Starting a Computer Based Music Server

JRace · « **Reply #40 on:** 11 Jul 2013, 01:03 am »

Quote from: Don_S on 10 Jul 2013, 09:42 pm

I do not understand. That completely messes up my possible experimentation this weekend. It also nixes the neat package idea of using a small PC with built in optical drive or Mini with an external optical drive duct taped to it.

I meant it can be the computer you use for playback, or just another computer.
In other words you don't have to wait until you get your "playback" computer ready to start ripping discs.

By all means you can use the playback machine to rip the cds.

Hipper · « **Reply #41 on:** 11 Jul 2013, 07:05 pm »

For ripping, EAC is free and generally works well.

And just to confirm what JRace was saying, you can rip your CDs to any PC, external hard drive, NAS or whatever else suits you.

You need an on-line pc to do the ripping. This is necessary to get the metadata, and if you want (I advice you should), check on your rips accuracy with AccurateRip which both EAC and dBPowerAmp subscribe to. I originally ripped mine on my main pc storing it on that pc's hard drive. Later I transferred it to an external hard drive and back up hard drive. Later still I transferred it again to a new pc. The data can be moved just like any other bunch of data using USB, or e-SATA or whatever other transfer methods you can use.

When you play back using something like JRiver, you must direct that programme to the source of your music. As long as that source (external hard drive, NAS, whatever) is connected to your playback pc, it should work.

Noise: a standard pc will have a fan running all the time. A laptop will have the fan kick in occasionally. Jriver itself doesn't use much processing power when you play your music unless, apparently, you use its equaliser or other processes like that. In fact I used the equaliser and it didn't seem to increase fan noise. I was listening on (open) headphones though. On speakers fan noise may be more of an intrusion. For trialling purposes though it shouldn't be a problem. If you do decide to go the whole way with computer audio, pc noise is a major consideration. But that's for later.

One nice feature of computer audio is that once you've ripped your whole collection you can play your tracks using 'shuffle'. You will then hear tracks that you no longer played and quite often you will find that music to be quite refreshing.

Just give it a go with whatever you have to hand and hear for yourself. At the moment it's not the quality of sound but whether it suits the way you want to listen. Unlike randytsuch, I still listen to CDs, often compilation CDs I've made from my CD collection.

jarcher · « **Reply #42 on:** 12 Jul 2013, 08:45 pm »

Y'all must have some noisy PCs! Mac Mini is about 4 feet from my head & in the year's I've used it only recall hearing the fan once or twice. Often I hear the external hard drive spool up more than the Mac - and that's only in near total silence conditions.

bpape · « **Reply #43 on:** 12 Jul 2013, 09:06 pm »

If the music server is in the same room and close to your seat, using a heat pipe motherboard for cooling of CPU, Video, etc. is a nice way to go. Big diameter, slow RPM fans for the casee are easy and cheap to find. Some of them are down below 25db. Basically the whole machine will be perfectly quiet. Even that little Lenovo I posted about earlier is basically completely quiet and it's sitting about 4 feet from me right now.

Bryan

dougme57 · « **Reply #44 on:** 12 Jul 2013, 09:15 pm »

My rack is about four feet to my left and my screen is 12 feet in front. I never hear my PC. I do shut my projector off after setting up playlist as I can hear that fan.

Don_S · « **Reply #45 on:** 13 Jul 2013, 11:50 pm »

JRiver questions. It appears JRiver is PC only. Is that correct?

I downloaded JRiver to my old computer and ripped a disk. While ripping the file extension was .cda During playback the file extension was ape. I was never asked for a preference. I was not asked to direct playback like mentioned in a previous post. I played back via the mini phono output ant 2.1 computer speaker system. That is what I wanted so that worked but it was inconsistent with a previoius post.

While the process was easy it did not get me where I wanted to go. I was never asked what I wanted to do after choosing "rip". I wanted to try .wav to see if any metadata was attached. The JRiver page was confusing and made it seem like there would be. I also wanted to try ripping in FLAC.

One more question. If I had unselected the video and image formats would they NOT be imported? I don't necessarily need or want them in JRiver although I see that during playback I get to select which library I want to access.

Don_S · « **Reply #46 on:** 14 Jul 2013, 12:17 am »

I downloaded Foobar 2000. It did not automatically pick up the music I had just ripped in JRiver. In fact it did not display any music files. When I made many mouse clicks to direct it to the specific JRiver file Foobar gave me a message that the file was incompatible---ape.

JRace · « **Reply #47 on:** 14 Jul 2013, 01:41 am »

You need to install the monkey audio encoder,
http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_input_monkey
First download the component then open foobar and :

Step 1: Open the foobar2000 preferences dialog (click File | Preferences or key CTRL+P).
Step 2: Go to the Components page.
Step 3: Click the "Install..." button and select the component archive ( it is where you saved the file when yiou downloaded it) or simply drag it to the list.
Step 4: Press "OK", you will be prompted to restart foobar2000 in order to load the newly installed component.

That is not one of the more common audio formats, did jriver do that on its own?

Don_S · « **Reply #48 on:** 14 Jul 2013, 02:12 am »

Yes, JRiver monkeyed around.

I did not select .ape and do not plan to use it in the future. JRiver never asked me what my preference was.

Quote from: JRace on 14 Jul 2013, 01:41 am

You need to install the monkey audio encoder,
http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_input_monkey
First download the component then open foobar and :

Step 1: Open the foobar2000 preferences dialog (click File | Preferences or key CTRL+P).
Step 2: Go to the Components page.
Step 3: Click the "Install..." button and select the component archive ( it is where you saved the file when yiou downloaded it) or simply drag it to the list.
Step 4: Press "OK", you will be prompted to restart foobar2000 in order to load the newly installed component.

That is not one of the more common audio formats, did jriver do that on its own?

Hipper · « **Reply #49 on:** 14 Jul 2013, 06:11 pm »

I've never ripped with JRiver, only EAC and dBpoweramp. This link tells you about JRiver CD ripping.

http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Copy_(Rip)_CDs_to_Your_Computer

If you look at 'Encoding Settings' I would think that is where you can select the output file type.

Wiki JRiver is where their help files are. If I want to know something about JRiver I often Google 'JRiver CD Ripping' for example. Or when on the relevant JRiver page click the 'Help' button.

This link that I gave earlier tells you how to set up JRiver for PC and music use:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/436-jriver-media-center-17-detail/

JRiver has always been for PC but this year a version for Macs was released but I've no experience of it:

http://www.jriver.com/mac.html

JRiver can be difficult to use at first because there are so many options which need to be explained. You've seen that it can work. Now the task is to get it to work as you want it. Don't forget the JRiver forum for advice. It is very busy but the writers of the programme often respond.

jarcher · « **Reply #50 on:** 14 Jul 2013, 08:06 pm »

Wow Don - you're one unlucky dude. Never even hear of cda or ape file formats......

How about this for simplicity & reliability:

1. Turn on Mac (if you're not connecting to internet over wi-fi, connect ethernet cable to router)

2. Start Itunes.

3. Got to "Itunes / Preferences / General / Import Settings" and choose Apple Lossless (or WAV if you're really paranoid). I have also have my choice as "when you insert a CD : import cd". You can make other choices such as : ask to import cd". Lastly, if for some reason you don't like or want to change the default storage location, go to the "advanced" tab in preferences & tell it where you want to store (e.g. an external hard drive).

4. If you haven't already done so, connect the USB DVD / CD drive.

5. Insert CD and let it rip the file to your library & automatically get the artwork, etc.

6. Listen to the first track if you like, have a drink, and enjoy. After a few minutes, a ding will sound, remove disk, add another.

Think folks complain to much about the ripping process. Is it really that arduous folks to put a new disk in every couple of minutes? Something you can do will you surf the web, listen to music, whatever. Or if thats too much work, there are commercial ripping services that you can send your collection to and they will rip it and put it on a hard drive in your preferred format.

Best of luck Don!

Alan · « **Reply #51 on:** 14 Jul 2013, 11:08 pm »

cda= compact disc audio

ape is a file type developed for the Monkey's Audio player (I believe this was before flac existed). Some of the people from Monkey's Audio went on on to start jriver. Thus, jriver's default setting is to rip to ape files. It's easy to set jriver to rip to flac too.

Jriver does an excellent job on ripping. According to programs like audio checker, I get better rips with jriver than eac.

