[John Casler]

Hi George,

I heard the Bedini version of this device recently at Mad Dog's and too thought it "did" provided some noticable improvement.....

But I question the validity of what is actually happening.  I am under the impression that aluminum cannot be "magnetized" without constant current (alnico magnet)

I am also under the distinct impression that plastic has "no" magnetic abilities or properties.

So being the inquisitive type, I am wondering just "what" (if anything) is actually magnetic in a CD/DVD, or if it is more an "anti-static" device with the magnetism thing thrown in to make it seem more mystical.

Now obviously "static electricity" can cause electrical attraction (remember rubbing balloons on your girlfriends sweater and hanging them on the wall? ) but is that magnetism??

Note, I am not questioning the "improvement" since I certainly heard it, but I am wondering if the "magentism thing" is even possible??

Is it the ferrous impurities in the top (non playing layer of paint) or is it something else??

Does anyone know the "real deal"?

[zybar]

John,

Have no idea on the technical behind what I heard - I simply listen and decide.

Here is what Furutech says about cd/dvd composition:

What makes a DISC, such as CD,…etc., magnetized?

1. The label of the painted portion of a DISC contains chemical compositions, such as Iron, Ni, and Cobalt that are strong-magnet materials, which are easily magnetized.

2. The recording reflecting surface of a DISC contains 99% aluminum and 1% of magnetic substances such as Iron, Ni, and Cobalt. In addition, aluminum is a weak-magnet material, which is also easily influenced by magnetism.  The above descriptions clearly show that a DISC is magnetized during reproduction by a DVD or a CD Player because of a magnetic field, which is generated by strong magnetic induction and the motor rotation of the recording head. The same problem can be found in any CDR, DVD, VCD, CD, or MD. Particularly, the Magnet Catch of a MD is the most seriously influenced portion and may further cause problems with un-readability.

For further info, below are Furutech links about the RD-2:

http://www.venhaus1.com/rd2introduction.pdf

http://www.venhaus1.com/rd2operating.pdf

http://www.venhaus1.com/rd2ownersmanual.pdf

George

[Jon L]

Jeez, John, you still haven't gotten the answer to the same questions?

I doubt anyone, even folks at Furutech or Bedini, can explain/prove this satisfactorily to YOU.  Unless you wanna be called "cheapskate," just bite the bullet and buy the Bedini.  I'll bet Mad Dog is glad he bought his (very cheaply I might add).  

Having both Furutech and Bedini, I recommend the Bedini as it is much cheaper and just as good/or better.

If you (or whoever) wants a mint Furutech RD-2, for like 1/2 price, just let me know.

[Mad DOg]

...I'll bet Mad Dog is glad he bought his...

yeah, i'm quite happy with my bedini!   now if i can just remember to use if BEFORE i spin up my CDs...   i usually get thru 1/2 a song before realizing that i've forgotten to "bedinize" the CD.  

[Mad DOg]

oh yeah, another thing i've found to improve sound...as hokey as this may seem, but the Auric Illuminator works wonders to improve CD sound as well.  

[zybar]

I use the "new and improved" second version of the Auric Illuminator + the RD-2 with great results.  Just a pain in the ass treating the cd's...

How much is the Bedini?

Jon L, I might have a friend who will buy your RD-2.

George

[Gordy]

Static electricity is very definitely a possible culprit.  It is generated by just about any moving part/object and having spent 30 odd years in textile research I can attest to the fact that high speed 'plastics' carry one h@!! of a whallop   Ever notice that fuel tankers always get grounded before off loading at gas stations?  Static is generated simply by the fuel moving through the hose...

[HChi]

I also think it is the electrostatic charge that got build up.  I was thinking of RD-2 directly from Asia one and a half year ago, but the deal fall through.  When I went to Taiwan last year,  I picked up a anti-static ionic fan.  It  basically blows out ionic charaged air.   It exhibits a smiliar effect as RD-2.   A couple hard-core friends actually use RD-2 first, then blow the CD for 30s with the fan before critical listening.   The true scientific reason may not be completely understood, but I know that it works in my system.  A few reports I read, people actually use RD-2 to 'de-magnetize' their cables as well.  If zybar won't mind trying it out, perhaps he could report back to us .

[Mad DOg]

How much is the Bedini?

i think it's around $70-80 at retail...

[Mad DOg]

Just a pain in the ass treating the cd's...

agreed

[John Casler]

Jeez, John, you still haven't gotten the answer to the same questions?

I doubt anyone, even folks at Furutech or Bedini, can explain/prove this satisfactorily to YOU.  Unless you wanna be called "cheapskate," just bite the bullet and buy the Bedini.  I'll bet Mad Dog is glad he bought his (very cheaply I might add).  

Having both Furutech and Bedini, I recommend the Bedini as it is much cheaper and just as good/or better.

If you (or whoever) wants a mint Furutech RD-2, for like 1/2 price, just let me know.

