Anyone try class d amps

harley52 · « **on:** 29 Mar 2015, 12:28 pm »

Has someone tried class d amp with the VR22's or the VR33's? If so what was your impression. A simple description is all I'm asking for. If you have and didn't like what you heard what did you go back to or tried that worked well?

I have my eye on a Micromega AI400, the old model w/o the wireless included or something like that. I like the price of the Musical Fidelity PWR1 class d amp. But, I suspect there's a reason

and not a good reason they are selling for $500 or two for $800.
Thanks

groovybassist · « **Reply #1 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 01:12 pm »

I don't have VSA speakers, but I do have a black Micromega IA-400 I've been planning to sell. It's in brand new condition - not even broken in yet, with maybe 50-75 hours on it. I went a little crazy, had a mid-life crisis, and bought a Jeff Rowland Continuum S2 integrated, which is why I'm selling the Micromega. Just been a little slow getting it on the selling boards. I don't know which specific IA-400 you're looking at, but if go this direction and would like to look at alternatives pieces, feel free to PM me.

Good luck in your search. Hope you find the info and piece you're looking for.

-Mike

smilach · « **Reply #2 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 01:17 pm »

I own a pair of VR-4 Gen II's and a pair of VR-33's. Class D amplifiers I have used with both are the Wyred 4 Sound ST-500, the Spectron Musician II and the Spectron Musician III Mk2. All Class D amplifiers do not sound the same and even when similar modules are used, there can be clear differences in the bass, midrange and treble.

I can't comment on the Musical Fidelity but for the amps I mention above the W4S is decent and the Musician III Mk2 is superb with the Musician II falling between those two. A used W4S ST-250 or ST-500 would be slightly more than the new Musical Fidelity though I can't compare the two manufacturer's products.

SundayNiagara · « **Reply #3 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 02:28 pm »

Contact Paul McGowan at PS Audio. He tried building class D amps & gave up, deciding to go class AB, with a tube front end.

harley52 · « **Reply #4 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 04:04 pm »

Hey Mike, the Micromega is a new one with a silver face plate for under 4 figures. That 10 yr. warranty is sweet.

Hi Smilach, the amps you mentioned are built in N. America and I really like that whereas, the MF's are built in Taiwan, not that I have a problem with that as long as it's not made in China. I like to buy stuff made here or Canada as we can sure use all the work we can get in this economy.

mdconnelly · « **Reply #5 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 06:15 pm »

I own a pair of Vr-35s. I've tried 3 high-end amps or integrated amps now that I feel are exceptional with the VR-35s and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend any of them.

Arion HS-500s
NAD M2 integrated
Devialet 120 integrated

None of these are cheap but they all use class D in one form or another. Before trying these, I had been using a McCormack DNA-500 amp (class AB) which I loved. I'd say these 3 amps are on par with the McCormack in terms of overall sound quality although each had different strengths and weaknesses.

Class D (and hybrids like the Devialet) have come a long way in the last few years.

bummrush · « **Reply #6 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 06:27 pm »

Years ago.Bel canto and red dragon monos.Couldnt stand them.Highly fatiguing and exaggerated bass

groovybassist · « **Reply #7 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 06:29 pm »

I bought mine new from the same source and know some of the history of the silver one. My price would be in the same ballpark, but no blemishes. Good luck whatever you decide.

Mike

smilach · « **Reply #8 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 08:40 pm »

Quote from: harley52 on 29 Mar 2015, 04:04 pm

Hi Smilach, the amps you mentioned are built in N. America and I really like that whereas, the MF's are built in Taiwan, not that I have a problem with that as long as it's not made in China. I like to buy stuff made here or Canada as we can sure use all the work we can get in this economy.

I live in a rural area and the nearest high end audio store is at least a 140 mile drive and that is assuming they carry a product I want. If I am dealing with an American manufacturer I have a chance to deal with them directly on warranty/repair issues. For products made in Europe or in Asia everything becomes more difficult.

That said, the Spectron Musician II absolutely buried my 90's manufactured Aragon 8008BB that was driving my VR-4 Gen II's. The increased bass control and sweetness of treble was in an entirely different league. I later found the Musician III MK2 to be a significant jump up in performance relative to the Musician II. I listen to Japanese Taiko drums on a regular basis and for the "you are there" experience, finesse and slew rate is not sufficient. You also need horsepower.

-Scott

Delacroix · « **Reply #9 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 08:47 pm »

I concur with Scott's comments, there can be real differences in Class D. The best I've heard are the Spectron Musician III Mk2s, they are my reference and I have paired them with VR22s to great results. Slightly more affordable and also very good sounding amps that work well with Vons (though I'm not sure I heard them on the 22s) are the Digital Amp Co products. I'd give the nod to either of these over W4S.

kernelbob · « **Reply #10 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 08:57 pm »

Hi Scott,

I'm using the Spectron Musician III Mk2 amps in monoblock configuration for my bass amps or full range if I want to save tube life on the mid/treble amp. One thing that stands out with the Spectrons is that they sound the same no matter what volume level you use. Part of that is their power capability (1600 watts in monoblock mode I think).

