[tjkurita]

Hello all, I  have a pair of Cain and Cain IM Ben backloaded horns.  Here is a link to my system...  http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vdone&1288645177&view

I am looking into possible upgrades to the stock Fostex 168e Sigma driver.  This is a 6" full range driver.  Ideally, I would like to be able to drop in a new driver without having to modify the cabinet. 

Is there any generally accepted upgrade for the 168e?  A path that users take as they climb the ladder to better sound?  So many people seem to purchase entirely new speakers rather than upgrade parts.  I have found that upgrading parts often yields very good results.  I like the design of the Bens very much (wonderful soundstage combined with a nice, direct sound).  I just wish the driver had a little bit more clarity and headroom. 

Is it even possible?  Or must I upgrade the speakers to something like the Lamhorn. 

[rjbond3rd]

The Fostex 168E-Sigma -is- the upgrade, i.e., the high-end option, aside from some exotic, limited edition 6" Fostex, with slightly different trade-offs (e.g., there's the 166ESR which has smoother treble, but it rolls off quick, and that's irrelevant given the tweeters in the Cain's, but in any case, wouldn't have "more clarity and headroom," just different).

What kind of music are you playing on these?  My (various) speakers have the same general design, and there are virtues as well as trade-offs.  If you're looking for a completely different experience of "headroom," ultra-efficient horns are an option, but they take a lot of work to dial in completely and it tends to be DIY.

[tjkurita]

Thanks for your reply RJ.  I am mostly looking for more dynamics and less compression at louder volumes.  I am wondering if there is anything I can get driver-wise in these cabinets that will give me that.  Something like a compatible Lowther, AER, or PHY driver.  I do like the sound of these Fostex drivers, but I have had them for so long I am starting to get the upgrade itch.  My musical preferences lean heavily toward jazz and blues, but I also enjoy pop music such as The Cure, New Order, and larger, instrumental music like Explosions in the Sky.  I also enjoy classical music, but my system is particularly inadequate when it comes to classical.  You are probably correct with your front-horn recommendation.  My problem is that I might be looking for a front horn sound.  Good front horns have exactly the kind of immediacy, dynamics, and headroom I am looking for. If that's the case, I'm not sure these Cains will ever cut it.

[rjbond3rd]

I have some nice AER's in front-horns but while the horn does make things more dynamic (by making them more efficient), compression drivers still rule.  Hearing a full horn system is frequently a life-changing experience.

A decent compromise can be a front-horn-loaded compression driver (or two) over a 15" woofer (or two) in a ported box.  The trick is to get the crossovers in the right place, I think.  A Klipschorn has a lot of issues to address but one positive is that the midrange horn runs like a wideband (e.g., very roughly 300Hz to 7,000Hz).  That has drawbacks, too, though and ultimately, the Klipschorn is a challenge to remedy, but even only slightly tweaked, it can be insanely good on certain orchestral.

Too many options, I guess!

[Scottmoose]

I strongly suggest you get in contact with Clark Blumenstein (of Blumenstein audio). He was the late (and sadly missed) Terry Cain's apprentice, and I believe Leslie Cain asked him a year or two back if he would refurbish some of the old cabinets / speakers still in the workshop & sell them on her behalf. So he's probably better placed than anybody currently in the audio industry to know about the IM BEN design & what, if anything, could be done to upgrade it in driver terms. He's a nice chap too.

[tjkurita]

I strongly suggest you get in contact with Clark Blumenstein (of Blumenstein audio). He was the late (and sadly missed) Terry Cain's apprentice, and I believe Leslie Cain asked him a year or two back if he would refurbish some of the old cabinets / speakers still in the workshop & sell them on her behalf. So he's probably better placed than anybody currently in the audio industry to know about the IM BEN design & what, if anything, could be done to upgrade it in driver terms. He's a nice chap too.

Thanks for the advice.  I might do...  I bought my Bailey subwoofers from Blumenstein Audio from their old C&C stock.  The only issue is that they are rather busy with their own products and it is unlikely that they are very interested in providing support for another company's products.  But it does not hurt to ask.   I am also coming to the conclusion, however, that true horns are where I would like to go next.  The only problem I have is financing the project and implementing such large speakers in my very small room.