what would you choose?

threadkiller · « **Reply #60 on:** 5 May 2012, 02:38 am »

You assume because I don't have the same reaction to the masses that the table I heard was not setup properly ?

Yes, that concerns me greatly. While it is fairly easy for most anyone to do the basic setup, I've seen several poorly setup, and from a few posts on this circle I have my doubts as well. What if something wasn't dialed in correctly? How would you discern faulty setup or bad table design?

There's nothing that hasn't been seen before on past Well Tempereds.
The real innovation is a cost-effective simplification of the original Well Tempered template.

Now here we have no need to argue or voice opinion. You are simply wrong in your assumption. Mr F has worked over 20 yrs on what finally came out as the Amadeus. Cost-effective simplication? Hell yes. Same design as earlier tables before Transparent ruined them? Hell no.
The Amadeus is light years ahead in musical performance to his other tables.
And very clearly ahead of any VPI.
That's not opinion, that's fact.
See, we are enlightened. By Bill Firebaugh.

It's still a pity we can't listen together.
It usually solves everything.

gagamut · « **Reply #61 on:** 5 May 2012, 02:50 am »

'What's really new on the Amadeus ?
There's nothing that hasn't been seen before on past Well Tempereds.
The real innovation is a cost-effective simplification of the original Well Tempered template.'

Hi,i'm a WT reference user before,now is Amadeus,and now the different is the Tonearm,the Amadeus is better than Reference,but on the other hand,i like the WT reference much than Amadeus,just table

threadkiller · « **Reply #62 on:** 5 May 2012, 02:56 am »

Agree. But the bearing-platter- motor design is better on the Amadeus as well.

gagamut · « **Reply #63 on:** 5 May 2012, 03:28 am »

Quote from: threadkiller on 5 May 2012, 02:56 am

Agree. But the bearing-platter- motor design is better on the Amadeus as well.

Hi,i like the Reference platter much than Amadeus,although it's easy to falling but the Reference platter is isolate,so may be the black ground much black(no direct compare can not sure),on the other hand i really like the DPS power supply,it's great,

vortrex · « **Reply #64 on:** 5 May 2012, 08:14 pm »

the choice has been made, I bought an Amadeus today.

threadkiller · « **Reply #65 on:** 5 May 2012, 08:45 pm »

Yippee!
Let us know what happens when you get it.

Shakeydeal · « **Reply #66 on:** 5 May 2012, 08:53 pm »

Good choice!

tricka · « **Reply #67 on:** 6 May 2012, 03:48 am »

Quote from: vortrex on 5 May 2012, 08:14 pm

the choice has been made, I bought an Amadeus today.

Congratulations - what a wonderful turntable you will be getting. Have fun!

gagamut · « **Reply #68 on:** 6 May 2012, 01:03 pm »

right choice

vortrex · « **Reply #69 on:** 18 May 2012, 04:05 am »

just set up my second hand WTA and only roughed in VTA, VTF, azimuth, and the goop level. it sounds really quite good. even at this stage of the setup I would say it sounds better than my VPI Classic 1 and that's not a knock on the VPI at all.

threadkiller · « **Reply #70 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:01 am »

So who are you apologizing to?

This isn't the board of VPI.
If you enjoy it more it's better, to you, and most of us on this particular forum.
So enjoy!

Do report back one thing, after you've had the table for a while.
Do you find yourself playing more records, not just because it's a new item, but because the music's more enjoyable, engaging, and that you didn't know your records could present themselves like that?

jshefik · « **Reply #71 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:03 am »

Wow! How did you find a used WTA? I've been following this thread with great interest as my mind was pretty made up about an Amadeus, and your reaction is icing on the cake. All that has been said here about how it compares to other really fine tables, let's me know I am in for quite a treat coming from a Music Hall mmf-7. Congratulations...What cartridge are you using?

vortrex · « **Reply #72 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:11 am »

Quote from: threadkiller on 18 May 2012, 05:01 am

So who are you apologizing to?
This isn't the board of VPI.

I'm just saying the VPI is no slouch at all! someone would be happy with either table. believe me, if the VPI was garbage (like Rega) I would say it.

vortrex · « **Reply #73 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:13 am »

Quote from: jshefik on 18 May 2012, 05:03 am

Wow! How did you find a used WTA? I've been following this thread with great interest as my mind was pretty made up about an Amadeus, and your reaction is icing on the cake. All that has been said here about how it compares to other really fine tables, let's me know I am in for quite a treat coming from a Music Hall mmf-7. Congratulations...What cartridge are you using?

I started this thread and one fell into my lap via a PM. I've had a MMF-5.1 in the past. for now I am using a Soundsmith Zephyr. there are pluses and minuses to each the WTA and VPI in my opinion, it's just that all the pluses are on the sound side for the WTA. some things are better on the VPI though, from a hardware perspective.

threadkiller · « **Reply #74 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:22 am »

Much gear looks nice... Then you hear it, and who cares.. If audiophiles bought with their ears, well, we'd almost have a different hobby.
Enjoy, and please report back your musical findings.

vortrex · « **Reply #75 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:26 am »

Quote from: threadkiller on 18 May 2012, 05:22 am

Much gear looks nice... Then you hear it, and who cares.. If audiophiles bought with their ears, well, we'd almost have a different hobby.
Enjoy, and please report back your musical findings.

