Sound Quality - Copied CD's vs Original CD?

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fado

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Sound Quality - Copied CD's vs Original CD?
« on: 20 Mar 2014, 10:56 pm »
Assuming good equipment and no up-sampling, will a copied CD lose some sound quality simply because it is a copy? Also, I see some CD's are labeled "for music". Is this just niche marketing or are there real differences in blank media when the intended use is for music?

Thank You

*Scotty*

Re: Sound Quality - Copied CD's vs Original CD?
« Reply #1 on: 20 Mar 2014, 11:59 pm »
In my opinion no. The sound quality is not degraded and when Memorex Black CDRs are used the sound quality is actually better than the original. YMMV.
I stopped spinning the silver disc about 4years ago and went to computer playback, but I preferred to copy my favorite CDs to CDRs for the best sound quality upon playback. I still use Black CDR copies in my truck as it is so old that there is no USB flash drive input on the CD player.
Here is an archived paper by Gary Leonard Koh in downloadable pdf form that discusses copying CDs to CDRs in depth and also covers the Black CDR and even better sounding alternatives. http://www.genesisloudspeakers.com/archive/Black_CD_Paper_v3.pdf
Here is some information about optical media and the manufacturers of the highest quality blanks.
http://www.digitalfaq.com/reviews/dvd-media.htm
http://www.macx.dk/Media/
Scotty

Ericus Rex

Re: Sound Quality - Copied CD's vs Original CD?
« Reply #2 on: 21 Mar 2014, 11:04 am »
When I was CD player shopping I'd make a copy of my test discs so I could go back and forth between the players in real time using my pre's input selector.  I was worried about the copy being inferior so after I had made some impressions about the players I'd swap the discs and listen again.  I found the copies did not sound any different than the originals.  This would be true only for redbook CDs, not hi-rez, or course.

FullRangeMan

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Re: Sound Quality - Copied CD's vs Original CD?
« Reply #3 on: 21 Mar 2014, 11:23 am »
What is the best blank CDR currently for music??


richidoo

Re: Sound Quality - Copied CD's vs Original CD?
« Reply #5 on: 21 Mar 2014, 06:08 pm »
Some good info in this wiki... but take it fwiw since wiki's are not 100% reliable.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CD-R

Error correction is one aspect of physical CDs that is not present with music files. It is information added to the burned disk when writing errors are encountered. The player has to process these error codes and ignore faulty data written to the disk in order to produce a good data stream for the DAC.

Copying a CD to a CD-R is not a "playback" event where the redbook software layer is engaged to remove error correction codes to produce a clean data stream. Copying a redbook CD to CD-R simply moves whatever bits are on the CD over to the new disk, including the original error correction words and the bad data. Some people believe that this error correction reduces sound quality. It might be beneficial (and significantly more work) to rip the tracks to files which removes the error correction, then burn the tracks to a CD-R as an audio disk and re-rip it after the burn to verify no errors were burned to CD-R.  It may or may not be audible difference depending on your CDPs ability to deal with error correction, etc.

But even doing this, the reflectivity of writable disks is less than redbook aluminum CDs so it is harder for laser to read the data. Players compensate for this, but a CD-R is not a redbook disk. Playing it in an older CDP intended only for redbook disks might have an audible effect. CD-R is more reflective than CD-RW, and cheaper, so I would use only CD-R for copying redbook CDs.

Writing to CDs is a photo-chemical process. You are burning marks into a plastic goo. The chemistry of the goo varies with brand. Exposure to ambient light and heat or just time affects the goo and thus the recorded content. I have found Sony CD-R media to be pretty stable over time, while other brands have not performed as well for me. 

I have read that the gold type CD-Rs are more reliable for writing and in storage than the normal type, but I have no experience with that.

Some audiophiles have reported that black colored CD-Rs sound better than the normal clear/silver colored CD-Rs. This may be to the  reflection/refraction of laser light inside the disk and recorder. An old trick of coloring the peripheral edge of the disk with a dark green magic marker is said to improve the SQ, as does coating the interior of the CD player's box with green paint or anti-reflective coating. Stray laser light has an effect on audio quality.

The laser reads through the plastic disk from below. The goo that hold the data is on the top of the plastic, covered with a thin protective layer. Using a solvent based marker to write on the label side can penetrate into the data layer and affect the chemistry of the goo beneath it. I use thin red Sharpies to write directly on CD-Rs and never had a problem with Sony brand CD-R media. But people have reported this as a problem.