First foray into digital steaming- need advice.

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pgastone

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First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« on: 21 Oct 2012, 07:54 pm »
I am in a bit of quandary on what to do- here's the problem:
I travel to europe a lot for work and have a little studio apartment where i set up a small system consisting of unison research cd player, unison research unico SE integrated, and focal micro utopia BE's.
So far so good but i go back and forth so much i am tired of brining CD's back and forth with me- so i was thinking of either ripping all my music to MacAir or even better to an external drive and then just getting a usbdac to play my music off of the computer.
However, the added issue is that the stereo is literally across the room from where i sit and i often need my computer while i listen to music- so now i need a way to connect my computer to the dac/stereo across the room and it is no small distance- and thus i started looking at the arcam solution with the rWave streaming wirelessly across the room to the rDac.
But will it cut it? Is it lossless as they claim?
I do not want to compromise sound quality if i can avoid it.
The other thought is getting an iPod classic (160GB), loading it up in the apple lossless format and then getting a dock that will bypass the internal dec + analogue circuitry and then hooking up to a dac that way (peachtree idac looks like a good all in one alternative).
I would like to keep budget to around $1000 or less for DAC.
Anyone heard the arcam rdac/rwave combination?
And or have any other suggestions of what i should look into?
Thx in advance!!



Chromisdesigns

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #1 on: 21 Oct 2012, 08:19 pm »
You might want to take a look at the Squeezebox Touch while they are still available.  Excellent sound quality and pretty cheap.  You could rip all your music into FLAC on a portable hard drive, take the drive with you, plug it into the computer there, and stream to the Touch.

The problem with even a big iPod is it isn't going to hold that many albums in any of the lossless formats.

srb

Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #2 on: 21 Oct 2012, 08:43 pm »
If you use an iPod with a digital dock you will have limited remote control with the handheld remote.  Using a wireless DAC with your laptop will give you a better remote control experience.
 
I haven't heard the Arcam rDAC/rWave, but although it uses non-WiFi KLEER technology, some users have reported problems.  I can't find any information on what resolution files it will transmit or whether it uses compression.
 
The Audioengine D2 Wireless DAC has gotten some good reviews and will transmit 24/96 losslessly.  The only drawback might be it is a little less convenient if you want to move around the room with your laptop as it is a small external box and not a plug-in dongle like the rWave.  http://audioengineusa.com/Store/Audioengine-D2
 
Steve

avta

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #3 on: 21 Oct 2012, 08:50 pm »
I agree with the suggestion for a Squeezebox Touch.

pgastone

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #4 on: 21 Oct 2012, 11:34 pm »
thx
unfortunately i have not been to find info on the kleer transfer rates either.
As for the touch, i would be pretty much doing the same thing i would be doing with rdac- right?
Ie- external hard drive connected to computer and streaming to a dac wirelessly- and that would be the touch or rdac
Or is the process different?

WC

Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #5 on: 22 Oct 2012, 12:15 am »
The Audioengine D2 would be another option.

http://audioengineusa.com/Store/Audioengine-D2#.UISPkWt5mSM

srb

Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #6 on: 22 Oct 2012, 12:20 am »
The Audioengine D2 would be another option.

Well, not 'another' option as it was already mentioned (by me) a few posts above!  ;)
 
Steve

pgastone

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #7 on: 22 Oct 2012, 01:02 am »
yes, i am going to look it audio engine-thx for the suggestion- i had checked it out at one point but had sort of left it aside because of the "extra box"..... but it does sound like i should  give it this serious consideration and look into it a bit more carefully.

Generally, it does not seem that rwand/wireless aspect to arcam system has not been reviewed all that thoroughly at this stage- in many ways i am surprised because i cannot imagine that others haven't had to figure out how to connect a computer to their stereo in an effective way when the 2 don't sit right next to each other...also because wifi has obvious limitations

jarcher

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #8 on: 22 Oct 2012, 01:38 am »
I think best value for the money with your existing equipment is just about any squeezebox + a stand alone DAC which fits within your budget.  I use a Squeezebox Duet vs a Touch because I like the less visually obtrusive receiver box + the squeezebox controller (or the squeezebox application for my iphone).  The Touch screen is nice, but that means you have to have it close at hand, which kinda defeats the purpose in your particular set up.

Sometimes honestly it's just nice to have a physical dedicated remote in your hand w/ media & volume control in one.  And the SBC is a nice remote (can even listen through the headphone jack).