The fact that class-D is very efficient means that the demands on current draw from the power supply is always varying. This is unlike, say, SET amps that have essentially constant power supply draw. So power conditioning and power cable choice has a big impact on the final sound.

Oh, I also have an older BelCanto 4 channel amp that has been relegated to a bedroom system which is about the only place I'd use it. Technology marches on.

Best,
Robert

barrows · « **Reply #11 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 11:48 pm »

Quote from: SundayNiagara on 29 Mar 2015, 02:28 pm

Contact Paul McGowan at PS Audio. He tried building class D amps & gave up, deciding to go class AB, with a tube front end.

Sunday: Your post is misleading. PS Audio has built many Class D amplifiers in the past, and Paul's recent prototypes with class D have used only older tech class D (specifically Hypex uCD modules with various front custom input stages) rather than more recent Hypex nCore, or Pascal technology.
Additionally, he never tried the tube front end of the new amp with the class D current stage either...
I have heard both the prototype class D amps, and the new tube/MOSFET hybrid class A/B amp...

barrows · « **Reply #12 on:** 29 Mar 2015, 11:53 pm »

Quote from: groovybassist on 29 Mar 2015, 01:12 pm

I don't have VSA speakers, but I do have a black Micromega IA-400 I've been planning to sell. It's in brand new condition - not even broken in yet, with maybe 50-75 hours on it. I went a little crazy, had a mid-life crisis, and bought a Jeff Rowland Continuum S2 integrated, which is why I'm selling the Micromega. Just been a little slow getting it on the selling boards. I don't know which specific IA-400 you're looking at, but if go this direction and would like to look at alternatives pieces, feel free to PM me.

Good luck in your search. Hope you find the info and piece you're looking for.

-Mike

Mike: I am envious of your S2! That is a fantastic sounding integrated, and to my mind a very good way to step off the audiophile bandwagon of constant "upgrades", and get something which will keep one happy long term: simple, great sounding, and solid. I wish I had the coin to make a similar move, and just forget about amps and volume controls forever...

groovybassist · « **Reply #13 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 12:22 am »

Barrows:

I consider myself very lucky to have the S2. Like most folks here, I spent too much time and money over the years churning through gear in search of the affordable holy grail. I just out of the blue decided it was time to get off the merry go round and start buying "destination" pieces - the kind of pieces you invest in and keep for a long time. The S2 was the first of these pieces. I was lucky enough to buy one in mint condition from the original owner and saved significantly off retail. Even then these are expensive pieces, but it's a fabulous amp. Once you have it, see it, touch it and listen to it, you understand the level of engineering that went into it and the expense seems much more reasonable. It's a keeper.

-Mike

stinky5 · « **Reply #14 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 01:08 am »

I don't have VSA's but I have been very pleased using the Class D Audio stereo amp to drive my Usher BE-718's. If you really want to try class d, $695 for a 300wpc amp is an inexpensive way to do it, and my experience with the company has been great. Also, made in the USA, if that matters to you.

gbeard · « **Reply #15 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 01:38 am »

Here is a my take on the 22's: http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue69/vsa_vr22_loudspeakers.htm

I used CIA D100B mono's with them and they sounded great. Ultimately I preferred my tube amp, but Class D can definitely sound wonderful.

barrows · « **Reply #16 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 03:30 am »

Mike: Sweet. By no means was I suggesting that the S2 is overpriced, indeed it is a fairly priced piece of gear for the level of engineering, build quality, and parts quality it employs. My only point was that I currently cannot afford it, even at a fair used price: this is just my problem, not a problem with the S2. I totally agree that it could be a "destination" component for many audiophiles tired of the merry go 'round!

I hope that you enjoy it for many years.

SundayNiagara · « **Reply #17 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 11:55 am »

Quote from: barrows on 29 Mar 2015, 11:48 pm

Sunday: Your post is misleading. PS Audio has built many Class D amplifiers in the past, and Paul's recent prototypes with class D have used only older tech class D (specifically Hypex uCD modules with various front custom input stages) rather than more recent Hypex nCore, or Pascal technology.
Additionally, he never tried the tube front end of the new amp with the class D current stage either...
I have heard both the prototype class D amps, and the new tube/MOSFET hybrid class A/B amp...

Try following Paul's posts.

dpatters · « **Reply #18 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 11:58 am »

I have used W4S SX500 monoblocks to drive a pair of VR4jrs. I then replaced the W4S with Hypex nc400 monoblocks
in Aluminati Sound cases which was a nice improvement. Have since replaced VR4jrs with Vapor Joule Black.

Don P.

groovybassist · « **Reply #19 on:** 30 Mar 2015, 12:14 pm »

Barrows:

No worries - I didn't take your post that way. Hope you find what you're looking for in this crazy hobby we call audio.

-Mike