[WireNut]

 I always had them in the 70’s/80’s,even in my car. As I got older and more into Hi-end audio it was thought not to have them in the chain, so I got rid of them for the next few decades.
 Now, I have so many recordings that I think need EQing that I’m thinking about, dare I say it, yes adding an EQ back into my system thru my preamp’s tape monitor loop.
 After all these years of owning different equipment and thousands of dollars spent could an inexpensive EQ help me enjoy my equipment/recordings more?
 How many of you, use an EQ today?
 
Talk to me……WireNut.......

[bainjs]

Yes, I too had the same feelings about some recordings needing "something".  It could also be my hearing maybe ain't what it used to be particularly in the high frequency range. I went with an AudioControl Model 520 and never looked back.    This is the equalizer the late reviewer Julian Hirsch called the "thinking man's tone control".  I like it because it's simple. Just a little tweak on the ultra high frequency knob usually does it for me.  Cymbals are once again crisp and all is well. 

They run about $50 - $75 if you can find one.  There's quite a bit of info on them if you do a search.  Highly recommended for those over 50!

[Quiet Earth]

I've also thought about trying an EQ, just for fun. I wonder how many people are using tone controls now, or how many people would even consider them these days.

I've been playing a lot of vinyl lately and it seems like there is quite a wide range in sound quality spanning my record collection. Some records don't sound like they have very much bass (below 100Hz?), or perhaps they just have too much rising high end energy - giving the impression of no bass. Some albums definitely have too much sibilance. I'm guessing that's because they were not mastered correctly for vinyl, unknowing what the RIAA curve would do to those "S" and "Sh" sounds. Then there's the whole cartridge alignment and resonance thing to consider too, which means I usually go back and revisit the alignment and phono stage loading and component synergy/cabling.

I thought about getting an EQ like the JDK r24 : http://www.jdkaudio.com/r24.html, but I don't know if a shelving EQ would be more appropriate for vinyl. I think anything worth while is probably going to be a pro-audio EQ, and it's not going to be cheap. Or single ended for home use. (Usually the pro stuff is balanced for the mix buss.)

[Scott F.]

rant on

I'm a big proponent of tone controls. Unfortunately someone, somewhere in audiophile history, said they are bad and must never be used. Personally, I'd like to poke that guy right in the eye and ask him what the hell he was thinking but we won't go there.

I have to say, I've not used an EQ that plugs between my pre and amps since ... well, decades ago. That said, when you do a computer based system and use software like JRiver, it has an integrated EQ that you can use when required. When you get bass shy (or whatever) music, just open it up and adjust it to suit your preferences. It sure makes that music MUCH more pleasurable to listen to. I've got a couple 'vintage' systems that have tone controls. They are old HH Scott tubed integrated amps. I have them paired to vintage speakers (Dynacos and Advents). I don't hesitate for a second twisting the tone controls when the music (or my mood) calls for it. I, and I would assume most of us don't always listen critically. The majority of the time, I'm listening for the pure pleasure and appreciation of the music. In turn, if a slight twist of the bass nob makes it more enjoyable, I do it. When I'm not listening critically, I could give a crap about soundstage and placement. I simply want to be engrossed in the tunes and if tone controls get me deeper into the music, well, so be it. 

As I see it, a system without tone controls automatically excludes a pretty fair amount of music that you could be listening to. Why? Because it sounds like crap on an 'audiophile approved' system without tone controls. So, what's up with that? I'd love to see a 'major' manufacturer produce a piece with tone controls. Sure, make them defeatable, that makes sense but for goodness sakes, give us the option. Hey, we're 'audiophiles'. We're supposed to know what instruments are supposed to sound like. I think we can figure out how to judiciously apply EQ to a crappy recording to make it playable on our systems. Then again, maybe we just want to put on Deep Purple and crank the crap out of the bass and rock out for a while. Nothin' wrong with that either. If that's what it takes to loose yourself in the music, I say go for it and to hell with the purists. That's what I do and I used to write for the mags. Though I didn't use a proper EQ, I can adjust the XO frequency and crank up the bass on my crossover (I bi-amp) to compensate for crappy recordings. Running JRiver, I can do the same thing to my digital with their software based EQ when the music calls for it.

Quite honestly, I want to listen to ALL of my music, not just the audiophile approved crap....though there is a place for that too. The best case I can make for the use of tone controls is Oingo Boingo, Dead Mans Party. I defy anybody to put that on and tell me that's a quality recording and doesn't need some bass enhancement. 

...I suppose I need to turn in my audiophile membership card now...oh well

rant off

All that said, I've seen a limited number of new pieces with tone controls. The Leban integrated and a couple of the Triode of Japan units have them.

[G Georgopoulos]

Tone controls

introduce frequency dependant gains,phase changes,and distortions...

[galyons]

Bad music and, more commonly, badly recorded & mastered bad music, will not be helped by tone controls.  Tone controls affect much more than just FR.  But then again the tone controls don't make the drek that much worse. Twirl away. 

I, too, have Scott integrated amps both the EL34 and the 7189 model.  They sound much better when I route the signal completely around the tone  controls.  Biggest improvement in the Scott's was pulling the PEC phono and tape EQ's and replacing them with discrete components.

Most current Pop/Hip Hop is so overly EQ'd out of the box what difference adding more?  Join the loudness wars! Gotta love 1 note boom bass!