The Touch is better as a stand alone DAC, but as your budget allows for a DAC as well, and if you're just using it as a streamer to a separate DAC, the Duet can be had for less than the Touch.

As for which DAC w/ the budget you have left.  There are many in the USD750 & below category that are worthwhile - and more so even when you consider used.  With a $1K USD budget you could potentially even buy 2 SB Duets + 2 budget DACs for each of your homes.  One of the DAC's I have for secondary duty is a Matrix Mini-I that retails for $350 that's great for the money, but there are many more (see AC circle for sub $450 DACs).

Best of luck! 

WC

Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #9 on: 22 Oct 2012, 02:58 am »

Well, not 'another' option as it was already mentioned (by me) a few posts above!  ;)
 
Steve

Missed that.  :oops:

pgastone

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #10 on: 25 Oct 2012, 02:01 am »
right then...sounds like i have more research to do.
So it seems that nobody is very keen on the arcam solution and that there are some good tried and true alternatives.

Out of curiosity, can a wireless solution compare to a wired solution in terms of sound quality?

jarcher

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #11 on: 25 Oct 2012, 03:38 am »
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that as long as you have a strong signal w/ no drop outs, there shouldn't be any reason why wireless data transmission in itself is inferior to wired data transmission.  Assuming of course non-compressed / bit-perfect data transmission, which, e.g., supposedly an airport express does. 

BUT - some will argue that Wi-Fi chips introduce too much potential noise in your signal stream at the receiving end, so best to avoid / deactivate / remove them and use Ethernet when possible.  Less potential for noise / more reliability. 

For what you want to do I wouldn't obsess over it too much though.  The practicality of using your Macair as portable server - and controlling it via that or Apple Remote - outweighs IMHO the less than perfect potential wireless transmission issues.  After all, the best music is what you actually listen to. 

If people haven't opined about the Arcam rDAC / Rwac / wand etc, I'm guessing it's because of lack of personal experience. I just looked it up on Crutchfield & have to say that on paper it looks like a decent & decently priced option.  I.e. $600 for the DAC & $100 for a dongle for your Mac or i-thing.  Decent DAC chip (wolfson 8741) & asynchronous USB.  The cynic in me says that for $600 retail too many compromises must have been made.  But w/ out personal experience, that means nothing.  If the e-tailer has a good / liberal return policy, I say give it a try.

geofstro

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #12 on: 29 Oct 2012, 05:50 pm »
Quote
However, the added issue is that the stereo is literally across the room from where i sit and i often need my computer while i listen to music

If you are planning on streaming music from your MacAir while working on it or surfing the net, you might suffer interruptions to the audio. Strictly speaking it's better to dedicate a computer for audio playback only, if you can manage to.

Hope it helps.

Geoff

srb

Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #13 on: 29 Oct 2012, 06:09 pm »
Sucessful wireless audio streaming will widely vary on a case by case basis and will depend a lot on your router, physical walls, floors and obstructions, other sources of interference and distance.  It works flawlessly for some and not so great for others.
 
I have an older computer (Core2Duo/8MB) and a decent router (Netgear WNDR3700), and I can be working on the computer while simultaneously recording four HD cable channels and streaming to three Airport Express with no dropouts.
 
Steve

ctviggen

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #14 on: 29 Oct 2012, 07:53 pm »
Wired or wireless?  I use my computer all the time while streaming audio and have never had a problem. That's watching TV, bluray, DVDs, recording TV, etc. However, everything is on 1 gbps wired connections.  Not sure how many HD channels I could record at one time.  I would think, though, that you'd be getting near the realistic speed of 1 gbps (about 100Mbytes per second is the fastest I've seen, after overhead and the like) for a computer. 

geofstro

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Re: First foray into digital steaming- need advice.
« Reply #15 on: 30 Oct 2012, 03:50 pm »
I agree with all the advice here. As an alternative though, you might want to look into Subsonic. See my post on streaming your entire library anywhere at CD quality. This would involve having a Mac/PC or NAS at home which runs Subsonic and a Mac/PC plus DAC in your studio in Europe.

Alternatively you could connect via an IOS device and stream from your Subsonic server at home to an Airport Express/AppleTV or Squeezbox; etc. via Airplay.

Like I said in my referred post, I think it's the future for us Audiophile nomads. :thumb: