[neobop]

Thought you might like these photos:








neo

[Guy 13]

Hi neobop and all Audio Circle members.
Nice turntable, but again, something nice that I cannot afford.
Do you have a price to confirm that I cannot afford it?

Guy 13

[neobop]

Hi Guy,
I don't think it's released yet.  Harry is still tweaking motor torque, or something like that.

It's supposed to come in under $30K.  You know what they say, if you have to ask.....

Lets see, new car or new record player?     

neo

[WireNut]

It's supposed to come in under $30K.  You know what they say, if you have to ask.....

30k, I'll stick with my JVC table and buy a used record store. Nice table tho......

 

 

 

[pumpkinman]

Beautiful TT but I'd have to sell the farm to afford it. 

[Guy 13]

Hi all Audio Circle members.
The more I look at it, the more I would like to see it sitting on my audio rack.
My God it's beautiful.
My wife said that she's ready to do the street to get the money so I can buy it.
Is that love or what ?
No, she never look at my posts,
otherwise I would be dead a long time ago.

Guy 13

[neobop]

I was listening to PBS the other day and they had a segment about a guy who goes around the world and takes photos of great sculptures.  He takes the photos to his studio and uses 3D printing to reproduce them.  They say the sculptures, which he colors to look like the original, are uncannily awesome.

Can you imagine having Michelangelo's sculpture of David or the Venus de Milo in your study or living room?
3D printers are available now.  They start at around $800 for a small one.  Too small for an arm wand, unfortunately.   Maybe 3 or $4K would do it.  Then all you need is software. 
neo   

[J-Pak]

This is one of the tables I'm considering for the next TT... but only a single arm mounting is pushing it further down the list.

VPI is supposed to be releasing an even more expensive version than the Classic Direct.

[neobop]

VPI now has the Classic Direct listed as - in production.
http://vpiindustries.com/table-direct.htm

A direct driver with an 18 lb platter!!  and virtually no wow and flutter.  Apparently this is the Classic series DD, and eventually there will be higher end DD model(s) more like the HRX. 

Recently, on the net there was some conjecture about DD servo systems being flawed and how you can hear the correction after the fact.  This is total BS IMO.  The most accurate speed ever, is achieved by servo systems.  Minute corrections MAINTAIN constant speed.  It's not like there are abrupt jumps.  The best belt drivers like the Goldmund Reference also use a servo system.  Consider a servo controlled sub. This is even less immediate than turntable speed, I would think.  Comparisons with non-servo subs of similar size, isn't close.  Ever hear a pair of large Entec subs on a fast system?  It's amazing.
neo 

[Wayner]

The platter also has mass and inertia, which smooth out the dips in speed fluctuation. Just like in the belt drives, just like in the smaller Japanese DDs.

Inertia and mass are the vinyl guy's friend.

Wayner

[Jeff K]

Unless you're a Rega vinyl guy.   

[neobop]

There's a critical relationship between platter mass and motor torque.  Not many DD tables have an 18 lb platter.  This is the first VPI DD and it's a biggie, made possible by the mil spec motor.  It will be interesting to see where this will go with future VPI DD tables.  I'm guessing that 18 lbs might be optimal, but you never know. 
neo

[orthobiz]

I get the feeling that DIY in a couple of years will involve a 3D printer, some software and voilà, a new tonearm!

Paul

[neobop]

I get the feeling that DIY in a couple of years will involve a 3D printer, some software and voilà, a new tonearm!
Paul

I think it would have to involve more than a 3D printer.  Besides the wiring, the pivots or bearings and mechanical structure would have to be designed and constructed conventionally.  I'm not positive about this, but I also think 3D is used on the tapered arm tube and nothing else.  Normally the pillar (vertical part going into the base) is a straight piece of machined metal, but connecting the arm tube to the pillar usually involves materials that can't be printed. 

If someone knows about this, please chime in.  Maybe somebody will show this thread to Harry and he'll enlighten us. 

Gad, looking at the photos again - what a beauty!!  Not gaudy and overstated like a bejeweled gargoyle or some modernistic Plexiglas structure, this looks like a record player.  Form follows function and I'd bet it beats any current $100K offering. 
neo

[catastrofe]

Between this and the Kuzma Stabi M, I can't sleep at night.   

[BobM]

Fremer has a series of video's on his analogue planet site showing a visit to VPI and a look at what the DD motor looks like internally and how it is actually constructed and functions.

[neobop]

Thanks BobM.  Interesting video.  Makes you wonder about the final price of most tables.

http://www.analogplanet.com/content/analogplanetcom-visits-vpi-industries-part-2

neo

[catastrofe]

Thanks BobM.  Interesting video.  Makes you wonder about the final price of most tables.

http://www.analogplanet.com/content/analogplanetcom-visits-vpi-industries-part-2

neo

I noticed the same thing.  Several seemingly disingenuous comments about "inexpensive" components in not-so-inexpensive finished tables.

[zuluwarrior0760]

I too as a VPI owner noted the comments about the 23.00 motor used in a classic
as well as HW's remarks about "STICKING IT here....or there..."

I love my Classic3 but after seeing several shots and videos of VPIs facilities,
I'm going to try my luck with Basis and see where things go....

As to the Classic Direct, I heard it at RMAF in the Joseph Audio Room.

Although it sounded good........., even according to Jeff Joseph, he "Wouldn't Trade his
Classic 3 for it".  He said the backgrounds seemed a little blacker, but for five
times the cost, no way........."

I wasn't blown away by it, although I did run down and grab the Elvis56 record
Joseph's had in play over and over......that's a helluva record......and I'm not
an Elvis fan....sounds just as real as I remember at the show on my Classic 3......

In final analysis, I think the purchase of a Classic Direct would entail
me purchasing a 7000.00 or so turntable along with a sizeable share
of a 3d printer that I would never be able to come print anything on.......

I would tend to predict that we will see that table or one like it at the 15k mark
before long........

[neobop]

In defense of VPI and big mouth Harry, it's not the price of the motor (except maybe the DD motor) you're paying for.   40% of the retail cost goes to the dealer, but it's the cost of labor, design, machining, R&D that's expensive.  Machining acrylic and steel, not to mention making a tonearm and main bearing, is expensive.

I think Basis uses an AC motor rather than DC, but it probably doesn't cost more or much more.  I assume VPI is much bigger than Basis and probably gets a better wholesale price.  The electronics - controllers are more expensive than the motors.  Basis tables are more expensive than VPI.  The table comparable to the Classic 3 ($6K) is the 2200 ($6.4K w/o arm).  The Vector 4 arm w/VTA micrometer is $5.5K = $11.9K.  Maybe there's a package price?  Under that is the 2001 - $4.9K w/arm.  It looks nicer than a Traveler and has high-tech feet.  A comparison with a Classic would be interesting.

http://www.overtureavonline.com/component/virtuemart/basis

neo