[Guy 13]

Hi all.
Below, there is a transcript of someone that claims that my Omega 7F drivers don't remotely resemble anything
from Omega speakers even if the drivers are Omega 7F and are now used in many Omega speakers.
I am asking myself: How can an Omega 7F drivers become much more better when it's in a enclosure?
For me, the only difference in sound would come from the fact that the enclosure extend the bass frequencies.
How can the mids and highs be better/improved with the addition of an enclosure.
By the way, I did try the Omega 7F in a bass reflex enclosure similar to the Omega
and the only difference I could hear, is that there was more bass.
The mids and highs were the same.
 
Quote: 
Guy13 is basing his impressions on a DIY speaker with drivers he purchased during the brief time Omega offered DIY drivers.  Guy13s speakers are not Omega and don't remotely resemble anything Louis has made,
just the drivers are Omega.
Unquote.

As usual, I will end my post by saying that I love my Omega 7F in the Open Baffle Dipole configuration
and I am sure it would match the Omega enclosure.
Don't forget that I have a super subwoofer to complement the bass.

Guy 13

[beowulf]

I'm not sure this it makes a huge difference, however I believe that the RS7 and 7F were not one and the same driver.  There were some differences if I recall, but I'm not sure what they actually were.

[Guy 13]

I'm not sure this it makes a huge difference, however I believe that the RS7 and 7F were not one and the same driver.  There were some differences if I recall, but I'm not sure what they actually were.

Hi beowulf.
My point is:
My Omega 7F drivers that I use in an Open Baffle Dipole configuration
(According to Canada Rob) is not as good or is not the same (Probably talking about the sound quality) as the 7F (Same as mine) Louis uses in his complete speaker enclosures.
For me the only difference is the bass section.
It really piss me off when I read that my driver is not the same
as the same driver Louis uses in his speaker cabinets.
I can see that Rob and Louis have something against me
and I know what it is.
I mentioned that my Omega 7F is not too good at reproducing big classical orchestras, but I did mention many, many times, that the Omega 7F that I have is extremely good at reproducing small orchestras and solo instruments.
Anyway, I don`t see what is the difference between the OEM Omega 7F driver I bought from Louis and the 7F Louis uses in one of his speaker enclosure. It's the same driver and the only difference is one with cabinet and the other with.
To me, the only difference would be the bass, lack of it with Open Baffle configuration, but I do have sub woofers.
Would a cabinet change/improve the quality of mids and highs because the 7F in in a cabinet?
I think not.
Anyway.

Guy 13


 
 

[hibuckhobby]

Guy 13,
It is possible that you are misunderstanding what was said because of your frustration and view
that Louis should still offer diy drivers.  What was said in the quote, is not that the drivers are
not the same, but that your speakers bear no resemblance to anything that Omega builds.  Which is true.
Your speakers a based on a open baffle design by (I believe) GR research.  They are very different from
what Omega builds.

The same driver in a different implementation will perform differently, so to make blanket statements
about the ability of a driver to do certain types of music without taking into account the difference in
baffle size, box/no-box and crossover or no crossover is a inaccurate statement.  You are reporting on
your experience in your specific room and implementation.  That cannot be generalized to all speakers
using an Omega driver or to speakers that Omega builds.

I doubt that they hold a grudge against you because you have an opinion that differs from theirs, it is
more likely (if they have any "feelings" toward you at all) that you simply won't let things die and appear
to always want the last word. 
Have a good day!
Hibuck....

[Guy 13]

Guy 13,
It is possible that you are misunderstanding what was said because of your frustration and view
that Louis should still offer diy drivers.  What was said in the quote, is not that the drivers are
not the same, but that your speakers bear no resemblance to anything that Omega builds.  Which is true.
Your speakers a based on a open baffle design by (I believe) GR research.  They are very different from
what Omega builds.

The same driver in a different implementation will perform differently, so to make blanket statements
about the ability of a driver to do certain types of music without taking into account the difference in
baffle size, box/no-box and crossover or no crossover is a inaccurate statement.  You are reporting on
your experience in your specific room and implementation.  That cannot be generalized to all speakers
using an Omega driver or to speakers that Omega builds.

I doubt that they hold a grudge against you because you have an opinion that differs from theirs, it is
more likely (if they have any "feelings" toward you at all) that you simply won't let things die and appear
to always want the last word. 
Have a good day!
Hibuck....

