[kyrill]

Hi

I am just ventilating my frustration.
I am building wooden enclosures of plywood and MDF  for my AKSA's 55 and 40 watts amps and for my 2 gk-1.

I takes days. I thought I was handy (skilful) . I  can cook, I can repair my car, the roof of the house,  I can solder and weld, I can even draw and paint

But my housings continue to look amateurish. panels should match with a tolerance within 1 millimeter. half the thickness of the blade of my saw. . And now after 5 times spraying with paint and scouring it starts to look, pfff ..normal like bought in a supermarket!!
It must be my age.
Put me in the league of veteran where you will meet Hugh.
Hugh, I mean this as a compliment!

And then i bough silverleaf (like gold-leave, but silver) I thought the white metal (aluminium foil and chroom look grey-like, silver is really beautiful white like compared to alu kitchen foil)
But gosh they are so thin (still thicker than gold -leave) I already destroyed 2 complete leaves.. And within a day if possible, you have to varnish it against corrrosion. For shielding the colour of silver does not matter, but for the looks, (when you open it..) it does.

I cannot do less thanks to this forum!!
You are all spoiled by the beautiful examples of the Aspen Gallery and also the GK-1 and AKSA deserve a best looking enclosure.

Iron/aluminium  enclosures ready bought are sóóó much easier..

[andyr]

... now after 5 times spraying with paint and scouring it starts to look, pfff ..normal like bought in a supermarket!!
...

Kyrill,

With respect, I think a good paint finish is one of the nardest things for an amateur to do well.  

FYI, in a couple of weeks I am going to take my LP12 turntable apart to install a carbon-fibre subchassis (a well-known LP12 tweak!).  Now, the LP12 has a wooden plinth which 10 or so years ago, I painted black (very amateurish looking!).

When it's disassembled, I am going to take the plinth to a piano restorer and get them to strip the paint off and put on the normal glossy black "ebonised" finish that grand pianos have.  I think this will look nice, sitting next to my GK-1 ... and having tried painting it once, I am certainly not going to make the same mistake a second time!!  

Regards,

Andy

[pea]

kyrill,

Many of us have been where you are now. I remember on many occassions buying expensive, exotic, beautiful woods and imagining the fabulous cabinets I would make only to be greatly disapointed with the final result. But... each one I did was better than the one before. With patience and practice my joints got tighter, boxes more square and my finishes more delightful to look at.

Do the best you can for now and be proud of your accomplishments. In a couple months you'll look at what you have done and say to yourself, "you know, I think I can do it better." and you'll go out and build a better cabinet. Most likely it won't be perfect, but most likely it will be better.

... and so it goes.

Enjoy the work, enjoy the learning and most importantly, enjoy the music!

Bruce

[kyrill]

thanx Bruce
 and Andy

Today is the 6th day I am working at the wood project (5 hrs a day max) and it starts after another layer of scouring and painting, it starts to look ..ehhe  "acceptable" I am doing the varnish now.
Also the "design" is nice. 3 amps per enclosure (triamping) in probably the smallest enclosure possible. lenght and height are precisely matching the 2 heatsinks ( on the oustside like EchiDna's  Aksa but with Hugh's orginal but smaller heatsinks,  one on each side)  and the width is from heatsink to heatsink 19 cms. It looks small and cute. When things are finshed I post some pictures.

And Bruce you are right. It can be bettered (much more profesional) but I think I follow Andy's road. Some time later I will bring it to a professional to let it be veneered. I cannot change the house without throwing away the pure silver-leaves inside.

[andyr]

... the pure silver-leaves inside...

Kyrill,

I think you're a cheapskate, mate.  Here you are with AKSAs and you didn't go with GOLD LEAF!!     What's wrong with you, man ... don't you want the best?  (Ask James Galway whether he'd rather have a silver flute or a gold one!    )

Good luck ... looking forward to seeing the pictures.

Regards,

Andy

[Seano]

Why do I get the feeling that kyrill's idea of 'looking like it came from a supermarket' is actually more like just stepped out of IKEA.  In other words, most of us would be very happy to have it in our homes and kyrill is simply nitpicking.

Kyrill, timber is harder to work with than metal yet requires less special toys which makes it easier

Basically to produce a spectacular result in timber requires something special.  Special takes patience.  Painting and stripping five times is patience - I'd have chucked it in the river by now according to your criteria. I suspect you'll get special.

[jules]

Sean, since you outlined your idea for an Aksa 100 case, seemingly cut out of a solid piece of Red Gum (or sim.), I've been wondering what sort of advanced wood working tools you might use. Now that you make the point that only simple tools are needed I finally realize that your plan is to do  this work with advanced chain saw artistry!

