The Amps are warm ... the Beer is cold ...

Inscrutable · « **on:** 24 Oct 2004, 11:30 am »

But don't expect the company to be hot, or even cool

Think I mentioned it before, but I'm not real hung up on specific times. In keeping with our previous meets, I guess anyone that wants to roll in starting about 11 is fine (or even a little earlier if you want to be pressed into service), and probably most of the horses will be in the barn by 1 or so. With the large number of combinations and people, we'll start as soon as we have some critical mass. Hopefully, everyone will get to hear the combinations they care most about.

Anyone more skilled with photography than I (and that would be everyone) and wants to bring their own camera is welcome and encouraged. If you have a trackyou particularly want to hear, bring it over. We may use something like an S'phile test disc to run through combinations to get the character of each system, then play stuff we actually like.

I have some beer, sodas, and munchies, but I don't have a solid (or even real good feel for) headcount. I was spending too much time setting this stuff up (and impromptu moving of my daughter and her roommate into an apartment yesterday) to do anything like jambalaya ... sorry guys.

Still have some setup issues to resolve, so early arrivers may be put to work, or at least asked for opinions. One of the biggies is the sources and preamp for the VR-4Jr and 3.3 end of the room is remote from the amps, and I'm using long homemade RG6U interconnects. If I move the Salamander rack front and center, we can use shorter higher-quality interconnects, but I'm afraid it will disturb/destroy the soundstaging - especially with the 3.3's as they will be quite close to the rack. I have a Bell'O rack I could empty (using it for LP's and DVD's) and use, and it is much more open, but it has glass shelves, which I am not wild about. Opinions? Foamboy, is this perhaps a case where the Wal-mart wall of foam would prove beneficial? (I know, that's a trick question

)

sheadlee · « **Reply #1 on:** 24 Oct 2004, 11:58 am »

Tim,

Don't you ever sleep????

I'll be heading over that way shortly...I figure I'll arrive around 11:00AM. So, I'll be able to help, if needed.

claud · « **Reply #2 on:** 24 Oct 2004, 12:09 pm »

I just made the coffee. Woman is still asleep. As soon as she makes breakfast, I'm on my way. Might be 10ish. Has everyone been to your place before or do you need to post a telephone number , Tim? I wish I had some LOOONG ICs to bring.

BrunoB · « **Reply #3 on:** 24 Oct 2004, 02:01 pm »

I am not sure I will attend. I have a big cold since yesterday. I will see how I feel this afternoon. If I am not coming, I wish you guys a lot of fun.

Bruno

Carlman · « **Reply #4 on:** 24 Oct 2004, 02:37 pm »

I've been a bit under-the-weather myself lately. However, I will be there since I feel OK today. I just hope my stuffy head doesn't effect my hearing too much. However, since I'm usually congested, it'll be normal for me anyway.

I got up a bit late this morning so I likely won't be there until about noon or later.

-C

zybar · « **Reply #5 on:** 24 Oct 2004, 11:07 pm »

So how did the day go?

George

Carlman · « **Reply #6 on:** 24 Oct 2004, 11:49 pm »

I can only comment to the part of the day I was there... from about noon to 3:30. However, I can tell you that I had a great time hearing the differences between Bel Canto, Butler, and JJaz amplifiers on Von Schweikert VR-4jr's and NHT 3.3's. The source used was a Cary CD player which I made no particular note of... which probably made it good to use for a test like this.

The NHT's had excellent bass as always... beautifully blended with the mid-bass up through the upper mid-range. The highs seemed just a tad splashy or somehow inaccurate to my ear but not bad.

The VR-4jr's in comparison had a completely different sound (as you'd expect). I was surprised at how well the VS house sound translates from the VR-1 all the way up the 4. They sounded like VS speakers. When I first got there, the VR's had that marvelous and solid midrange that I feel is their strong point. Later when we really sat down and evaluated them, the midrange seemed recessed. The reason seemed to be that we'd moved the speakers around a bit to do the comparison and the VR's were now too far out into the room and we were sitting too far back. Shane pushed them back to close to where they were and that got us closer to where we were. In any case, they sounded very good but I would've needed to get the positioning right to really evaluate them accurately.
Oh, another note about these is the 'ambience control'... Shane turned them up to 2/3rd's and that made the soundstage get wider without any distortion. I was quite entertained by that adjustment.

As to the amps, I am starting to think that Butler is the best amp I've heard. It has a beautiful rich midrange and I think adequate bass and overall coherency. It seems to provide the most convincing 'voice' to instruments and singers better than anything I've heard to date. (note: I'm still learning

)

The Bel Canto was very 'accurate'. It captured details, had depth to the soundstage, and recreated the original recording space better than the others. However, that magical midrange wasn't there for me and lost some of the emotional involvement I had with the Butler.

The Jjaz wooden 1000w monoblocks was not what I like. To ME, compared to the others, the JJaz just didn't have the depth, air, or nuances that added to the realism of the performance that I like to hear. Maybe it's a lack of coloration, I don't know.... it wasn't bad, just not what I like.

We switched to the Cain and Cain's and a 'Fi'? amplifier which was the oddest thing I've seen in a long time. We also played the Eastern Electric Minimax amp... and the Von Schweikert db-99's... all excellent stuff but I don't have time to write at this moment. I took photos and will add more comments later.....

