[mresseguie]

Hello, all.

I just stumbled upon AudioCircle quite accidentally, but I'm thrilled that I found it. I live in Oregon. I do not know any audiophiles in my area.

After reading nearly a dozen threads, I feel confident enough to describe my short journey to where I am today. [My apologies in advance for the novella below.]

Back in 1980, I bought a pair of Yamaha NS 500 speakers with beryllium dome tweeters that absolutely rocked my world. For various reasons (I lived overseas for many years, lacked time, etc.) I sold them in 1990. I never forgot how I loved their sound.

Early last year, I finally got tired of straining to hear the audio while watching TV/video. I started out thinking I wanted a surround system to enhance my TV/Video experience, so I bought the below components in a piecemeal fashion with my wife's permission(!). It only took me about 6 months to realize I don't actually want or need a surround system. (Argh! How do I explain this to my dear wife? ) My current system:

PSB Synchrony Two floor standing speakers
Paradigm cc-570 v3 (used)
Denon AVR2113 A/V receiver
PSB SubSeries 300 subwoofer
PSB Image S5 Surround
Samsung Bluray player
Logitec Squeeze Box Touch
An old 5 disc CD changer/player that my wife loves (sigh) is hooked up to this system.


I really like my Synchrony speakers. I was initially drawn to them because they have titanium tweeters. [I listened to Paradigm also, but the PSBs were less expensive.] The Synchrony Twos sounded fantastic in the dealer's showroom when powered by a Simaudio 600i integrated amp and a Simaudio CD player. They sounded so good that I decided I could not walk out of the store without the speakers. [This was in mid-2012. The speakers were in-store demos I picked up for $1995.] Imagine my consternation when I got home, hooked them up to my Denon in my family room and played the same tracks I'd listened to in the dealer's showroom. That's when it really hit me that room size/acoustics, speaker placement, amp selection, and a hundred (?) other details have a profound effect on one's experience. Oh, they still sound good, but, you know, different.

So here I am in 2013. I don't really need my surround speakers because I just don't spend much time watching TV/videos anymore. Do I even need my subwoofer? [Maybe, yes for videos.] Do I want to listen to music in the family room at all?

There is a huge WAF issue with placement of my speakers in the family room. They are set just 18" from the back wall. There are cabinets to either side of the speakers. The room has a cathedral ceiling [16' high?] with one side wall opening to the kitchen/breakfast area.

I could move the speakers to my home office, but they are a bit large for an approx. 12' X 15' room, aren't they? Perhaps I could place them in the formal living room.

Anyway, I'd like to get a quality amp to power my speakers. I'd like to get a quality CD player (Oppo?); I'll hook up my Squeezebox Touch, too. Since my sources are all digital (and I currently have no plans for a turntable), I was told a direct digital amp is the way to go. I am considering the NAD 390DD. Before this, I had been thinking about several other possibilities (Bryston, Simaudio 340i, and others). I'm trying to save money by getting a used integrated amp. I keep an eye on Audiogon's listings.

Now, before I sign off, I have a confession to make. I walked into another customer's speaker audition at the same dealer back in December. [I was permitted to eavesdrop. ProAc D28 speakers were being compared to ProAc D18 speakers. O....M....G!!! The D28s are amazing. [Of course, they were powered by the same Simaudio 600i, same CD player, same massive Shunyata cables, etc.] So....now I know that there are speakers in the world that sound better than my speakers. I know I love their sound. I can afford them so long as I don't power them with a 600i!  I know my wife would decapitate me, too. 

Okay. I'll shut up for now.

This looks like a great place to learn all about audio BTW.

[ltr317]

Welcome aboard!   Kick off your shoes and enjoy the ride!  I'm a big fan of most English speakers, especially ProAcs.  I use a pair of Heybrook stand mounts in my bedroom system which I have owned for approx. 20 years because they are wonderful sounding. 

[charmerci]

hi,

Welcome aboard. You'll have fun and interesting conversations here with a great group of people.

My immediate advice is calm down! 

Some of the things that you are thinking about - just my personal opinion - are probably just sideways moves. Some of the pieces that you are drooling over (not having heard those particular components but from years of experience) - may sound different and you may or may not actually like them when you get them.

Take your time to learn and listen and just enjoy. You can eventually put together a really good system without breaking the bank or your relationship.

[Maritan]

Welcome. This is a place I stumbled upon too, and I'm completely smitten with the place. People here are genuinely interested in helping you in any way possible.

I've already compiled a list of folks that I'll need to buy a beer if/ when I meet them someday. Truly a wonderful place, and I'm glad you found it.

Also, I just got an Oppo 105. I'm hearing things that I never even realized was in the recording. I'm just blown away already. And this is supposed to get better once the Oppo has burnt in? I can't wait! If you have the funds, get it. Of course, I've never listened to a dedicated high end CD player, so I don't know how well it stacks up, but if reviews are to be believed, Oppo more than holds its own.

