[dap7777]

Audeze LCD-3 headphones?  Leave aside amplification for the moment.  Is the $2,000 cost justified in any sense?  Read all the reviews but cannot decide.  Is there another headphone that delivers comparable sound at a more reasonable cost?  I'm into open, over the ears style, comfortable cans with great bass.  I want it all.  I'm all set to keystroke "place order" for a pair of LCD-3's but then an inner voice tells me it's just crazy to spend that much.  Anyone care to offer a rationale for such a purchase?  dap

(how about the HE-6?)

[Tyson]

NO.  Get the Sennheiser HD800's (for a brighter sound), or the Beyer T1's (for a less bright sound).

[timjthomas]

The T50rp modded can be better than both and far cheaper!

[toocool4]

I have not listened to the LCD-3 but I have listened to the HD800, T1 and the HE-6 all are fantastic. It is hard to pick one as they all have good and bad points.
I would say the T1 is the better all-rounder as it plays with more music than the HD800.
If the music is less than perfect the HD800 will render it unlistenable where as the T1 is still as ruthlessly revealing as the HD800 but the T1 will still let you enjoy it.

The only way to really know is to go and have a listen to them all with your music, only your ears will tell you which one you prefer.

[saisunil]

If you are paying full price ... call the cable company - they have started a headphone library - borrow as many phones as you want - keep them for a week and listen to them in your own rig and then keep one ... (of course send the rest back)

I had LCD-2 - I really loved them - I sold them to a local audio buddy cause I wanted to get LCD-3 and then I had wet palms like you (I had to cancel my order) ...

I currently have recabled HE-500 - they are excellent - they are better in some ways to LCD2 but they don't have the body, warmth and bass of LCDs ...

I have heard LCD3s in show settings - hard to say anything as there were so many variables - different amps, tubes etc. etc. involved ... I think the improvements were more subtle than dramatic. The value still lies with LCD-2

I can tell you that you may be better off getting recabled HE-500 instead of HE-6 as HE-6 require a certain amp - only handful of high power amps can drive these beasts.

I think the best headphone I have ever heard was at the Woo Audio room @ NY Audio Show were the Stax 007 and 9's driven by the woo audio electrostatic amp (SE and regular) - I think was the ultimate headphone rig ...

But then I say if that is where you want to go then ... you better check

 http://smyth-research.com/

That would be an add on to your headphone rig ... 

On another note: I LOVE the HD 800 sound - I think it needs careful matching of electronics and possibly a mod to get rid of peakiness in the highs ...

I still have not heard T1 in an environment that really spoke to me ...

Again - at this price point - you better listen to them for more than a few hours and then decide ... you are also getting into the challenge of pairing the right can with the right amp and don;t forget to budget in the source ...

More than anything else - I think headphone listening is so much about the environment, comfort, ease etc. You have to be very comfortable and happy and cozy that you want to listen to it without a thought ...

In other words think - where the rig will go - on you desk?
In other words pay super attention to Rack, how you sit, comfort (head) and reach to electronics ...

[hibuckhobby]

With head-fi just as in home hifi, the question of worth is one that can only be settled by the individual.  I have Senn hd650's and Beyer DT990's...two very different phones.   I love the warmth and tone of the 650's and the transparency and space of the 990's.  The Beyers are bass heavy and have a pretty brutal peak at about 8-10k...so they need an eq.  The Senns don't go quite as deep in the bass and are more forward in the midrange.

Go with what floats your boat sonically.  That may or may not be the same thing that others like 
Hibuck....

[eclein]

  I think when your cost gets up that high your looking at differences in sound and comfort that are really very small. Like Sunil mentions and others have said you can get just about all the way there with half the investment. The HE-5's are great, my HE-5LE's are great.

  I havent heard the high end Senns or any Beyers yet but I will as they are my next targets. I recently bought a few low end Sennheisers in different types and was very surprised how good they sounded- my thought is if they sound good in the low end models the high end should be amazing. After the Senns, I'll start after Beyers....I will own someday T50P's or DT1350's because, on ear phones are excellent if done right.
 
