output offset - when to take reading?

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atenolol50

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 13
output offset - when to take reading?
« on: 28 May 2004, 01:24 am »
whilst testing the output offset, i noticed that it takes a long time to stabilise ... if it ever did.

power on it starts from -10mV and starts climbing.
2 minutes later, it hovers ard -25mv.
i've had enough and so switched off.

is this normal?
when should i take the reading?

eico1

Re: output offset - when to take reading?
« Reply #1 on: 28 May 2004, 01:37 am »
Quote from: atenolol50
when should i take the reading?


When it stops moving.

steve

EchiDna

output offset - when to take reading?
« Reply #2 on: 28 May 2004, 02:24 am »
it's normal to a degree, from memory, the first test you do it to check the value, do an adjustment, then run the amp for 15 mins to warm it up and repeat the measurement, adjust to the required value and away you go.... listen for a while, enjoy the first sounds of your AKSA knowing that in just a few hours it will improve dramatically as the caps bed in... then remeasure and re-adjust to the required value when at operating temp...

now I could be wrong here, so don't take my words as gospel truth. I'd hate to cause you to do damage to your new amp!

*edit* oops! I'm talking about the wrong thing here!...

AKSA

output offset - when to take reading?
« Reply #3 on: 28 May 2004, 02:48 am »
Output offset on SS amplifiers - most amplifiers except tubes with output transformers - change all the time.  It is a drift phenomenon, and quite normal.

Most SS amplifiers will have an offset somewhere between +100mV and -100mV.  It's normal, and is controlled by the differential pair through the voltage amplifier.  Once your amp is built and functioning, it will vary up and down with temperature and mains voltage.

The speaker driver is quite tolerant of up to about a quarter of a volt of offset.  This is 250mV, quite a lot.  What happens is that the standing current this will set up in the voice coil will very slightly displace the cone (perhaps half a millimetre) one way or the other, depending on polarity, from the resting position.  This resting position is controlled by the cone surround and the coil former spider - that concentrically ring-shaped piece of impregnated cloth right at the join of the cone and the voice coil former.

The mean position of a driver cone is not particularly well controlled and usually changes during the life of the driver.  Major displacements will skew the waveform, generating more second harmonic, which will sound arguably warmer, but more significantly, reduce slightly the power handling of the driver.  You won't notice it.

To set the offset, there are instructions in the book.  You want to set it for the lowest value at the usual time you listen to the amp.  This is generally at night, around 9pm.  So, measure the offset at this time, three nights running, two in the week, and one on the weekend, and take the mean.  Then make adjustments to R3 to reduce offset at 9pm one week night.

And, remember, IT'S NOT CRITICAL AND WON'T AFFECT THE SONICS!!

Cheers,

Hugh

atenolol50

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 13
output offset - when to take reading?
« Reply #4 on: 28 May 2004, 03:17 am »
ok. got it.

enough of crocodile clips for now.
will setup in the chassis then retest/monitor.

thanks all.

Rhythm Willie

output offset - when to take reading?
« Reply #5 on: 28 May 2004, 05:43 am »
As I am unforunate to be a perfectionist with my amps, this was initially frustrating, I eventually got both channels of the 100n (by playing with various R3 combinations) to within the range of +- 5mv and settled back satisfied.

Along came summer(airconditioners on etc affecting the mains voltage) & low & behold both channels wanted to settle on around -15mv??? Anyway the amps don't sound any different. I also noticed that when someone in my house turned on the tap(our home runs on rainwater/electic pump) the slight voltage change affects both offset & bias setting for a few seconds. I do have the advantage of living slightly out of the city however,with a large dedicated transformer to only our home and the amps(monoblocks) have dedicated non switched mains outlets within 2 metres of the fuse box, that I get a good low interference supply into the home.

I am just going to leave them now , I suppose a variable Resistor at R3 would be handy, but I believe it would affect the sonics and next time I measure them, and they may measure 0mv next time.

kyrill

output offset - when to take reading?
« Reply #6 on: 28 May 2004, 08:32 pm »
Quote from: Rhythm Willie
As I am unforunate to be a perfectionist with my amps, this was initially frustrating, I eventually got both channels of the 100n (by playing with various R3 combinations) to within the range of +- 5mv and settled back satisfied.

..and next time I measure them, and they may measure 0mv next time..


Wow, you follow strictly the ideas of yr mind. Reality is mostly about experience. I happily listen at -20 mv and a time later it is -10 mv.

I learned to not care anymore..