[snapsnap]

Hello,

I am looking to upgrade my Mordaunt Short MS 10s - any advice out there? 

I listened to a pair of Harbeth P3esr's which I quite liked. Has anyone compared them to the KEF LS 50's?  Other suggestions appreciated.

[charmerci]

There was a thread about the LS50's below this one. They sound like a winner.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=113593.0

[jaywills]

I've been running a pair of LSA 1 Statement monitors for the last few weeks and am enjoying them.  http://www.thelsagroup.com  (no affiliation other than being a customer).  Good luck.  Cordially,

[snapsnap]

Thanks for the pointer to the KEF thread, seems like no one has anything negative to say about them and the price is right compared to the Harbeth's.  It is difficult when you can't compare side to side (or audition at all).

No dealer here in BC for the the LSA Statements - although they look great.

Thanks for the help.

[kbuzz3]

I am going to repeat something here that I have posted on a few boards. So with the risk of beating a dead horse let me say that the failure of any of the review mags or web sites to do a comparison of the kef and Harbeth (as well as splendor et al) is pathetic.    This is a huge category and anyone contemplating the purchase of a mini monitor is thinking about these two brands right off the bat.  Not to mention this survey or shoot out is required because it is doubtful that any dealer carries two or three of these similar components

Frankly this need is so obvious for the audiophile community that I am appalled that it has not been done.   I am afraid to say it but the failure to do this or even mention the other brand I some ls50 reviews is conspicuous .     Maybe some audiophile group or club can do what no reviewer or editor has the backbone to do

This is not some esoteric add on or tweak but a bedrock audio component for those in small spaces.     

Comments appreciated and sorry to hijack.   But I and im sure many others want to hear these side by side.   

[pslate]

It's a crime to suggest a discontinued product I know, but if you see a Soundfield Monitor 1 on the auction block take notice. It uses a KEF driver along with a powered sub. Heard the LS50 at Axpona, it's great, I just think the cross at 200 hz to 8" sub gives the Monitor 1 the leg up on the LS50 with less excursion/distortion. But I own an M1, so obviously I am a fanboy. They are both very nice speakers, and have a great room filling sound. Let us know what you end up getting and good luck!!

[jmccabe83]

I've heard the LS50's in a store demo and I loved them for their potential but didn't have a great experience even though the room was acoustically treated. I think the LS50's sound fairly harsh with digital amplifiers. I heard them on an 8000 series Marantz and they thrashed my ears at medium volume. I'm not trying to discourage you but I want you to know that they have some trouble with equipment that is generally considered pretty decent.

[roscoeiii]

I am going to repeat something here that I have posted on a few boards. So with the risk of beating a dead horse let me say that the failure of any of the review mags or web sites to do a comparison of the kef and Harbeth (as well as splendor et al) is pathetic.    This is a huge category and anyone contemplating the purchase of a mini monitor is thinking about these two brands right off the bat.  Not to mention this survey or shoot out is required because it is doubtful that any dealer carries two or three of these similar components

Frankly this need is so obvious for the audiophile community that I am appalled that it has not been done.   I am afraid to say it but the failure to do this or even mention the other brand I some ls50 reviews is conspicuous .     Maybe some audiophile group or club can do what no reviewer or editor has the backbone to do

This is not some esoteric add on or tweak but a bedrock audio component for those in small spaces.     

Comments appreciated and sorry to hijack.   But I and im sure many others want to hear these side by side.

Um, didn't John Atkinson make a comparison to the traditional BBC monitors in his review? Rogers in this case.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/kef-ls50-anniversary-model-loudspeaker-page-2

Steve Guttenberg also notes: "I owned a pair of Rogers LS3/5As back in the day, the LS50 is better in every way."

I will let you dig to see if there are other comparisons I have missed.

Let's give the reviewers a break. They are committing no crime against audiophilia when they don't do comparisons you'd like to see.

Decibel Audio here in Chicago carries both Harbeth and KEF (that Harbeth 30.1 is a great sounding speaker by the way). Anyone in the Chicagoland area can compare them directly themselves.

If you ask nicely, I may even be talked into going up to Decibel, doing a direct comparison and reporting back.

[Russell Dawkins]

I owned a pair of Harbeth HL-P3s for nearly 15 years. They were very good - nice mid range and treble and imaged well, but seriously limited in dynamic capability, due not only to very low sensitivity but very limited power handling capability. The bass had a humped response just above LF rolloff which made successful matching with a sub impossible. The new version is better in most ways, except for the bass, but still has the dynamic limitations.

I also think it is too expensive for what you get when an alternative is the Neumann KH120 which retails for about $600 less and includes amplification. One drawback is the built in amplification (50/80W rms/peak for each of the 2 drivers per speaker) precludes amplifier "rolling" or experimentation.
Unfortunately, grill cloths are not available.

These I have auditioned at length and they are in a completely different league from the Harbeths, and not in a bad way!

At a 52Hz -3dB point, many would not need a sub, and with a flat response down to rolloff, sub matching is easier. They measure fairly flat, too, and sound like this graph suggests:




The Geithain RL906 is by all reports even better and although costing substantially more at around €2,200 a pair is still cheaper than the P3 plus amplifiers. -3dB at 50Hz.

These top end European monitors are worth taking note of.