-Carl

sheadlee · « **Reply #7 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 01:15 am »

Thanks to Tim, for being the most excellent host, again.

Even though I'm not in the market, at this time, I certainly enjoyed the wide variety of equipment. It never hurts to keep future options open, and to have a good idea of where to start one's search.

Also, it was nice to see you guys, again, and share in this 'sometimes' crazy hobby.

hometheaterdoc · « **Reply #8 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 01:23 am »

Whew!!

I just got back and got all the gear unloaded.... I'm not even going to think about rehooking it all up again until tomorrow...

I want to thank Tim for being such a great host. It was wonderful to have so much space to set up all the various gear. I hope getting to spend over a week with all this stuff in your house was partial repayment for putting up with all the lugging and hauling of gear in and out of your house

It was an absolute blast getting to do this. Despite the fact that my back is gonna pay for it, I haven't had this much fun in a while. It was great to see some new faces, and see old faces as well. Hopefully we can convince all the newbies to come on here and post their impressions. We had a number of people who came in after some of you left and it was great to meet all of you.

I'll let others comment on the actual sound of everything. My thoughts mirrored most everyone else anyway.

I will say this though....the dB-99s are phenomenal and incredibly flexible in what they will work with, be it 3 watt 2A3 amps, MiniMax tube amp, Butler powerhouse, or even Bel Canto amps run bridged mono.

Carl - you missed out by not being able to stay later. We moved the VR-4jrs to the db-99 wall and they were VASTLY better. Much more like you experienced here in my rooms. Everyone agreed that they really worked well in that setup..... it's all about placement I guess

We also really got diverse with our music after most folks left.... we had the place really jammin' with the dB-99s and the Butler and then Bel Canto with some really great tunes...

All in all, a great day... for anyone who couldn't make it, far be it for me to rub it in...... but boy did you miss out

hometheaterdoc · « **Reply #9 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 01:26 am »

oh.... and not all the Butler amps came back with me if that is any indication of what people thought of the sound

zybar · « **Reply #10 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 01:35 am »

Quote from: hometheaterdoc

oh.... and not all the Butler amps came back with me if that is any indication of what people thought of the sound

Which Butler amps did you listen to and in what configuration?

I am really interested to hear if you tried the 2250's as mono blocks.

George

hometheaterdoc · « **Reply #11 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 02:02 am »

Quote from: zybar

Quote from: hometheaterdoc
oh.... and not all the Butler amps came back with me if that is any indication of what people thought of the sound

Which Butler amps did you listen to and in what configuration?

I am really interested to hear if you tried the 2250's as mono blocks.

George

We ran the 5150 and the 2250. We only used two channels of the 5150 (i run 4 channels here and one for the center channel so that I can biamp the 4jrs, but didn't get around to doing that today), and ran the 2250 as a stereo amp. It was more than enough power to drive the proverbial you know what out of all the speakers in attendance.

claud · « **Reply #12 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 02:26 am »

Carlman, The Cary CD player was my 308T with NOS Amperex 7316 halo getter, TG Audio Hi Purity ICs and SLVR powercord.
For me, the Butler was the best amp there, but I thought Carlman's Minimax amp was great on the Cain and Cains. Have you ever tried it on Reference De Cappo is?
We were graced by the attendance of a nice woman audiophile. You know women hear better when she left with the 2ch Butler to take home to her Wilson Watt Puppies. A very classy lady.

Inscrutable · « **Reply #13 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 08:43 am »

Hi guys,

By the time Shane posted here, I think I'd retreated to bed with some Aleve and a magazine -think I read the same sentence about 4 times before I nodded off.

I want to thank Shane and Rusty for the loan and use of so much great gear - VonSchweikert, Butler, BelCanto, Consonance - and even more for investing their time and muscular-skeletal structure lugging it all the way up there (I don't call it My Blue Heaven just cuz it's pleasant and I like Steve Martin

) Shane, you don't happen to rep elevators - for people, not cables - do ya?

Thanks to Claud for bringing over the Cary and the Lehmann. Steve, thanks for bringing over the Linn, even tho we didn't get a chance to put it in the chain. Since we were mainly listening to speakers, once we chased out the hum demons it seemed better to just leave the front end constant. Maybe we'll do a more source-oriented meet.

Thanks to all the folks who attended, and regrets that some of you couldn't make it. I'll echo Shane's sentiments that it was nice to meet other local enthusiasts. Please do join us here on the circles.

Since there are a number of AC'ers outside our attendees and state who are interested in our thoughts, I'll start a thread over in the Critics Circle. Please come over and post your impressions of any or all of this stuff. You don't have to be a 'critic' (heaven knows I don't qualify) to have an opinion in which others will be interested.

Inscrutable · « **Reply #14 on:** 25 Oct 2004, 12:40 pm »

Thread over at Critic's Circle here

Carlman · « **Reply #15 on:** 26 Oct 2004, 01:32 am »

Thought I'd post a picture of the NC Gang:

More photos in my gallery in the sig.

-C

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #16 on:** 26 Oct 2004, 02:57 am »

All Right !!! Good to see some AudioCircle shirts on......

Nice shots Carl....thanks !!![/list:u]