Ok. I'll wipe the drool off now.

[brooklyn]

I could move the speakers to my home office, but they are a bit large for an approx. 12' X 15' room, aren't they? Perhaps I could place them in the formal living room.

I have a pair of Magnepan MMG's in the same size room and I don't think that's to much for the room. I'm not using room treatments at this time but you can if need be.

charmerci, is spot on, his advice is solid.

also, if your going with mostly 2 channel audio you might want read the book Get Better Sound by Jim Smith, a great set up information guide.

Welcome to the best audio forum on the web, theirs a lot of great people here.

Regards,
Jerry

[mresseguie]

Thanks for the warm welcome. It took me a bit longer to reply than I expected.

Charmerci, you are absolutely correct. I do need to calm down. I knew that as I dashed around last year, hell-bent on buying things before they disappeared or before my wife changed her mind. I've actually slowed down a bit, but I still spend countless hours researching this or that online.

Maritan,

I'd really like to see your feedback on the spanking new Oppo 105 if you swing by here again.

Brooklyn,

I will call my local bookstore about getting the book. There is so much I want to understand about this rediscovered hobby.

[charmerci]

Ha, ha!

Yeah, there is a fine balance between enthusiasm and patience in buying good audio! 

[pescholl]

Hi, I'm Philip and I live in east Texas.

I consider myself an audiophile on a budget. My system includes:
   Celestion CS6 Tower Speakers (vintage 1990s)
   Onkyo TX-8255 Stereo Receiver
   Sony BDP-390 Blu-Ray/SACD Player
   Carver C-9 Sonic Holographic Generator
 and a Emotiva XDA-1 DAC

My listening room is also my bedroom and is 11x12 feet. I am quite happy with my system but someday I would like to add a subwoofer and upgrade the receiver to separates. When the prices come down, I would also like to get a DSD DAC as I have a small but growing collection of .dsf files which I convert to flac via Audiogate.

Except for my collection of 200 SACDs, I have migrated all my disc-based music to my computer and play through foobar2000.

I listen to mostly classical and jazz but throw in new age, world and classic rock from time-to-time for variety.

[buyersremorse]

For a stereo only set up in your office, you could do far worse than the Logitech SB Touch streaming 24/192 (which it can do) to the NAD 390DD feeding your PSB Synchrony(s).  With a little experimenting, I bet you could match, or surpass, the sound you heard at the dealer.  I've listened to the NAD 390dd feeding the PSB Imagine T2s, and that combo sounded terrific.
For the family room, I think you could save some money and find some less expensive PSBs or Paradigms to substitute as the fronts for your home theater since they are not (IMO) as important to your overall enjoyment when watching movies.  Just my 2 cents.

[Guy 13]

Hi mresseguie and all Audio Circle members.
Welcome to the wonderful world of Audio Circle.
Audio mistakes are done by people that are too much in a hurry,
I was one of those and maybe I am still one of those...
Take your time.

Guy 13
 

[Nick77]

Welcome to AC, unless you need a new killer bluray I think your money could go further on a good DAC coupled with the Touch. You can almost get a nice integrated and DAC for the price of the Oppo. The Touch is a nice source especially when you hook it up to a good after market power supply.

[JLM]

Being an audiophile is a journey, not a destination.  Travel long enough and you're bound to make wrong turns.  Real mistakes are those you don't learn from.  Audiophile, know thyself is a great adage. 

Genre of music (will dictate the type of system that would work best), listening habits (loud, morning, shared room, room size), budget (money, space, gear vs. music, and time), WAF (where and how much $$), audio preferences (bass, imaging, detail, PRAT, tubes, vinyl, etc.), and overall just how this fits into your life should all be considered in the hunt.  In college I did headphones (which have lots of advantages if privacy/family issues don't mix well with your listening).  Unfortunately audio is mostly a solitary endeavor and can pull you away from wife, kids, and friends.  It can also be an expensive pastime but thankfully remarkably good sound continues to be more and more affordable.  Deciding on two channels saves money too (use the other speakers for a 2nd system, most of my old gear has gone into the 2nd audio and AV systems, tell wife it's for the family). 

Many/most of these factors will change during a lifetime.  Our values evolve, we learn, and our stations in life vary.  I started 40+ years ago with my Mom's old tube AM radio and a portable cassette player/recorder, loving music and audio ("stereo" in those days) was about the only hi-tech game in town.  Made several moves up the audiophile chain until marriage/kids/divorce.  Since then the internet replaced bricks and mortar shopping and I've come back to audio.  For the past 8 years I've enjoyed an audio man cave and this spring the last kid graduates H.S.  But in the meantime my musical tastes/listening habits have mellowed, the turntable is long gone, and I'm looking for computer based convenience as I approach retirement.

