[S Clark]

I'm jumping into the low output world with a Dynavector 20x2L.  I have several phono pre options (Dodd, 2 Vistas, Graham Slee, Cambridge 650), but all but my least favorite are MM only.  Like everything in this hobby, the options for SUT run from $150 to stupid $.  Where is the sweet spot?  My usual mode of operation is to find something outside of my budget, then wait to find a used model. 
Any advice?

[jtsnead]

You know what I am going to say, Bob's

Here is one on Agon:

https://app.audiogon.com/listings/phono-bob-s-devices-cinemag-1131-sut-2015-11-22-preamplifiers-01944-manchester-ma

[S Clark]

You know what I am going to say, Bob's

I saw that that's what you have been using.  So $900 used is the buy in point??  I know it's hard to put figures on something like this, but is it typical to spend 1:1 for a cartridge/SUT combo?  Is a SUT more than a passive transformer in 1:6 to 1:12 range with a couple of RCA jacks attached? 
I've got a modded Cambridge 650 to use temporarily( hopefully, very temporarily) until a better option comes along. 

[jtsnead]

Yes and yes, they tend to hold their value, but you could make an offer.
I have heard that building a sut can be difficult to get the wiring right and
that Bob's is considered a really good product for the price, Once you have
one you usually keep them.

It is exactly a passive transformer, on Bob's website there is a chart
and based on that and the 20xl2 being .3mv output and a 5 ohm internal
impedance a 1:20 ratio would be best and that is what I used

Sell off some of your phono stages keep the best one you like for mm input
and put the money towards the 1131 and I think you would be very happy

[S Clark]

I've just dipped my toe in the water with a used cart. at $450, so tripling the investment with a Bob's SUT when I don't even know what I'm getting into... 
What are the options in the <$500 range?  Anyone familiar with the K&K kits? JH audio? There's a potted SUT from Cryoparts (a Shure for around $225).  Park's Audio with Cinemag transformers?  Or should I just borrow my friends Jolida with a MC circuit? Or will all of these lower cost options hide the benefits of a low output cartridge so that I might as well stick with my DynaV 10x5 ????

[rollo]

  Dave Slagle makes some of the best. Made in USA.

charles

[woodsyi]

Scott,

I will loan you a S&B 102 unit set on 1:20.  PM me if you want to try it.  I have no idea what the cost is.  I don't think they make them anymore.  I got my active phonostage and strain guage. I don't have any MM unit to mate it with.

[S Clark]

Scott,

I will loan you a S&B 102 unit set on 1:20.  PM me if you want to try it.  I have no idea what the cost is.  I don't think they make them anymore.  I got my active phonostage and strain guage. I don't have any MM unit to mate it with.

Wow! How can I turn that down.  Thanks.  You've got a PM.

[jtsnead]

Woodsyi  very nice of you

Scott...that would give you a good idea of the advantages of
a sut and frankly the lower cost ones probably are 80 - 90%
of what you would get with a higher price one

[S Clark]

Thanks for the info. It seems that in audio, all the $ goes toward those diminishing returns... that %10 improvement.   Rim's SUT will should let hear the key difference between low and high output MC within the same family of cartridges.  I can also see how the Jolida pre stacks up on its MC setting.  Best of all possible worlds!

[tubesguy2]

If you're at all comfortable with a little DIY, you can buy a different transformer pair from Cinemag (the CM-1254) for $350, and stick them in a box with RCA jacks for very little. They reserve the (possibly) better version for commercial or semi-commercial customers.

[S Clark]

If you're at all comfortable with a little DIY, you can buy a different transformer pair from Cinemag (the CM-1254) for $350, and stick them in a box with RCA jacks for very little. They reserve the (possibly) better version for commercial or semi-commercial customers.

No problem with DIY up to a point.  I'll keep this in mind.

[jsm71]

One more  for the Bob's.  I bought his Sky 20 to mate with my Lyra Delos going into my Cary MM phono stage.  This was my first MC cartridge after using a number of higher cost MM ones.  My listening buddies pushed me over the edge and my system warranted it.  Bit the $$ bullet for sure to make this jump but wow, I'm not going back. 

As a passive component I looked at it as a long term investment, locked only into the range of gain the model I selected can support.  A good SUT into a MM stage is sweet.  Make sure you have quality shielded cables in and out of the SUT.  Good luck with this adventure.

[neobop]

You should check out Rothwell Audio.  I don't use an SUT, but heard good things about these:
http://www.rothwellaudioproducts.co.uk/html/hi-fi.html

The MC1 costs about $425.  The MCL is about $733.

neo

[griffithds]

S Clark

Quote:   '' It seems that in audio, all the $ goes toward those diminishing returns... that %10 improvement.''

   I wish it was that high.  Sometimes it only 0.05% and sometimes even the word 'improvement' might not be the correct word to use!
Regards,

[jsaliga]

S Clark

Quote:   '' It seems that in audio, all the $ goes toward those diminishing returns... that %10 improvement.''

   I wish it was that high.  Sometimes it only 0.05% and sometimes even the word 'improvement' might not be the correct word to use!
Regards,

I agree completely.  I used a Bob's Cinemag Blue SUT with a LOMC cartridge for about a year.  It was quite nice as far as that goes but I ended up changing to a solid state phono stage with enough gain for a LOMC and haven't regretted it one bit.

--Jerome