[I.Greyhound Fan]

Then why do you need to spend another couple hundred for a speed box.

Try googling Pro-ject Carbon hum. That makes for good reading.

I won't say much more about the Orbit other than it's well represented on other forums and Fremer's review certainly makes it competitive with the other budget tables.

I have yet to read any substantive comparison that discusses how a budget Pro-ject is any different from a Rega other than Regas run slightly fast which is of course a feature, not a bug. Just a lot of brand loyalty recs. At least the Orbit had a transparent production process and quite a few comparison reviews with other tables including vintage.

I wouldn't exactly call the Debut Carbon a budget TT, especially the DC or Esprit versions.  It's build quality is exceptional as is the Carbon arm.  I don't think that the Orbit or Rega RP-1 (which has problems with platter wobble and build quality) are on par with it.

I saw this beautiful looking Teac TN-300 TT at the Needle Doctor a few weeks ago.   It looked like sales reps had brought it in to the store.  It looked very well built and like a high end piece of gear.  I was surprised at the budget price of $399 because it is just beautiful in person.  I would be curious as to how it sounds.  Here is a link-

http://www.teac.com/product/tn-300/images/

I know this is off topic, but I was looking at the products from Teac and reading professional reviews on their CD players and DAC's and they are excellent.  Dagogo really likes their CD player and UD-501 DAC.  They look like a lot of bang for the buck gear with excellent build quality.  I especially like the VU meters on their amps, very eye catching.

[I.Greyhound Fan]

Here is a user  review and pictures of the Teac TT-

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=631952

[jarcher]

The regular Orbit @ $179 seems like a good enough deal for a first time table for fun - assuming you can get one eventually as they are very backordered.  But $309 for the "plus" puts you uncomfortably close to better tables - such as the Debut Carbon. 

Far as I know only the Carbon DC & Esprit DC are current production models - and many of Pro-ject tables are basically going to a DC motor version.  With a Carbon DC or Esprit DC you basically don't need the Speed Box as it's essentially built in -  in fact the Speed Box only works with AC motor turntables, not the Carbon DC or Esprit DC, so it's not an option for those tables.  I think the move to DC is one of the reasons the speed is so true and stable on these tables.  I expect the Speed Box will be phased out in the not so distant future.

We sell the TEAC TN-300 and for the money it's a real beauty, particularly the Mahogany one.  The hardware (switch gear e.g.) also has a nice solid feel.  I still see the Project Debut Carbon DC as the better sounding table for $50 more, assuming you don't need the USB function or the built in phono preamp (which is not half bad actually). The Debut Carbon DC has a better cartridge, arm, and the speed is more precise (having measured the speed on both tables).  If you want something pretty and simple (e.g. a switch for speed change - no removal of platter necessary, built in phono preamp), and don't wan't to spend more than $400, it's a great buy.  We found that it does sound better removing the stock record mat and either placing the record directly on the platter - or even using a felt or Herbie mat.  The stock rubber mat is really too heavy and deadens the sound. 

As for TEAC in general : really beautifully built and a bargain, particularly now that they are offering mail in rebates of $100 - $150 through the end of March.  You don't really appreciate the build quality until you see and pick one up in person.  There's no rebate promotion on the turntable though as those are selling strongly and don't need them

[jarcher]

I have to beg to differ on the 2M Red at least in my system.  I used one on my Thorens TD-145 TT for a few weeks and it was still too bright.  It was dynamic and had some good qualities but it was very fatiguing and it had a lot of background noise.  And my system is far from bright with a Pass amp and BAT tube preamp and tube phono preamp. I replaced it with a Nagaoka MP-200 and was astounded at the difference.  The back ground was completely black, there was much more detail and no fatigue at all.  I would rather have the 2M  Blue,  Grado Prestige Gold or the Nagaoka MP-110 for about the same price as the 2M Red

The 2M Blue and Grado Gold are more than twice the price of the 2M Red.......but in the cartridge pricing world I guess that qualifies as about the same price. 

I had a 2M Blue and found it way too bright / fatiguing even in an all tube set up w/ warm cables (and noticeably brighter than the 2M Red). In general the "blue" models of Ortofon cartridges (i.e. 2M, Quintet, Cadenza) are their brightest models. Eventually settled, on a 2M Bronze which I'm quite happy with.