[neekomax]

Hey bro, let me also extend a hearty welcome, and congratulations on what will surely be so much fun that you will slowly, happily, lose your mind like we all have  . Seriously, I began to be 'interested' in improving my home audio situation about a year and a half ago, when a friend who worked at a thrift shop kindly bequeathed me a pair of B&W DM602 monitors, because she knew I had been a pro musician in a previous career, and figured I would appreciate them. Um, not only did I appreciate them, those humble speakers started me on a quest for better sound that has basically consumed me more and more ever since. It's an addiction, and I hope I never recover.

Audio Circle is a super awesome forum, as others have said, because there is a very supportive, open-minded attitude that generally reigns here. I have spent a bit of time on some other audio forums, and there tends to be a bit more judgement passed, and you're more likely to see questions answered with stuff like 'google it', or 'search the forum', which I think sucks because, personally, I want to talk to people, not just get the answer, because sometimes the answer isn't the most interesting part of the discussion.

As for where you're at right now, my thoughts are this: I really like having a dedicated listening room for a bunch of reasons- I don't feel like I'm intruding on my girlfriend's activities in the rest of the house. Sometimes we like to listen together, but we do that on our living room HT system. Also, you're going to be so into this shit that you're gonna want to two systems to develop and obsess over, trust me. My listening room (our den, basically), is pretty small (12'x11'), but I've got it sounding pretty good, and I love spending time in here (where I am right now ) So, if I were you, I would keep your living room setup as is (for now), seems like it's sounding reasonably good for HT and casual listening. I would focus on building an awesome 2 channel system in your home office, and what's great is that you will be able to build it from the ground up, tailored for that space. I think 12' x 15' is a fine amount of space. First thing is to research the hell out of speakers, and make that your first purchase, with overall budget weighted heavily towards them. My opinion is that the right speakers make the most difference in any system, for a few reasons that I can elaborate on if you're interested. I think you should consider a multi subwoofer array (or one sub to start) as well, whichever speakers you choose, unless you go with speakers that have integrated subs, or very large bass drivers that give an in-room response down to around 30 Hz or lower. Bass is such an important part of music, and you don't want to ask 6.5" passive drivers to make the kind of excursions necessary for real, impactful, bass, when they're also responsible for providing low distortion, correctly rendered mid range frequencies. It will limit your headroom, and test your speakers in a way you don't want at high SPLs. Others will have differing opinions on this, of course, and YMMV.

You might consider buying used, I've had some good experiences and saved some money. My favorite source for used stuff is Echo Hi Fi in Portland (http://www.echohifi.com/inventory.php), they have good prices, great service, and deliver.

Anyway, that's enough advice from me, there's plenty of guys on here with a gazillion times more experience than me. Take it all with a grain of salt, and have fun!

[charmerci]

Hi, I'm Philip and I live in east Texas.

I consider myself an audiophile on a budget. My system includes:
   Celestion CS6 Tower Speakers (vintage 1990s)
   Onkyo TX-8255 Stereo Receiver
   Sony BDP-390 Blu-Ray/SACD Player
   Carver C-9 Sonic Holographic Generator
 and a Emotiva XDA-1 DAC

My listening room is also my bedroom and is 11x12 feet. I am quite happy with my system but someday I would like to add a subwoofer and upgrade the receiver to separates. When the prices come down, I would also like to get a DSD DAC as I have a small but growing collection of .dsf files which I convert to flac via Audiogate.

Except for my collection of 200 SACDs, I have migrated all my disc-based music to my computer and play through foobar2000.

I listen to mostly classical and jazz but throw in new age, world and classic rock from time-to-time for variety.

hi and welcome to AC. It's a good place to be. I agree with neekomax about the people and the responses that you get here.

Based on your list here, I'd say you'd get your biggest improvement value-wise on sound by getting a newer set of speakers, imo. But, but, but if you're super-happy with them, I'd say get a sub-woofer next.

[woodsyi]

Welcome everyone. 

I got one advice for y'all.
Read, ask, listen, buy, sell, tweak, build, buy more, sell more, etc. etc.  While you are doing all this enjoy the process. 

You are only young once,  you are only a virgin once, and, like wise, you are only an audio newbie once.  It's a fun time to be in  as you are head over heels with enthusiasm for everything about this hobby.  You know you got the bug.

Years later, things slow down and bit of ennui will eventually creep in.  You still love it but you get excited a little less.

So, enjoy the start of the journey and don't rush it. 

Welcome to the audiophooldom!     

[TrungT]

Lone Star Audio Fest is just around the corner.   
May 3, 4 and 5
http://lonestaraudiofest.com/

[charmerci]

Welcome everyone. 