Kyrill, I can understand your frustration and wood does need a different sort of approach to steel etc. Saws and common hand tools aren't all that accurate so the best approach in many situations is to be to leave a bit of extra wood that you take off with finer tools or by sanding. I find it does grow on you though and there's something special about finishing off a wood product particularly when the natural grain is part of the design.

I'm not sure if I should even mention this idea but I calculate that you could entirely cover an Aksa amp with gold leaf for about $50. I can't escape the vision   . Cleaning would certainly be easy. No polishing required, only the occasional wipe with a damp cloth (also needed to wipe the brows of anyone gazing upon it).

Jules

[andyr]

Sean,  ... calculate that you could entirely cover an AKSA amp with gold leaf for about $50. ...

Jules, Where d'ya get gold leaf from?  How do you apply it?  Maybe "AKSA" done in gold leaf would be a nice addition to my black Al front plate?

Regards,

Andy

[kyrill]

th

Jules.
You are right about the price of the  gold leaves. The internet shop i bought the silver-leaves from (www.kalligrafie.com ) has different kind of goldleaves.
But I thought "gold"...,  a little too much. I do not like the special luxury for the sake of luxury decoupled from functonalism.
And silver was much cheaper  

But those leaves demand special skills. you have to treat the frail leaves as if you handle a very young virgin made of crystalline ice under the wrong side of the law. Very delicate

I didn't have any experience in delicate woodwork. If I had your advice earlier..
Now I know to oversize a bit the panels,, then glueing them, then sanding them to the precises measures and then only paint them. I started with panels and painting. And worse,  using sinken screws and then afterwards tried to fill the  holes invisible with a kind of paste and painting them all over. What a bad time consuming approach. The holes stayed visible

Andyr.
The gold is so thin you could easily look through it ! It is almost the weight of air. probably over 50 times thinner than you kitchen alu foil.
You need a one day course to learn how to apply it. I t will show you the tiniest spot of dust underneath the gold. (your amp's front plate) and then you have to protect this 1/70 of mm thin plate by varnishing it.

[Seano]

Chainsaw management for AKSA construction?? Actually that's not a bad idea!  I've got a couple of decent old fenceposts at home that I could rebate with the chainsaw to fit all the bits.  Nice idea.

To make a decent metal case you may need metal cutting, folding, welding and polishing equipment.  And none of this can be purchased down at the local Bunnings or at least not for the bucks you pay for wood gear. I just paid $40 for a 1/4" router just to see what it was like - the set of bits cost more than the router!  Should do the job.  Metal gear costs a bomb.  Even a decent folder will set you back a grand and a welder that can do 1mm metal will cost at least that as well. Basically any hack handyman like me can easy get some woodworking kit together without annoying the missus or the bank manager but metal gear? No way.

Gold leaf is available from any craft shop. It is applied using glue. Spray or brush and then gently lay over the glue. give it a light brush or gentle wipe with a soft cloth and it's done.....but if you want it smooth like polished metal then look out!!! Normal finish is a bit wrinkly.  Personally I'd have gone the extra expense of electroplating rather than use leaf - it'd drive me nuts!!

[kyrill]

Seano is right.

Working with the leaves makes you nuts. And then it is much more tricky than Seano suggests with

It is applied using glue. Spray or brush and then gently lay over the glue. give it a light brush or gentle wipe with a soft cloth and it's done....

In corners or where two panels "meet" each other as soon as a tiniest part of the leave touches the wettish glue, you cannot correct anymore. the whole leave will follow the wrong" angle".
Many times when o so gently brushing, small parts of the leave stick to the soft cloth and leaves ruined parts on the panel

The effect however is mesmerising. the effect of the properly glued leave, that is.
At the moment of giving up (it is that difficult) I had a bright idea that I will work out today.
Make the leaves much sturdier by making them much thicker!!  
So, over a perfect level marble kitchentable I spread kitchen alu foil, as a perfect flat 2D level and then glue the copper (for the AKSA's) and silver (for the GK-1's) on top of the alu.  
When dried I use the alu copper (silver) combi as the new leave.
This must work Eureka

Wow,  how I was wrong It is still much  too difficult. The glue I use must be wrong. too wet. For goldleaves you use special glue "Mixtion" . You use it when it feels dry, but still glues. Being an egghead i thought any glue would do. So I used thinned glue on a waterbasis you normally use to glue paper. The watery glue between copperfoil and alu foil did not dry. The thin leaves floated on top of the glue.
Half  a squaire(?)  meter took me 3 very difficult hrs.
I want to give up, but I have all those foils in the house.. and it looks so very special.
Also the cat jumped on the kitchen table on the glued foils  and ruined 45 minutes .Sigh..I really wish that this crazy idea would never had come up.