Hi Hibuck.
First I must say I like the way you wrote the above.
Second, I have to admit that my attitude, comments
and everything negative is for me to try to get rid of my frustration
for the fact that Louis have discontinued
or make unavailable very shortly after it's introduction
an excellent products for the DIYers.
Now that being said, let me comment your nicely written text.
Of course my Omega 7F drivers in Open Baffle Dipole configuration as none what so ever resemblance to Louis nice speaker enclosures.
No comparison, that's for sure.
With box - without box, it's obvious that we are not talking about the same thing at all.
My OBD set up is my design not Danny's design, the bottom section is based on Danny's V2 H frame design, but the top section is 100% my idea from my noggin.
You said and I quote:
The same driver in a different implementation will perform differently.
Unquote.
To me and please, prove me wrong, the difference is only in the bass department, since the OBD does not have a box.
Now, the movement of the cone might be affected/altered by the fact that with no box it's not loaded, it's free of movement, has no restriction.
Does that makes the difference in sound?
Does that improve the sound in the mids and high's sections.
Does that make the same Omega 7F driver better in the mids and highs
because it's in a box ????? 
If it's so, I would like the expert, the designer, the builder himself to explain with simple words, why it's better, why the same driver sound better with a box and I'm not talking about the bass section.
My sub-woofers based on Danny's H frame V2 design (Heavily modify to many AC members despair.) is giving me the best bass I ever heard.
I am convinced that Canada Rob and Louis have a grudge against me.
Louis at one time said that I made absurd joke, the same joke I did many times on other topics and that everybody found funny.
Louis corner is for Louis followers and no one makes jokes, Omega speakers is serious stuff.
That's my opinion and that's how I see it with my several years of AC experience.
You said that I (Always) want to have the last word.
I don't know about that, but maybe you are right, but maybe I am not aware of it and I do it without knowing it. Thanks for mentioning.
Anyway, I rarely post on Louis corner, because I don't feel welcome and I don't feel that I can freely post my sincere option based on my personal experience.
I love my Omega 7F Open Baffle Dipole arrangement, it plays solo instruments, electronic music and small ensembles extremely well, the best in 48 years of audiophile life.
Thanks for your comments.
I wish more AC members would share their opinion like you did.

Guy 13
 

[ClefChef]

It would be nice if Louis would publish some kind of test data of his drivers. There's nothing on frequency response, impedance, sensitivity, resonance, etc.
I think any company that is making extraordinary claims (Canada Rob) should back those claims up with data.

I just wonder why Omega is not building speakers with reputable drivers like Mark Audio, Tang Band or Fostex.

[gab]

It would be nice if Louis would publish some kind of test data of his drivers. There's nothing on frequency response, impedance, sensitivity, resonance, etc.
I think any company that is making extraordinary claims (Canada Rob) should back those claims up with data.

I just wonder why Omega is not building speakers with reputable drivers like Mark Audio, Tang Band or Fostex.

+1

[seikosha]

It would be nice if Louis would publish some kind of test data of his drivers. There's nothing on frequency response, impedance, sensitivity, resonance, etc.
I think any company that is making extraordinary claims (Canada Rob) should back those claims up with data.

I just wonder why Omega is not building speakers with reputable drivers like Mark Audio, Tang Band or Fostex.

Louis used to have all this data on his website for the RS5 and 7 series drivers.  It's not there anymore on the new updated site.  Not sure why.   The frequency response charts looked pretty good.  I've measured my RS5 drivers in my room as well as Harbeth's, Kefs, Silverlines and other speakers and from about 60-10k they measure as good if not better than any speakers I've had in my room.

In addition to Omegas, I've got single driver speakers using Seas, Fostex and Markaudio drivers and to my ears, the Omega drivers really do the best job in my listening rooms.  I know in the past Louis has tried drivers from many different companies.  I guess he was never satisfied with what was out there so he went on and had his own designs built.

[Guy 13]

Hi all.
I understand why Louis use his own drivers.
That way he can keep his speakers prices low, read: Very low
for the quality of construction and sound.
If I was a speakers manufacturer,
I would use my own drivers,
I mean drivers made by someone else, but to my own specs.
I agree that Louis should do like all speaker manufacturers
and publish/make available specs.
Would you buy a car if specs were not available?
I know, a car is not a speaker, but both are still a consumer's product.

Guy 13

[JohnR]

Guy, why should he do that, it's not like you are going to buy his speakers anyway. Honestly, your last post has me thinking that this is some kind of attack thread, I'm hoping you can do something to correct that impression.

[Guy 13]

Hi all.
I think Louis should make his Omega OEM drivers available again,
but via Canada Rob website.
His drivers are so good, that even at double the price, I would buy them.
All the models of the Omega drivers could fit on one web page
(Maybe Canada Rob or Louis website)
with short recommendations on enclosure dimensions
and recommendation on OBD. (Open Baffle Dipole)
Therefore Louis could keep doing what is good at and that speakers building
and Canada Rob could handle the sales, which is good at.
A win win situation, for Louis, Canada Rob and the DIYers.
Is that something too complicated, I think not.

Guy 13
 

[Guy 13]

Guy, why should he do that, it's not like you are going to buy his speakers anyway. Honestly, your last post has me thinking that this is some kind of attack thread, I'm hoping you can do something to correct that impression.

Hi JohnR.
I tried to be as nice as possible, I made great efforts to choose carefully
my words, I don't know where you see any attack.
Maybe you are not wrong when you say I would not buy anyway his speakers,
but I would buy his drivers, especially at the price he originally offered them.
Please stop thinking I am attacking Louis, I am trying to be a nicer guy now, you have not noticed ???
Read again my post.
Please.
Thanks you.