Hi Jon,

Yes George did below.  I have never heard of Aluminum being a magnet without current, but according to below it "is" a weak magnet.

Generally I'll accept most explanations (even some cable theories) if they make sense and I can hear the difference.

In this case, I could certainly hear the difference, but the explanation "needed" further explanation

I brings a double meaning to the expression "don't beleive everything you hear".  

When I scanned the Bedini site, it was not as detailed as the info George found from Furtech, below.

I guess in the scheme of things, it doesn't make any difference "why" it works, as long as it does.

Who's a cheapskate??

John,

1. The label of the painted portion of a DISC contains chemical compositions, such as Iron, Ni, and Cobalt that are strong-magnet materials, which are easily magnetized.

2. The recording reflecting surface of a DISC contains 99% aluminum and 1% of magnetic substances such as Iron, Ni, and Cobalt. In addition, aluminum is a weak-magnet material, which is also easily influenced by magnetism. The above descriptions clearly show that a DISC is magnetized during reproduction by a DVD or a CD Player because of a magnetic field, which is generated by strong magnetic induction and the motor rotation of the recording head. The same problem can be found in any CDR, DVD, VCD, CD, or MD. Particularly, the Magnet Catch of a MD is the most seriously influenced portion and may further cause problems with un-readability.

George

[lonewolfny42]

Would this info help..... http://www.hifi-tuning.com/furutech_rd2.htm

[Bob Wilcox]

George

I use the Audio Desk lathe with the Furtech and don't bother with chemical treatments any more. IMO, the Audio Desk makes a bigger difference.

Bob

[Jon L]

Yeah, I always wanted to try the Audio Desk lathe, but the $ doesn't make it easier.  It also disturbs me I need to lathe the edges of all my CD's ("I'm too old for this s$#%"), not to mention having to re-apply my Audioprism Stoplight to the edges again

Sometimes there's just too much procedure to go through before actual music appears.  Paradoxically, I find that even though these procedures may improve sonics, overall musical enjoyment suffers just b/c too much crap needs to be done before listening.

At one point, when I bought a new CD, here was the procedure:

AudioPrism Stoplight
Walker Vivid and/or Auric Illuminator
now superceded by Furutech PC-2 cleaner Plus Record research labs "Shine Ola"
Then I would use double/triple cycle of Furutech RD-2
or Bedini Ultra Clarifier (or sometimes both!)
then place Audioprism CD blacklight CD mat (and/or other mats)

There are people who substitute or Add(!) more steps to the above, including Bulk erasing magnet, various anti-static fluid or gun/fan, the Audio Desk lathe, etc, etc.  

Where is there time to actually listen after a 12-hour work-day?

I've somewhat come to my senses only use the green pen/Furutech PC-2/shine-ola, which gives me probably 90% of maximal possible improvement.  I just don't have time to use Bedini or Furutech RD-2 anymore...

[Steve]

For the newbies who might be interested, with little expenditure, one could use a hair blower, dryer, anything that presents a fairly strong AC magnetic field to test with.  

A little more extravent test would be to alternate, first using a magnet (say speaker magnet), then listen, and then use one of the appliances above and listen again.

The second part of the above test requires putting the CD close to the appliance, turn it on, and gradually pull the two apart, maybe 3 feet, and then switching the appliance off.

[audioengr]

I deposit a layer of soft plastic on top of my CD's to reduce resonance.  I gave a demo of this to the chair guy at THE Show in January.  It really works, but I have just not had the time to productize it.  It uses Plastikote and a jig for applying the coating.

[djbnh]

Found this link to a thread that contains some negative comments about the Bedini: http://hometheaterhifi.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1235
Anyone care to comment? I note I don't use the Bedini nor the Furutech CD products, but I am interested in if they work.

[Carlman]

from Furutech site: CD Player because of a magnetic field, which is generated by strong magnetic induction and the motor rotation of the recording head.

I don't understand this at all... what 'recording head' are they talking about?  Did they just copy and paste this stuff from a tape demagnetizer's marketing literature?

I don't question that this tweak makes an audible difference but I do question the reasoning.  I have a grunge-buster cd-mat that reduces the digital hash of cd's fairly well... better than the cd-rings I've used... but I can't accept that paint and aluminum and 1% magnetic materials require 'demagnetizing'... or that a $300+ device is required to perform this function.

I think Steve's suggested experiment should produce 'an audible difference' if the demagnetizing theory holds water.  I may try it if I get some free time after all the gear I'm burning-in settles down and stops changing.

[BrunoB]

Here a CD tweak page: http://www.tweakaudio.com/EVS-2/CD_tweaks.html

[Steve]

Well, above I show a cheap way of testing before you purchase anything expensive.


As far as your link, well, one group tried it and the other group argued, when they could have run a simple prelim test themselves in about the same amount of time.

Anyway, You will have to decide.