One other default setting you might want to change if ripping with jriver. Have it put the track # in front of the filename.

Have fun with it!

geowak · « **Reply #52 on:** 15 Jul 2013, 12:29 am »

Quote from: jarcher on 14 Jul 2013, 08:06 pm

Wow Don - you're one unlucky dude. Never even hear of cda or ape file formats......

How about this for simplicity & reliability:

1. Turn on Mac (if you're not connecting to internet over wi-fi, connect ethernet cable to router)

2. Start Itunes.

3. Got to "Itunes / Preferences / General / Import Settings" and choose Apple Lossless (or WAV if you're really paranoid). I have also have my choice as "when you insert a CD : import cd". You can make other choices such as : ask to import cd". Lastly, if for some reason you don't like or want to change the default storage location, go to the "advanced" tab in preferences & tell it where you want to store (e.g. an external hard drive).

4. If you haven't already done so, connect the USB DVD / CD drive.

5. Insert CD and let it rip the file to your library & automatically get the artwork, etc.

6. Listen to the first track if you like, have a drink, and enjoy. After a few minutes, a ding will sound, remove disk, add another.

Think folks complain to much about the ripping process. Is it really that arduous folks to put a new disk in every couple of minutes? Something you can do will you surf the web, listen to music, whatever. Or if thats too much work, there are commercial ripping services that you can send your collection to and they will rip it and put it on a hard drive in your preferred format.

Best of luck Don!

I agree. This is how I do ripping with a Mac and Itunes. It's very, very simple. Plus I like just using one program, thus not downloading another program to do the job. There are some that work in conjunction with Itunes, and are engineered to do so.

But really, If the OP or anyone else likes the PC route, why not do it that way? It's what you like using and the process you can do.
I also like to stream music from MOG on my Iphone to a Pure I-20 dock for a different library of my music to my stereo. This is a collection of artists and albums that is not stored on a HD of my own making, it is streamed audio on demand. Once again, why not?

We have many options that can give us High Fidelity? I don't get that picky about the best.... just enjoy the music.

Don_S · « **Reply #53 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 02:39 pm »

OK, What am I doing wrong?

I downloaded JRiver Media Center and could not figure out how to rip into different formats (.wav or FLAC). Then I downloaded JRiver Jukebox with the same results. The home page for JRiver is like something from Dr. Oz--bunch of ra! ra! and little useful information about the different products. A search of the forums provided abundant non-relevant information. Search terms were too universal.

Selecting a file type should be easy and obvious. Am I in the wrong church with those programs?

Also, is there a way to find out what software my used Mac Mini is operating on and other machine specs? Searching with the model number was not productive. With a PC it is easy to get info right from the computer on what is internal.

Thanks.

jarcher · « **Reply #54 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 03:35 pm »

At the risk of being obnoxious - at which I'll likely fail

- in your place I'd be avoiding these wonky & irritating programs - and Jriver is probably one of the more polished - and just embrace the ubiquitous and easy Itunes. Life's too short.......

W/ Mac's you click the Apple icon at the top left corner of your screen, choose "about this Mac", then the "more info" button.........

Don_S · « **Reply #55 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 04:05 pm »

jarcher, You are right. Life is too short. Too short to listen to less than the best I can manage. I want the best I can get and I do not want to be wedded for better or worse till death do us part to anything proprietary. I want my library to be portable as in .wav or FLAC.

Sadly I think there is a great conspiracy afoot---let's get Don. Remember, my Mini is used. My friend loaded it with so much social media (plus iTunes, imovie, iPhoto, icrap, ucrap we all crap) crap I can't believe it. If I decide to purchase it I will do massive cleaning if I can find the program that corresponds to a PC's add/remove programs. In the meantime I have failed to find the alleged Apple logo. I learned left from right in kiddygarden and know up from down. I even know what an apple looks like. But alas, there is no Apple logo on my Mini's screen.

Quote from: jarcher on 23 Jul 2013, 03:35 pm

At the risk of being obnoxious - at which I'll likely fail - in your place I'd be avoiding these wonky & irritating programs - and Jriver is probably one of the more polished - and just embrace the ubiquitous and easy Itunes. Life's too short.......