[DSK]

Also the cat jumped on the kitchen table on the glued foils and ruined 45 minutes ...

So, is the cat now sitting on the mantlepiece ....murdered, stuffed and gold leafed?      

[Seano]

Like I said if you want perfect smooth gold leaf then you are going to go spare. Gold leaf is really for inlay work and patterning in wood where you end with a kind of golden crinkley finish that is supposed to exude old world charm.....so say all those lifestyle home improvement shows anyway.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Electroplating

As for the cat......I wouldn't waste the gold leaf.  I'd use cheap gold spray paint. Harder for the egotistical sods to get off.

[kyrill]

I am close to finishing the wooden houses for the Aksa's
The acryl satin finish subdue the glossy copper foil, but to choose for brilliant shiny glossy varnishing of the copper leaves seemed a bit over the top. It is only the inside of the houses!.
Slowly I am geting there and I am curious how you will respond to my structural expression of Hugh's vision.
More and more I recognise how hard it is to be special in something as 'mainstream" as an audio amp .
There are so many. How can you convince the public that in this case the Aspen is something special regardless of cost? Not the best within 6,000 dollars, but still?
I must still build my 3rd AKSA but my delegation of the tri way speaker production is hesitatant. I have big reservations of the costs involved. Maybe Holland is a bit spoiled and expensive. But  "they' ask for a floor standing speaker of 1,20 mtr height, build of 1 inch MDF together with 1 inch plywood and 0,4 inch mystical heavy material in between, which totalises  little over 2 inch thickness pro panel,  1000 Euro a box. That is over  1650 AUD for one speaker enclosure excluding the speaker units and without any kind of passive cross-over. But with a nicely veneer  finish.
It seems expensive to me. Is it?
I WILL NOT build my own speakers. God forbids. I have spend weeks in building my amplifier wooden enclosures as big as a box wherein you find your new shoes delivered by the shoe shop. My first encounter with wood and the one before the last. I am not a carpenter.  i was a lover. Still am in my mind, but not a carpenter.. I love the smell though, like good coffee.

[andyr]

I am close to finishing the wooden houses for the AKSAs
....... I love the smell though, like good coffee...

Is that like "I love the smell of napalm in the morning...?"  

We have some wonderful-smelling woods here in Oz.

I hope you're gonna post some pictures for us to see how it has come out.  You're certainly doing something that I don't think I would ever attempt!

regards,

Andy

[kyrill]

I hope you're gonna post some pictures for us to see how it has come out.  You're certainly doing something that I don't think I would ever attempt!

regards,

Andy

Nor would I if I knew what I was doing ]
I put some "in between the process pictures" on the gallery
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=279

[lazyfly]

Hi Kyrill.

To post an image using BBCode do the following:

Code: [Select]


type entire path name where the image is located on the internet, between the two image tags below...

[img]path here[/img]

eg:

[img]http://home.iprimus.com.au/bearware/winamp/images/menu/spacelink.gif[/img]

The above gives the below result...




If you're unsure of the exact location of the image you want to post you can right-click on the image itself to bring up the properties which will (should!) give the exact url. If in doubt preview your post

I would like to see more pics, too!

HTH

[kyrill]

welcome to the forum lazyfly
thanks for the tip

Today hopefully I will hookup my second AKSA with the internal wires (finished the first yesterday). I strip the signal path wires and internal speaker wire from their teflon sheet and replace it with white shoelaces of white 100% cotton. What a nasty beasts. Your fingers have to be sooo clean..

[kyrill]

HE hè

Two amps are finished.

Still to go One AKSA and 2 GK-1 (But now with alot of wooden experience

One amp was already finished 6 months ago, but now in a new wooden enclosure.
The second amp (brand new) is now continous playing (probably  less than 1 watt on average) for 36 hours .However the difference in sound is still big. The "old" amp has a transparent "magic", the second sounds just nice, everything else the same.

How long does it take to "burn in" the black Gates in the N+ update? I forgot
(search in this forum on "burn in BG " gives too many entrees, over 60 pages, 19 entrees..)

Ps tomorrow I will post photoos

[DSK]

How long does it take to "burn in" the black Gates in the N+ ...

In the 100N+ I found that the sound became a bit strident (bright, etched) at approx 60 hours, but then suddenly lost this nastiness at 92 hours. I felt it was almost fully burned in at approx 120 hours, with perhaps very minor extra refinement continuing until approx 160 hours. I was playing it at a reasonably loud volume for most of that time. So, don't worry if it gets a bit nasty before finally getting better ....believe me, it is worth the wait