Don't know if I mentioned before that with the 2M series the stylus are interchangeable, so you can move up (or down) the line as you like to get the sound you want.  The 2M Bronze / Black do have the better cartridge body / wiring vs the Red / Blue. 

[Guy 13]

Hi all.
To me the TEAC TT-300 look like a good (little above) entry level turntable.
For less than 400 USD it looks really, really nice (Especially the Mahogany),
it's the kind of look I like, reminds me of the Sony stuff of the 70ties.
Does not look cheap at all compare to the boring/plain look
of the Pro-Ject and Rega.
As a real entry level turntable, I would choose the U Turn Orbit, (Made in Chicago)
I'm sure it's better than all those fully automatic turntables.
My opinion for what it's worth...

Guy 13

[Guy 13]

Hi chgolatin2,
I went on Needle Doctor website and did some comparison based more or less
only on the looks of the turntables.
TEAC TN-300 399 $
Thorens TD158 499 $
Rega RP-1 499 $
Music Hall MMF-2.2 449 $
Project Carbon DC 399 $
Denon DP300F 419 $
Audio Technica LP120 299 $
Pioneer PL-30 299 $
Marrantz TT42 329 $
U Turn Orbit Basic 179 $
U Turn Orbit Acrilic/Cork matt 419 $

If it was me, but it's not...
I would really choose the TEAC
Nice looking, nice controls, well built, nice arm assembly
and the price is right like Bob Barker use to say.
The second choice would be the Pro-Ject Carbon DC and the U Turn orbit.
My very, very last choice would be the Rega RP1
overprice and not that well built and super boring look.
There you go or should I say:
Here I go because that would be my choice, not yours, if I was shopping for a turntable.
I would sure like to do a change for change with my Rega P3 + Exact for a TEAC TN-300.
But again, that's me, not you.

Guy 13

 

[neobop]

Want to get back into vinyl, looking at some options.  I have a budget Of up to $650 looking at a few options.  Looking at the Project Carbon $449, Project Essential II $299, Rega RP1 $640 so far I like the project carbon.  Between these 3 options which one will be the best? Personally I like the Project Carbon, but I'm no guru expert in turntables... Used to own a Technics turntable in my younger days but that's all
Of my experience...

Thanks!

Only a new table?  If that is the case you should check out the new Pioneer IMO.  See what other reviewers say.  It's around $60 more than the RP1 and you could probably get a discount on Pioneer.   

Still have your records?   If so, are they in decent shape?  Do you have an RCM or cleaning method and did you budget for additional expenses?

You might want to consider another approach:
http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649178305-kenwood-kd5070-turntable/

http://www.vinylengine.com/library/kenwood/kd-5070.shtml

http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649171635-yamaha-ypd8/

http://www.vinylengine.com/library/yamaha/yp-d8.shtml

I guess used tables aren't for everyone, but you get more performance for your money.  The platter on the Yamaha weighs nearly 6 lbs.  The "marble" base on the Kenny is polyester resin and ground limestone.  It gives solidity the entry belt drivers can only dream about. 
You might have guessed that I don't like inexpensive belt drive tables.  That's because I actually listen.  You need a speed controller on virtually all of them to approach the performance of a servo controlled DD.  Speaking of upgrades, a new Rega is an upgrade waiting to happen. 

You might hear opinions to the contrary about speed stability.  I suggest going out and listen for yourself.  Maybe you'll soon be able to hear the Pioneer.  I haven't, but it might be worth the extra cash.
neo

[orthobiz]

I would sure like to do a change for change with my Rega P3 + Exact for a TEAC TN-300.
But again, that's me, not you.

Guy 13

Mais, peut-être: tout changer pour que rien ne change.

Paul

[Wayner]

Just remember that the Teac of today is not the Teac of yesterday. I have owned several pieces of the TASCAM brand, which is Teac professional, and many of them had a very short service life. Not very well made, IMO.

I would go for the new Pioneer DD over the Teac.

Wayner

[bacobits1]

That Pioneer PLX1000 (699) got a pretty good write up in the March Stereopile.
If it matters.