Of course, YMMV.  Remember that the only ears you need to please are your own!!

Cheers,
Geary

[WireNut]

ScottF,

I hear ya 
If it makes things sound better why not do it?
The h^ll with the purist, all tho I am one 
Honestly, I think most of the LP's/Cd's I own need EQing.
I'd listen to my system more if I could make my recordings sound better. So maybe an EQ isn't a bad idea.
My old LP's/cd's aren't going to get any better on they're own......











 

 



 

[G Georgopoulos]

Wirenut

I use them too,despite what purists tell me...

ps:all systems have some kind of distortion..,why not if they can bright up the music..

[Davey]

I hate to break this to you guys, but 99.9% of every CD or LP or whatever you own has some equalization used on it. 
Even if you don't use any on the playback end of things, it's already been used on the recording end.

Cheers,

Dave.

[JohnR]

A lot more than equalization. A friend of a friend walked me through some of the stuff he was doing to mix down a band. The amount of processing (all digital/DSP these days) was eye-opening. But you could easily hear the effect, just by switching a processing block on and off.

[Nick77]

Gotta admit I could use a slight reduction in treble on numerous recordings, I usually just avoid listening to them. Easy to adjust the bass with sub controls but treble is another issue.

Of course I would hate to introduce a non-audiophile approved piece of equipment into the audio chain, although im sure good pieces exist??

[dB Cooper]

Ditto Nick77. The only thing I ever used tone controls for is to "tame" an overly bright recording. Many CD reissues for example seem to have been done "on the cheap" and just "rolled the tape" with the original EQ intact. Then you get them in digital with its higher output potential in the highs and... OUCH.

Another reason I operate this way is that recordings with bad or uneven frequency balance often seem to have other issues as well, issues that EQ doesn't correct.

[Ericus Rex]

Roger Modjeski commented  a bit on proper implementation of tone controls in this Music Reference Circle thread.  Just scroll down halfway to see his comments:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=117257.0

[Ericus Rex]

A lot more than equalization. A friend of a friend walked me through some of the stuff he was doing to mix down a band. The amount of processing (all digital/DSP these days) was eye-opening. But you could easily hear the effect, just by switching a processing block on and off.

Were the unprocessed tracks you heard always superior sonicly?  Just curious.

[Russtafarian]

One of my favorite topics!  I’ve done live concert mixing for over 30 years and routinely use mixing board eq on individual voices/instruments and output eq for tuning speakers and stage monitors.  I also use compression, but that’s a topic for another egg-throwing contest.

The ideal hi-fi eq would be transparent to the source, could adjust sub/speaker/room issues below 300hz, and have presets for fixing certain types of recordings.  If a system is computer-based, programs like Jriver or Pure Music have eq functions that do everything mentioned above. 

External eq boxes are a huge subject.  High quality analog parametrics designed for mastering studios work really well but are expensive and don’t have preset functionality.  Digital boxes offer way more functionality and flexibility, but the quality of the AD/DA will determine how transparent it is.  I’ve heard a couple DEQX systems that sound really good.

There is a learning curve to using eq effectively, but the basic rules and parameters can be communicated/taught pretty easily.  Actively using eq will make you a better listener because you’ll be forced to learn the sonic characteristics of voices, instruments, and whole ensembles in order to shape the sound appropriately.

Personally I like having bass and treble control in my system.  I have parametric eq on my subwoofers and a level control on my supertweeters.  I use my standard settings 80% of the time.  But I can easily retune the subs for tracks with exaggerated or overly thin bass.  Turning the supertweeters up or down a few notches can compensate for dull/bright recordings or even for a different set of power tubes.

My strong opinion: don’t be afraid of eq!  As server-based systems become more popular and DSP gets better and more transparent, the eq options for audiophiles will continue to expand.  Embrace it, learn it, enjoy it.

Russ

[WGH]

I heard an interesting demo this summer, the speakers were the Magnepan 3.7 with a REL Gibraltar G-2 sub. The REL sub has a remote control and a digital display which at first seemed strange but when we listened to some classic rock music with very little bass the crossover frequency was raised to 80 Hz and the volume bumped up slightly and the recording came alive without any of the anomalies usually associated with tone controls. Now I think all subs should have a remote.



Wayne

[WireNut]

Have I been conditioned over the last 20-30 years that it's so bad to add an EQ?

Why do I feel like I'm letting myself and the audio community down if I add an EQ, even if it's thru the tape loop?



 
 

[G Georgopoulos]

Have I been conditioned over the last 20-30 years that it's so bad to add an EQ?

Why do I feel like I'm letting myself and the audio community down if I add an EQ, even if it's thru the tape loop?

Wirenut you're nuts..,now youre telling us you dont know for sure...

[WireNut]

Wirenut you're nuts..,now youre telling us you dont know for sure...

Yeah I know what to do. The purist got to me over the years.....

It's not my system..Recordings need help........



 

[Ericus Rex]

Have I been conditioned over the last 20-30 years that it's so bad to add an EQ?

Why do I feel like I'm letting myself and the audio community down if I add an EQ, even if it's thru the tape loop?

That's a great idea to use an EQ through the tape loop.  That way you can completely cut it out when not needed without having to rewire everything.  Smaht!