I got one advice for y'all.
Read, ask, listen, buy, sell, tweak, build, buy more, sell more, etc. etc.  While you are doing all this enjoy the process. 

You are only young once,  you are only a virgin once, and, like wise, you are only an audio newbie once.  It's a fun time to be in  as you are head over heels with enthusiasm for everything about this hobby.  You know you got the bug.

Years later, things slow down and bit of ennui will eventually creeps in.  You still love it but you get excited a little less.

So, enjoy the start of the journey and don't rush it. 

Welcome to the audiophooldom!   

I agree with the enjoy the process part - but I disagree about the audio newbie part.  What a waste of time and money that was! Oh well, we all have made and will make decisions that we wish we could take back.

[pescholl]

hi and welcome to AC. It's a good place to be. I agree with neekomax about the people and the responses that you get here.

Based on your list here, I'd say you'd get your biggest improvement value-wise on sound by getting a newer set of speakers, imo. But, but, but if you're super-happy with them, I'd say get a sub-woofer next.

I inherited my Celestions from my brother who liked their detailed sound. These towers were his third pair, his first two were bookshelf speakers.  I will admit the playing a hi-res source through my DAC, then my Carver to the Celestions, the effect is like sitting front row center at a concert. When I close my eyes, I feel as if I could reach out ant touch the musicians.

[mresseguie]

It's been quite a while since I last posted here [and much has changed for me], so I wanted to post an update for anyone who cares to read it.

I now have two separate systems in my home--one is 2 channel; the other is HT.

Most of the HT components are listed in my first post (Denon amp, Sony 5 disc player, Samsung Bluray player, Paradigm CC-570 v.3 with newly added Paradigm Reference 20 v.3 monitors, PSB SubSeries 300 subwoofer). I sold my PSB Synchrony 2 speakers because they just couldn't fit into my HT room space and miserably failed WAF plus I started noticing brightness that I found uncomfortable. The Ref. 20 v.3 monitors are a step down from the Synchrony speakers, but they fit in the room and have WAF to boot. This system does not get used much.

My pride and joy is my 2 channel system in my home office. It consists of a Simaudio i340 integrated amp (100 wpc), Squeezebox Touch, Oppo 103, Cambridge Audio Dacmagic Plus, and ProAc Response D2 monitors. The speakers are set up as near field. I love to listen to the music that comes out of my D2s. My music preferences have shifted since buying them. I now listen to piano, violin, jazz, classical, female vocals and acoustic guitar more than others forms of music. It's quite a shift from my growing up with hard rock. I listen at fairly low volumes.

With the D2s I have no fatigue after listening for longer periods. I had experienced fatigue with the Synchrony 2s.

I should probably be content with this two system set up, but I can't help but notice how the HT system is so noticeably inferior to the 2 channel system. [Yup. I am on the prowl for improvements.] I have forced patience onto my mind. I research far more now. I audition as many speakers and amps as possible. I have learned from the D2s that I really love high quality speakers. I understand how a high quality amp can dramatically improve the musical experience.

Here is what is in my mind currently:

I want to audition speakers from the following companies:
Devore
Salk Sound
Sonus Faber
Zu Audio
(and others as I learn of them)

I'm really impressed by everything I have read about Devore speakers and Salk Sound speakers. There is a Devore dealer not far from my home who I have contacted. I will audition what he has to offer soon. Unless I am able to listen to privately owned Salk speakers, I don't know when I will have a chance to experience them. Perhaps at the Audio Fest in San Francisco in 2014 (?). Dunno.

I will eventually replace my Denon AVR2113ci. It was the first component I purchased (back when I really didn't understand what I was getting into!). I do not like the Denon, but I tolerate it for now. I may opt for separates or I may opt for an Onkyo/Integra. It depends how much money I spend on speakers. I know to decide on which speakers first.

What else? Oh, yeah. It occurs to me that I may be so blown away by either Devore or Salk speakers that I will use them for my 2 channel system and demote my D2s to the HT. If this were to happen, I might eventually want to replace my center channel speakers with something like the ProAc D Monitor. [Or would I become a "Salk for everything" fanatic? ] I don't know and I really will try to reign in my already over-active imagination--perhaps.

Once you finish shaking your head at how happily lost I have become, please take a moment to post your thoughts or criticism. I really enjoy reading people's thoughts and understanding their journeys.

[MaxCast]

Thanks for the update.  Sounds all too familiar to many of us 

I believe the speaker is the hardest component to buy.  Reading reviews is very helpful but you just don't know other peoples sound preferences or how the speaker will sound in your room.  When you spend that kind of money it is very important to audition as many as you can.  Audio shows may not provide the best rooms for audition but you can hear more than enough different speakers and get an idea.  Take your time, if you can't buy used.   
I'll put a plug in for all the speaker manufactures here at AC including the Salk, Odyssey and Vapor Audio stand mounts.