[Æ]

Lets cut a speaker in 1/2 and then we can talk about the cheap parts in the Xover.  Or cut apart a cable and note there is only copper there, or silver, or both.  How about counting windings on transformers - which model has more?

No reason to cut anything apart if it has screws it can be opened and examined non-destructively. No need to count transformer windings either, the bigger of any two transformers will likely have better regulation. If you really want to get picky, weigh the transformers.

[Elizabeth]

The parts in a 'hi end' multi outlet box:
Aftermarket cord average $200 to $800. Even $2,000
Four duplex outlets Audiophile grade: From $80 to $400. Even $1,600
The box: $100 or so, maybe if machined from solid block $500
The secret parts.. Thousands...$$$
So you can see here the device offered is a real bargain.

I tried to make my own powercords. The cost of materials and plugs was such that when i saw Pangea cords at the intro. prices last year I grabbed a big pile of them! I could not make a cord as good from parts for less, or even equal to the price of the Pangea.

However i think I could make an outlet gizmo for a lot less than $1,500.
And I compare the two items I did spend $1,500 on (each)
A Furman Ref20I, and a PS Audio P600 to the box displayed, and I think I got the better deal. Just by weight!! 80lbs each
And yes some of us shop for audio equipment by weight.

[Waker]

Well there is protection and then there is power conditioning. Two different things. Some power conditioners offer no protection. Some surge protectors offer no power conditioning

"Let your ears and EYES decide,that I agree with,what I don't agree with and it's not just shunyata is the pricing
for a few receptacle,some wire,tmov,copper straps,breaker switch and a box." DrummerMitchell

 I agree with DrummerMitchell--this is a glorified power strip with an MOV surge protector.  The "minimalist" pitch is just a way of saying, "We don't give you much for your $1500."  For about the same price new, you can get an isolation transformer that protects and supplies around 2000 watts of power on demand. I scored a 240V/120V isolation transformer that delivers 4000 watts of clean power for only $2K "used," but new in the box, and it weighs 130 pounds.  That Hydra unit is about 10 pounds, if that.  Power is where it's at. 

[Speedskater]

Well there is protection and then there is power conditioning. Two different things. Some power conditioners offer no protection. Some surge protectors offer no power conditioning.

That's for sure!  "Power Conditioning" has no universally accepted definition.  As  I wrote in another thread 6 weeks ago:

For a start, "power conditioner" is a vague term.
It may mean any combination of:
Interference filter
Surge protection
Automatic line voltage adjustment
Isolation Transformer
UPS (Uninterruptible Power Supply) and this term has different meanings.
Balanced AC line power

[roscoeiii]

Grant and Richard from Shunyata are great people to deal with.  Straight forward and very personable.

I have both Shunyata and Running Springs and very happy with both. 

+1 on all this. I really liked the improvement in sound that my Shunyata Guardian 4 gave me, regardless of what was in side. And now I use the RSA Haley which is the best I have had in my system. PI Audio's Buss line is also excellent, but note that the RevB and UberBuss do not have surge protection (which is a must for me). PI Audio has just released their first surge protector, which we should be hearing impressions of soon from ACers. Dave at PI Audio is also a great guy to deal with and has a 30 day trial period for his gear.

That's what has worked fabulously for me. Never regretted a dime I spent on any of the above companies' products. I hope readers of this thread will take the opportunity to try these themselves instead of just watching from the sidelines. You'd only be out shipping in most cases, if they don't give you what you want sonically.

I'll leave it at that and let the rest of y'all enjoy the thread. Roscoe out.

[Waker]

That's for sure!  "Power Conditioning" has no universally accepted definition.

Tired of that dry, frizzy sound?  Well, say goodbye that limp and lifeless, noise--get new Smooth Sound Conditioner! Smooth Sound beautifies as it protects, giving your sound a lush, thick feel while it restores vital nutrients lost in harsh circuits. After just a few uses, you will begin to experience the smooth, velvety sound you crave! Smooth Sound will restore your music in two easy steps--just plug and play! 