I didn't mean in looks, I meant functionality.

threadkiller · « **Reply #76 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:38 am »

Hmmm. I'm confused. Sorry.
I understood hardware. Sure, the VPI is a flashier table, for most.
Functionality? Since the WTA sounds better, I'd say it's functioning better.
Right? I'm pretty daft these days, maybe I missed something.

vortrex · « **Reply #77 on:** 18 May 2012, 05:41 am »

Quote from: threadkiller on 18 May 2012, 05:38 am

Hmmm. I'm confused. Sorry.
I understood hardware. Sure, the VPI is a flashier table, for most.
Functionality? Since the WTA sounds better, I'd say it's functioning better.
Right? I'm pretty daft these days, maybe I missed something.

yeah I guess you are.

func·tion·al·i·ty/ˌfəNGkSHəˈnalətē/
Noun: The quality of being suited to serve a purpose well; practicality:

vortrex · « **Reply #78 on:** 18 May 2012, 07:09 am »

here's a list of MY observations between the WTA and Classic 1 with the Soundsmith Counter-Intuitive (you'd be crazy not to spend $50 on this).

sound - yes, in the end the most important thing and the WTA wins. better bass, more life-like, more texture, more detail, smoother, blacker background (except one thing, see below!). I thought the VPI sounded amazing, and I still think it does, the WTA just cranks it up a notch or two. it has that magic that really draws you in. I think I have reached the end of the line as far as tables go.

belt - in reference to the above post about blacker background, the belt makes noise every time that stupid knot passes around! at first I was like "what's all this static popping with no record playing?". then I turned on the light and can see it's all related to the belt. what am I doing wrong here? I can't imagine people would put up with this and not comment on it. it also looks pretty darn retarded seeing a knot and the loose ends spinning around the platter.

feet - I can't stand tables that don't have adjustable feet. my audio rack is very heavy and not easy to level out to perfection. WTA gets a minus for not being adjustable but VPI gets a minus too since the nubs on the bottom of the feet are of such a hard compound that I see it scarred my table top from twisting them.

VTA - definitely better on the VPI with the ships wheel adjustment. loosen an allen bolt, spin the wheel, and you raise and lower the arm exactly where you want it with no disruption to other settings. on the WTA you are adjusting the height of the suspension post, which also twists as you are trying to get it where you want it, not to mention messes with the height of the ball in the cup. it's also not easy to move in tiny increments.

VTF - definitely better on the VPI since you have 3 levels of adjustment. put the weight in roughly the right spot, slide the Counter-Intuitive to get it exact or very close (and be able to reference a marking where it is), then use the bolt at the end of the tonearm for ultra fine zeroing in. on the WTA you are left with only the weight and no point of reference for marking your spot.

azimuth - better on the VPI if you are doing it only by sight, but if you have a fozgometer it shouldn't matter much. again it's nice though being able to reference the markings on the Counter-Intuitive. to me it seems like it would be difficult to get the azimuth perfect on the WTA by sight. I did my VPI by sight using the supplied balance beam and an index card. I was able to get it to near perfect compared to what the fozgometer said.

cartridge alignment - man, this is one huge plus of the WTA! I have very shaky hands, especially when trying to concentrate on something, so installing carts has always been tough for me. sometimes I would spend hours trying to get it perfect. with the WTA you bolt it on and go, a matter of seconds. I thought for sure my Zephyr would run into issues with not having the right overhang since on my VPI it sits way back in the headshell. not at all, it seems to work perfect.

tonearm wiring - partially due to my shaky hands, but this stuff is scary thin. I thought for sure I was going to break it. the WTA and VPI have similar metal mini DIN connectors that plug into a jack on the table. the VPI has a better connector. it snaps in with an audible click and has a sturdier connection than the WTA. there's also marks showing you how to line it up. I'm sure the WTA is making a fine connection, but it's just kind of wiggly sitting there. not exactly confidence inspiring.

power switch - my god, how VPI can sell (and keep selling) a $2750 turntable that has a huge POP if you cut the power without being muted is beyond me. I've heard there's a $1 fix that VPI tells people to make by using a cap from Radio Shack. why would they not install this themselves? I'd sometimes forget to mute before shutting off, thankfully the WTA does not have this issue.

construction - both tables are well made with decent materials (they're not a Rega). I like the look of the VPI, but the WTA is better in person than I thought it would be. might be nice having a table where there's no chance of throwing my back out from lifting it. the VPI is a beast.

threadkiller · « **Reply #79 on:** 18 May 2012, 02:57 pm »

Well yippee...

like I said, the WTA is practical-a set and forget table, no clamp, no cueing fuss.
And since it makes one want to really play more records, it's functioning on a much higher plain than most tables.