Here's a review that is similar.
http://www.cnet.com/news/pioneer-plx-1000-a-dj-turntable-an-audiophile-can-love/

[Wayner]

It does matter and someone from this outfit needs to go buy one and give us all a report, first hand!

Wayner

[I.Greyhound Fan]

I would consider upgrading to a Nagaoka MP-110 cartridge if you are going to stick with a budget cartridge.  The Nagaoka's have a house sound with some added warmth and are forgiving of surface noise.  You can pick one up for about $115.  I use an MP-200, its an awesome cartridge. Nagaoka's perform well above their price point.  They would be a great match with the Debut Carbon from what I heard with it and the stock 2M Red.  Another one to consider is the LPgear AT95SA or the AT95SH from Turntable Needles which is the same as the LP gear but for $10 less, although it won't be as warm as the Nagaoka.  Michael Fremmer gave the At95SA a glowing review in a 9 cartridge review-

http://www.analogplanet.com/content/nine-cartridges-compared-reviewed-and-voting-results

[woodsyi]

Only a new table?  If that is the case you should check out the new Pioneer IMO.  See what other reviewers say.  It's around $60 more than the RP1 and you could probably get a discount on Pioneer.   

Still have your records?   If so, are they in decent shape?  Do you have an RCM or cleaning method and did you budget for additional expenses?

You might want to consider another approach:
http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649178305-kenwood-kd5070-turntable/

http://www.vinylengine.com/library/kenwood/kd-5070.shtml

http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649171635-yamaha-ypd8/

http://www.vinylengine.com/library/yamaha/yp-d8.shtml

I guess used tables aren't for everyone, but you get more performance for your money.  The platter on the Yamaha weighs nearly 6 lbs.  The "marble" base on the Kenny is polyester resin and ground limestone.  It gives solidity the entry belt drivers can only dream about. 
You might have guessed that I don't like inexpensive belt drive tables.  That's because I actually listen.  You need a speed controller on virtually all of them to approach the performance of a servo controlled DD.  Speaking of upgrades, a new Rega is an upgrade waiting to happen. 

You might hear opinions to the contrary about speed stability.  I suggest going out and listen for yourself.  Maybe you'll soon be able to hear the Pioneer.  I haven't, but it might be worth the extra cash.
neo

I would lean this way.  I seem to remember you having a Clearaudio Concept or was it just the cart?  Anyway, I don't think you are going to get what you used to have from that budget buying new.

[wushuliu]

That Pioneer PLX1000 (699) got a pretty good write up in the March Stereopile.
If it matters.

Here's a review that is similar.
http://www.cnet.com/news/pioneer-plx-1000-a-dj-turntable-an-audiophile-can-love/

Stereophile says the Pioneer is a contender for 'Best TT under $2000' and Highly Recommended.

Response to that should be interesting.

[7x57]

I have owned a VPI HW-19 for 22 years now and there has never been a repair, just a single belt change becauuse I wanted to change it and have a spare belt. The Audioquest PT-6 tonearm has given similar service as well. Since it is domestic and parts are readily available, a used VPI turntable is an excellent choice. No electronics or other nonsense to go bad, like a Technics servo-controlled turntable I previously owned.

[rollo]

   Check out Rega and Music hall. as well. Great bang for the buck. Not a dealer of such.


charles

[orthobiz]

I have owned a VPI HW-19 for 22 years now and there has never been a repair, just a single belt change becauuse I wanted to change it and have a spare belt. The Audioquest PT-6 tonearm has given similar service as well. Since it is domestic and parts are readily available, a used VPI turntable is an excellent choice. No electronics or other nonsense to go bad, like a Technics servo-controlled turntable I previously owned.

     

I have John The Chair Guy's HW-19, bought it for about 800 bucks with a PT-6 on it, as I remember. Little by little I have done the SAMA motor upgrade, the speed controller box, the massive platter, the even more massive dustcover, the 10.5i tonearm, the sorbothane suspension pucks, the extra thick tonearm board. Parts are pretty easy to come by and you can do all the work yourself with a screwdriver. Well, maybe a drill press for the tonearm mounting. I also have a Linn Sondek that I don't dare touch because it's a tempermental springy thing! Mike at VPI has been a good resource for me whenever I had questions.

Paul