[kbuzz3]

Um, didn't John Atkinson make a comparison to the traditional BBC monitors in his review? Rogers in this case.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/kef-ls50-anniversary-model-loudspeaker-page-2

Steve Guttenberg also notes: "I owned a pair of Rogers LS3/5As back in the day, the LS50 is better in every way."

I will let you dig to see if there are other comparisons I have missed.

Let's give the reviewers a break. They are committing no crime against audiophilia when they don't do comparisons you'd like to see.

Decibel Audio here in Chicago carries both Harbeth and KEF (that Harbeth 30.1 is a great sounding speaker by the way). Anyone in the Chicagoland area can compare them directly themselves.

If you ask nicely, I may even be talked into going up to Decibel, doing a direct comparison and reporting back.

Roscoe..thanks for the offer.  Im sure many on this board would appreciate any feedback on these two speakers.

Dont get me wrong on my comments re the reviewers.  Im not one to dump on them given the economic realities the print mags deal with.  otho through head to head harbeth v. ls50 v. spendor is not very complicated or expensive.  A couple of grand, a small room and few different amps.  call me cynical but suspect its a desire not to declare one manufacturer mo better then the others.  but it also could be done without declaring a winner just to highlight differences etc.

[joeling39]

I own both. Also a couple of LS3/5as. I like them both. The P3ESR has a little more sparkle on the top while the LS50 goes lower. This comparison has a Naim Super Nait + Hi Cap as front end. If one has to choose only one, I choose the LS50.

On a whim, I paired the LS50 with a pair of REL T5 subs in my big room with a Leben CS600 or DIY Hifi Supply Django TVC + Leak TL 12.1. Pretty convincing.

Regards,
Joe Ling

[srb]

If you're not in a hurry, the Vapor Sound Breeze with the great RAAL ribbon tweeter at only $1395/pair has just begun a demo tour (http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=115002.msg1201028#msg1201028).

There may even be someone who is able to do a comparison between it and the Harbeth or the KEF.

Steve

[neekomax]

It's a crime to suggest a discontinued product I know, but if you see a Soundfield Monitor 1 on the auction block take notice. It uses a KEF driver along with a powered sub. Heard the LS50 at Axpona, it's great, I just think the cross at 200 hz to 8" sub gives the Monitor 1 the leg up on the LS50 with less excursion/distortion. But I own an M1, so obviously I am a fanboy. They are both very nice speakers, and have a great room filling sound. Let us know what you end up getting and good luck!!

+1

OP, where are you located? You should listen to the Soundfield Audio Monitor 1s if you're in this market. The low end on them will blow the LS50s and the Harbeths out of the water. At the very least they will give you a sense of what a Uni-Q driver based speaker sounds like (very good). If you like the SAMs, I might know where you can get a pair.

[roscoeiii]

The Soundfield Monitor 2 speakers shown at AXPONA were also great sounding.

I would also add Fritz Speakers to your list. They blew me away at AKFest a couple years ago.

[geowak]

I don't think these are monitors, but they are the best sounding standmount speakers I have heard. Guy here on AC is selling his Wilson Audio Duette speakers and stands for 1/2 the price new. These are very, very good speakers.
You would be astonished at the low freqs they produce.

[James Romeyn]

I don't think these are monitors, but they are the best sounding standmount speakers I have heard. Guy here on AC is selling his Wilson Audio Duette speakers and stands for 1/2 the price new. These are very, very good speakers.
You would be astonished at the low freqs they produce.

Is not Duette MSRP $13k /2 = $6750 used?  This is a far cry from the P3esr under $3k full list.

I am in the most extreme minority in having no great reaction to the LS50.  I loved several more recent KEF so this is puzzling.  San Francisco dealer said they were well broken in.  I heard them on good SS amp and also nice McIntosh autoformer...no love at all, in two different rooms.  Go figure. 

Never heard the SAM1 but they would be on the top of my list.  Russel's recommendation looks very nice too.     

[tabrink]

I am listening to my SAM 1 right now via my AVA complete front end. I am a very discerning listener and a guy who deeply researches every purchase as I work for a charity and thus make a charity wage. Not complaining.  Thus a few of the big pocketbook guys like to pounce on me when I post. BUT..
The essence of this post was that the SAM 1 made it easy to pry my venerable Vandersteens out of my cold dead hands.
IMHO AVA and AJ's speakers are the best value on this planet.
Kind regards,
Tom

[geowak]

Is not Duette MSRP $13k /2 = $6750 used?  This is a far cry from the P3esr under $3k full list.

I am in the most extreme minority in having no great reaction to the LS50.  I loved several more recent KEF so this is puzzling.  San Francisco dealer said they were well broken in.  I heard them on good SS amp and also nice McIntosh autoformer...no love at all, in two different rooms.  Go figure. 

Never heard the SAM1 but they would be on the top of my list.  Russel's recommendation looks very nice too.   

Yes they are pricey, no doubt about that. I did not see a budget? that's my fault for throwing these out there as I see now what is
being suggested (price wise).

[neekomax]

Yes they are pricey, no doubt about that. I did not see a budget? that's my fault for throwing these out there as I see now what is
being suggested (price wise).

Ha, yeah, I was like, ' ... know what else are great stand mounts? TAD CR 1s!'... 

[R_burke]

The Soundfield Monitor 2 speakers shown at AXPONA were also great sounding.

I think these use two amplifiers to achieve the full sound, which might mean the need for some other piece of equipment like a crossover - perhaps someone here knows more on the subject