W/ Mac's you click the Apple icon at the top left corner of your screen, choose "about this Mac", then the "more info" button.........

jarcher · « **Reply #56 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 05:19 pm »

Quote from: Don_S on 23 Jul 2013, 04:05 pm

jarcher, You are right. Life is too short. Too short to listen to less than the best I can manage. I want the best I can get and I do not want to be wedded for better or worse till death do us part to anything proprietary. I want my library to be portable as in .wav or FLAC.

Sadly I think there is a great conspiracy afoot---let's get Don. Remember, my Mini is used. My friend loaded it with so much social media (plus iTunes, imovie, iPhoto, icrap, ucrap we all crap) crap I can't believe it. If I decide to purchase it I will do massive cleaning if I can find the program that corresponds to a PC's add/remove programs. In the meantime I have failed to find the alleged Apple logo. I learned left from right in kiddygarden and know up from down. I even know what an apple looks like. But alas, there is no Apple logo on my Mini's screen.

Don, I don't think with you it's about what's "best" or that folks are "out to get Don". At this point I think it's clear that it's about "anything but Apple hardware or software" and "I don't want to hear what jarcher has to say".

As to the former - that's fine, but you should have started off saying "I want a solution that doesn't involve Apple hardware or software". By mentioning the possibility that you'd buy your friends mini and admiring it's form factor, you lead people to believe otherwise. Mini's & itunes w/ something like Pure Music / Ammara / etc player software are used in the very best reference systems : look at the "associated equipment" side bar of Stereophile, TAS etc hardware reviews and you'll see for yourself.

As for the other things re Mac OS - you're making issues of things that aren't : the apple icon is at the top left of the toolbar of every application of Apple OS since at least 10.6 7+ years ago. To delete applications you just dump them in the trash can. I don't know how things can be any simpler. But that doesn't matter because ultimately what you really seem to want is a compact windows server with easy to use software. And you get annoyed when you don't find it, despite people's assistance her to troubleshoot. My parting advice would be to get someone like HAL to build you one & put your music on it for you.

As for "out to get Don" : I doubt either I or the countless other people who have offered advice here would do so if they were "out to get you". If so we'd either berate you personally or offer up solutions that are bound to cost you a lot of money & frustration, neither of which is true. As it seems in particular you predisposed not to want my advice, I will accept the situation, stop offering it here and in the future, and "unnotify" to this topic. Best of luck to you & sorry the assistance has not been appreciated in the spirit it was offered.

Alan · « **Reply #57 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 05:43 pm »

Quote from: Don_S on 23 Jul 2013, 02:39 pm

OK, What am I doing wrong? I downloaded JRiver Media Center and could not figure out how to rip into different formats (.wav or FLAC).

With jriver for windows it's at Tools/Options/Encoding.

Don_S · « **Reply #58 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 06:03 pm »

jarcher,

I am sorry you took my post wrong. I was not criticizing those who gave me advice. It was more of a tongue-in-cheek the universe is against me. I appreciate your info on where the Apple logo is supposed to be. But I still can't find it. My point being that even something that seems so simple is somehow elusive.

And I am not necessarily against using a Mac Mini although my experiences are turning me off very quickly. I thought I was against using Apple software. My initial request was for something portable across different equipment. To me that means storing my files in something universal like FLAC or WAV. I was not aware of how iTunes interfaces with other programs. I still don't understand it.

As for deleting programs by dumping them in the trash. I did not know that. Where does that knowledge come from if someone is used to using a PC with a specific delete programs function? If I right click/delete a desktop icon with a PC all I lose is the icon. The program remains.

I appreciate the efforts others have made giving me advice and I hope this thread is helpful to others. I have pretty much given up on JRiver. A friend who has a Mini set up with Pure Music promised to give me a hand when he has time to stop by.

As I read my previous post I see how it could be misinterpreted. I was not criticizing advice givers, just venting my frustration that what seems obvious is actually elusive. I apologize if I offended anyone. It was unintentional.

Don_S · « **Reply #59 on:** 23 Jul 2013, 06:05 pm »

I could swear I was there. At least tools/options. I looked at everything on the dropdown menu. Next time I connect that computer I will check again. Thanks Alan.

Quote from: Alan on 23 Jul 2013, 05:43 pm

With jriver for windows it's at Tools/Options/Encoding.