a domestic audiophile setup.

As far as relative sound quality, I'd bet it is system and setup dependent over which one works better. People have also reported "whoa" moments with the mR. I'm glad you love your device. Assuming it is better than another device you haven't heard doesn't mean much.

The "$1500 power supply" comment is sort of a red-herring comment. The mR is sold without a PS, and there are something like 7 "recommended" supplies, starting at less than $50 dollars.  How is that a "bottleneck"? Audiophiles tend to buy an improved PS for just about any component, and often already  own multiple "audiophile" power supplies, so Sonore left it up to the buyer what PS to use.

Pro audio users don't tend to by fancy add on power supplies, so it isn't sold that way.
Products intended for different markets are sold differently. No other significance to either component being sold with or without any PS.

If the RedNet comes into fashion with audiophiles, I guarantee you that posts will start appearing about which upmarket PS to use with it. That doesn't prove anything about the RedNet or any other unit.

which is why I say it should be heard if possible. not owned. just heard.

rajacat

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Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #8 on: 7 Oct 2016, 09:43 pm »
which is why I say it should be heard if possible. not owned. just heard.
+1
Are you still happy with your Rednet? I'm at a point where I feel the need for an upgrade. The question is whether to upgrade my dac first or replace my Bolder SB3 with the MicroRendu or the Rednet. My current dac doesn't have USB so it I went with the Microrendu I'd need a converter which is another box in the circuit plus extra $. With the Rednet I could use my current dac. On the other hand, the Rednet would probably be more difficult to get installed properly. I don't want to get too heavy into nerdy installation aggravations.
The easy way out would be to keep my current SB3 setup and just get a very good dac.   

wushuliu

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Re: MicroRendu vs. RedNet 3
« Reply #9 on: 8 Oct 2016, 12:26 am »
+1
Are you still happy with your Rednet? I'm at a point where I feel the need for an upgrade. The question is whether to upgrade my dac first or replace my Bolder SB3 with the MicroRendu or the Rednet. My current dac doesn't have USB so it I went with the Microrendu I'd need a converter which is another box in the circuit plus extra $. With the Rednet I could use my current dac. On the other hand, the Rednet would probably be more difficult to get installed properly. I don't want to get too heavy into nerdy installation aggravations.
The easy way out would be to keep my current SB3 setup and just get a very good dac.

I returned the RedNet and took a totally different path when my blu ray player died and got an oppo that I have heavily modified for both ethernet streaming and video (there's a thread here and in the home theater circle of what I've done). I still recommend the RedNet very highly. I am surprised it isn't getting more traction outside of head-fi and some other places. It's not hard to setup, just confusing documentation not geared towards audiophiles. Upside is you can add on external clocks and reclockers as a potential upgrade path. People are adding Antelope Clocks and Mutecs and what not to push the envelope. Downside is it's not plug and play with Roon, etc.
Sweetwater and Focusrite have *excellent* customer service and a great return policy if you don't care for it. MicroRendu I'm not as familiar with though what I've read is that it works best with certain software like HQPlayer and Roon so may have limitations of its own. Certainly more plug and play though.

As for a dac, I'll toss in my .02 and recommend the Soekris R2R DAC. Yeah, it's diy but it's so good!