Guy 13

 

[FireGuy]

Hi all.
I think Louis should make his Omega OEM drivers available again,
but via Canada Rob website.
His drivers are so good, that even at double the price, I would buy them.
All the models of the Omega drivers could fit on one web page
(Maybe Canada Rob or Louis website)
with short recommendations on enclosure dimensions
and recommendation on OBD. (Open Baffle Dipole)
Therefore Louis could keep doing what is good at and that speakers building
and Canada Rob could handle the sales, which is good at.
A win win situation, for Louis, Canada Rob and the DIYers.
Is that something too complicated, I think not.

Guy 13
 

Guy 13 -

I think it's important to understand that most audio vendors have a plan.  A business plan with specific target markets and goals.   To attempt to be everything for every buyer is not an easy proposition and personally I would not recommend it.  For me, Louis not getting involved in the DIY market makes sense.  He's introducing and developing new and redesigned products that I'm sure takes significant time and resources...ergo DIY is now gone.  I would love to see (for example) some speaker companies  make a speaker that doesn't take three months to make because the exquisite finish necessitates it...for much less $$ (still retaining the sonic quality) and have the ability to Visa down.   But, it's their plan, their target customers.  And I get that. 

I rather like your set up and would love to hear them some day.

 

[ClefChef]

Louis used to have all this data on his website for the RS5 and 7 series drivers.  It's not there anymore on the new updated site.  Not sure why.   The frequency response charts looked pretty good.  I've measured my RS5 drivers in my room as well as Harbeth's, Kefs, Silverlines and other speakers and from about 60-10k they measure as good if not better than any speakers I've had in my room.

In addition to Omegas, I've got single driver speakers using Seas, Fostex and Markaudio drivers and to my ears, the Omega drivers really do the best job in my listening rooms.  I know in the past Louis has tried drivers from many different companies.  I guess he was never satisfied with what was out there so he went on and had his own designs built.

Interesting observation. I was not aware that KEF or Harbeth were using full range drivers. From 60 to 10k even RadioShack looks pretty good, depending on how you measure it.
It is a nice thought though that a single guy, building speaker cabinets, can actually design equally good or better driver than all those companies specializing in driver research, design and development. Reality is probably more profane.

[Guy 13]

Guy 13 -

I think it's important to understand that most audio vendors have a plan.  A business plan with specific target markets and goals.   To attempt to be everything for every buyer is not an easy proposition and personally I would not recommend it.  For me, Louis not getting involved in the DIY market makes sense.  He's introducing and developing new and redesigned products that I'm sure takes significant time and resources...ergo DIY is now gone.  I would love to see (for example) some speaker companies  make a speaker that doesn't take three months to make because the exquisite finish necessitates it...for much less $$ (still retaining the sonic quality) and have the ability to Visa down.   But, it's their plan, their target customers.  And I get that. 

I rather like your set up and would love to hear them some day.

Hi FireGuy.
Quote:
For me, Louis not getting involved in the DIY market makes sense. 
Unquote.
That's why in a previous post I wrote that Canada Rob should himself offer the OEM drivers, since Louis is busy.
Again, I agree that Louis should keep doing what he's good at
and should not get involve in marketing drivers.
You like my set up and would love to hear them someday.
Make it this year or early next year,
because after that,
I might not be available or my system might not be available
or maybe ebven both ????
You might not like the sound of my system, because it's tailored especially for my brain and ears.
Thanks for your comments.

Guy 13
 

[seikosha]

Interesting observation. I was not aware that KEF or Harbeth were using full range drivers.

I don't think they do.  I was comparing the measurements of my Single driver speakers to Harbeths, Kefs etc using multiple drivers.

[Guy 13]

Interesting observation. I was not aware that KEF or Harbeth were using full range drivers. From 60 to 10k even RadioShack looks pretty good, depending on how you measure it.
It is a nice thought though that a single guy, building speaker cabinets, can actually design equally good or better driver than all those companies specializing in driver research, design and development. Reality is probably more profane.

Hi ClefChef.
(In French: La clé du chef.)
You are so right about Louis.
A one man business designing and building nice looking cabinets
that sounds good.
That's why I say again:
He should keep doing what he's good at.

Guy 13

[ClefChef]

I don't think they do.  I was comparing the measurements of my Single driver speakers to Harbeths, Kefs etc using multiple drivers.

 

[seikosha]

Are you serious? 

I think asking HOW measurements were done is not necessary.

Absolutely.  Measurements were taken at the listening chair at ear height.  Same as when I'm listening.  I have no doubt that if I were in an anechoic chamber, things would be completely different.

[ejfud]

I to wish Louis was selling the DIY drivers. Never had the chance to get a pair and would love to build around a pair. I understand why Louis made the decision he did and respect his choice.

Who's to say that the Fostex/Mark Audio drivers have more research behind them. We have no idea who builds the Omega drivers.

Let's all play nice, we don't get a lot of traffic in this forum and let's not run someone off with bad attitude.