[bhakti]

Ok, let's do some math.  At 5-6x material costs (according to Grant from Shunyata), that puts materials at $250 to $300 for a $1500 retail unit.  I believe this is a common markup scenario within the industry.  So, I'm not sure why people are upset?  Do you think there is less material cost here?  Or do you dislike the 5x markup?

This is my personal attitude toward high end audio:

 - I accept the 5x markup as a commonly practiced business model.  But it doesn't mean I like it.
 - If the unit in question is built with common parts then I will save tons of money by building it myself.
 - If there is some proprietary wizardry that I can't replicate, then I will purchase unit and enjoy.

[Rclark]

All I know is: $1500 for me is a looot of money to spend on a tertiary audio device. I would expect a $1500 upgrade in my sound, a mammoth improvement.

 If I opened up that case and saw that, I would be pissed. I want some technology for my hard earned money, not excuses.

[roscoeiii]

All I know is: $1500 for me is a looot of money to spend on a tertiary audio device. I would expect a $1500 upgrade in my sound, a mammoth improvement.

 If I opened up that case and saw that, I would be pissed. I want some technology for my hard earned money, not excuses.

C'mon! "Excuses"? These things work great as many and maybe most who have used them and listened to them attest. Many people also feel they are worth the money. And a manufacturer is free to priced his products however he wants. Just as you can spend your money however you want. I don't think it has been mentioned here but I also think Shunyata should be praised for his less expensive Guardian line for folks less worried about a component's looks. Also kudos to them for their excellent $100 Venom cables.

[Devil Doc]

If you ain't gettin' paid by those folks, you should be.

Doc

[roscoeiii]

If you ain't gettin' paid by those folks, you should be.

Doc

Just a satisfied customer, and an ACer getting mighty annoyed by people critiquing (or praising) gear that they have never heard.

[drummermitchell]

Rclark,it is a lot for what the eye sees,I also expected an improvement where I didn't have to think I heard a difference or thought I heard a difference and that's with dedicated lines .
I had the hydra 6 on one line and 4 hydra 2's on another 4 lines.                                                                       It wasn't till I home auditioned a Torus did I get that huge improvement,I was shocked at what I heard.
I still had the hydras and swapped them with the Torus(it was instantaneous)the huge improvement.          Someone well known in the audio world had said  to me that(I had to call to find out WTF was happening),
as it was that dramatic improvement with the sound.
QUOTE:You have discovered as I have that having gobs of power in reserve for the amps makes a huge difference.
I also had Anaconda helixes and python helixes throughout if anyone says,maybe it's  the cables .
Using the Torus has been totally satisfying for me(I use three )as it gets me closer to the musicians so to speak,Oh,a 20a Torus used there only 500.00 more than the hydra 6 and you you can hear it with authority.
downside their about 80lbs.
For me,their worth it as they do so much for the music and that's what it's all about .

[Diamond Dog]

Also kudos to them for their excellent $100 Venom cables.

Just a satisfied customer, and an ACer getting mighty annoyed by people critiquing (or praising) gear that they have never heard.

No experience-based feedback to offer on the power conditioner you're touting but I've auditioned those Venom PC's here and I'd say they're closer to adequate than to excellent. Actually, I guess I didn't even find them to be adequate because I didn't buy them. Others may feel differently and that's fine by me. Just sayin' so don't nobody bother goin' all fanboy on me.

D.D.

[roscoeiii]

Yeah, "excellent" was probably overstating it. But an "excellent value"? Yes, in my experience.

[Diamond Dog]

Yeah, "excellent" was probably overstating it. But an "excellent value"? Yes, in my experience.

Fair enough, sir. Fair enough. 

D.D.

[saisunil]

For me - good power cords along with a good quality modified power outlet did the job - it is non-current limiting and clean ... I tried a $2000+ conditioner (won't mention names) - heavy / balanced etc. the system sounded more dead than alive ...

I tried one of the early power vars long time ago - it was really no where ... it just did nothing better ... I got rid of it very quickly ... that is when I discovered FIM/CRL cables ... it was not just filtering but opened my system up ...

YMMV

[jhm731]

I don't know what $1500. US will get you, but $1900. US will get you my RSA
Haley & Duke power conditioners with power cords. I'll even throw in the custom Hawaiian Ohai spiked bases.