[this_is_vv]

Has anyone tried that?....Planning to get Omega and thinking to cross around 10,000 to RAAL 140-15d....anyone have tried it?


V

[Canada Rob]

Has anyone tried that?....Planning to get Omega and thinking to cross around 10,000 to RAAL 140-15d....anyone have tried it?


V

Hello V,
You say you are planning to get some Omegas.  Have you heard them, and thus feel they need more top end?  I have heard most of Louis' line up, and haven't felt the need for a tweeter of any kind.

[this_is_vv]

Hello V,
You say you are planning to get some Omegas.  Have you heard them, and thus feel they need more top end?  I have heard most of Louis' line up, and haven't felt the need for a tweeter of any kind.

Yes i have heard Omega and there is something about RAAL that i just dont want to leave.....again it would be my preference.....just asking if someone else tried here too


V

[Canada Rob]

The RAAL 70-10 would be a better choice, and leave the 8" running full range.  Face the tweeter to the back so you don't lose the single point source of the 8".

[DaveC113]

If you want to do this with the RAAL covering most of the high end you'll need a conventional crossover with a minimum of a 2nd order electrical filter on the RAAL, which would mostly defeat the purpose the speaker... you'd probably be better off using a different driver or cutting the whizzer off the Omega driver, which would be very scary as Alnico drivers aren't cheap.

One way you could do this is to cross over very high (~10k) 1st order and run the tweeter facing back as CR recommended, but you need a minimum of 4' and even better 6' placement from the back wall. Another option is to face the tweeter up towards the ceiling, possibly with the tweeter behind the speaker and located near the floor to maximize path length.

If you do the rear or upfiring configuration with a high crossover point you may like the results... just don't try to face the RAAL forward and have it combine with the whizzer, that probably will not work well.

If you try it let us know how it goes!

[this_is_vv]

I already have 140-15 lying around and Ty for suggestions that I would try to point it backward

I am safe around 1 feet away from wall but I have acoustic absorbers there

[DaveC113]

I already have 140-15 lying around and Ty for suggestions that I would try to point it backward

I am safe around 1 feet away from wall but I have acoustic absorbers there

1' away from wall will NOT work well. Upfiring is the only configuration that's worth trying imo.

[Canada Rob]

1' away from wall will NOT work well. Upfiring is the only configuration that's worth trying imo.

Ditto.

[ricardojoa]

i cant imagine putting a raal tweet on the back, seems like a good waste a great tweeter.
If you wanted to run it like a conventional two way, i would guess you would be better off measuring the alnuco off axis, and decided what xover works best.

[pstrisik]

Why not a high pass instead of a xover.  Why run the signal through a xover to the Omega driver? 

........Peter

[Canada Rob]

i cant imagine putting a raal tweet on the back, seems like a good waste a great tweeter.
If you wanted to run it like a conventional two way, i would guess you would be better off measuring the alnuco off axis, and decided what xover works best.

Putting the tweeter on the front would defeat the whole idea of a single driver speaker and introduce phase alignment and smearing problems common with two+ way speakers.  The reason for the rear facing tweeter is that it would add ambience and top end without sacrificing the qualities of the 8" single driver - which is pinpoint focussed imaging.

[ClefChef]

Putting the tweeter on the front would defeat the whole idea of a single driver speaker and introduce phase alignment and smearing problems common with two+ way speakers.  The reason for the rear facing tweeter is that it would add ambience and top end without sacrificing the qualities of the 8" single driver - which is pinpoint focussed imaging.

If tweeter (super tweeter) is used in addition to full range driver it is crossed at > 10-12 kHz where full range driver can not operate, and those include Omega drivers as well. Super tweeter arrangement usually does not impede pinpoint focused imaging because of the "supersonic" range of operation. Care should be taken to align the tweeter.

If you measured Omega (or any other 8"-12") full range driver response you would discover that they start sloping down at around 10 kHz, best of them struggle past 12 kHz - not a very "full range" situation. Smaller drivers perform better in that region but are also limited in frequency response.

[guillaume bougard]

Why try and tweak Omega speakers which are designed and built with a specific philosophy and deliver a specific type of atmosphere and performances? You might be better off getting an altogether different pair of speakers that may be better adapted to your needs.

Not wanting to get into technical stuff, looks like you're trying to transform a city bike into a mountain bike, or vice versa.

[Canada Rob]

If tweeter (super tweeter) is used in addition to full range driver it is crossed at > 10-12 kHz where full range driver can not operate, and those include Omega drivers as well. Super tweeter arrangement usually does not impede pinpoint focused imaging because of the "supersonic" range of operation. Care should be taken to align the tweeter.

If you measured Omega (or any other 8"-12") full range driver response you would discover that they start sloping down at around 10 kHz, best of them struggle past 12 kHz - not a very "full range" situation. Smaller drivers perform better in that region but are also limited in frequency response.

The tweeter in question, the RAAL 140-15D does not operate only in the "supersonic" range as it is a "mid/high" transducer and will definitely effect the pinpoint operation of the 8" full range.

[Canada Rob]

V,
My suggestion is to scrap buying the Omegas and build or have built some speakers that incorporate a fast pro driver woofer to go with your RAAL.  I think you would be happier in the long run than trying to work with a full range speaker like the 8" Omega. 

[ClefChef]

The tweeter in question, the RAAL 140-15D does not operate only in the "supersonic" range as it is a "mid/high" transducer and will definitely effect the pinpoint operation of the 8" full range.

one could cross it at 18k (12k acoustically) and avoid messing with "pinpoint operation".
In my opinion Omega would benefit greatly by adding a supertweeter option to his designs.

[Canada Rob]

one could cross it at 18k (12k acoustically) and avoid messing with "pinpoint operation".
In my opinion Omega would benefit greatly by adding a supertweeter option to his designs.

Have you heard any of, or all his designs?  Have you heard any of his current designs?

[DaveC113]

one could cross it at 18k (12k acoustically) and avoid messing with "pinpoint operation".
In my opinion Omega would benefit greatly by adding a supertweeter option to his designs.

I'm not so sure, I think the current Omega drivers measure up to 20 kHz with the exception of the whizzerless 7".

But OTOH, I have heard some really nice supertweeters and extension past 20 kHz seems to add some "air" or ambiance. At the last RMAF there was a demo of a plasma supertweeter used with some very expensive Magico speakers. It sounded a little nicer with them but those super tweeters cost A LOT!

My take is that some may prefer using a super tweeter but good ones are very expensive and not strictly necessary with Omega speakers.

[ClefChef]

Have you heard any of, or all his designs?  Have you heard any of his current designs?

I heard most of them and owned quite a few.
Have you heard (or sell) anything else but Omega?

I like omega speakers and think it's a great value and design, but it is no reason to sanctify it beyond fault - it is just a simple box with one driver, with all its benefits as well as limitations and shortcomings. There are better speakers out there.

I recall another post where you are praising Outlaw speakers that is not a single driver design  How about the "pinpoint accuracy" there?

[ClefChef]

I'm not so sure, I think the current Omega drivers measure up to 20 kHz with the exception of the whizzerless 7".

In the absence of official data it is difficult to say with certainty. All we know that the best full range drivers in diameters 8" and higher are limited to 14-15k at best - it's just physics.