  The Tesla stuff has interested me from the beginning but cost were keeping me away for now. Someday I'll try some. I tried AT phones in the low end and wasn't supper pumped although they are very comfy.....there are a ton of variables. I know one thing for sure I wouldn't spend that much unless I heard them first. I got a great deal on my HE-5LE's and bought them without listening to them but over $500 for me is must hear first territory.
 
  Your buying your preference in sound quality when you get down to it. Your pref. in comfort, fit etc....
Look first at what you've heard and liked not the price...you may find extreme comfort and quality of sound in phones that cost $100, $300 or $1000 and save yourself some cash instead of jumping right to 2K or more......

[JohnR]

The T50rp modded can be better than both and far cheaper!

Hm... planars for $120? I'm game.

[minimus]

A word of warning...I have had drivers fail on my LCD-2s twice in the 16 months I have owned them, even though I have used them pretty sparingly.  By Audeze's own admission, the early production runs of the LCD-3s also have had reliability problems (supposedly remedied in the latest production runs).  I know some Audeze owners on Head-Fi have complained of similar reliability issues with the Audeze drivers, although they are die-hard Audeze fans for the most part and are willing to put up with the inconvenience of repairs in return for the sound quality.  I am not as big a die-hard fan of Audeze.  I like the LCD-2s a lot, but am just as happy with the sound quality of my JH16 custom IEMs, which offer better treble extension and (importantly) have no reported reliability problems.  I also value reliability a lot.  I sunk way too much money into a beautiful sounding Singlepower tube headphone amp -- for the initial purchase, then a complete rebuild by Bolder Cable, then further repairs by a tech -- and the amp ended up as a paper weight that I finally decided to discard.  That experience left me with the distinct impression that unreliable audio equipment tends to remain unreliable, despite the best intentions of the people involved.  Mind you, Audeze now has very good, responsive customer service and they seem to be very willing to support their product.  And I have no doubt that the LCD-3s sound terrific. That said, the next time I get on the headphone merry-go-round, I will probably go with the Beyer T1s or the Senn HD800s, as I have owned headphones from both brands that were completely trouble-free. 

[santacore]

The T50rp modded can be better than both and far cheaper!

They are excellent phones for the price, and have some of the attributes of the high end phones, but they don't have the same top to bottom sound. I own a pair of modified Fostex and also have HD800's and LCD-2's. While the Fostex can be really enjoyable, they are severely lacking from 300-400hz and down. That in itself is a deal breaker for everyday listening. That said, every once in a while I pull them out and enjoy them for a day, then box them back up.

[dap7777]

Lots of good information here.  Thank you.  I have not actually listened to any phones yet- no one in my locale carries hi-end phones.  Sunil --what/where exactly is the "headphone library at the cable company"?   I need to check that out.
I had mostly written off the Senn HD800 but will seek it out for audition.  Also the Beyers. T50 rp modded sounds interesting.  However, I really wish someone owned a pair of HE-6's -- can anyone out there review it?  Thanks to everyone for great info.  TP

[JohnR]

They are excellent phones for the price, and have some of the attributes of the high end phones, but they don't have the same top to bottom sound. I own a pair of modified Fostex and also have HD800's and LCD-2's. While the Fostex can be really enjoyable, they are severely lacking from 300-400hz and down. That in itself is a deal breaker for everyday listening. That said, every once in a while I pull them out and enjoy them for a day, then box them back up.

At 10% of the price, I decided to take a chance Thing is, if it's only a matter of frequency response, that can be taken care of with EQ. So if the T50 ends up only being played via computer, that's fine with me, if it has "something else" - what I hear with (speaker) planar drivers.

I read somewhere that there were two versions of the T50, the later ones improved the bass output somewhat.

Anyway, I think this is probably OT for a thread on 2k phones...

 

[neobop]

Maybe not. This is a DIY high end, and results vary. Unlike Santicore's, mine have great bass. I use them mostly for late nite movies. Whether it's a symphony orchestra or an explosion, they do a great job. Scroll down to post #7 on this page, for Smeggy's prominent opinion. A pic of his cans is on the previous page.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/111193/orthodynamic-roundup/6675

There are quite a few threads on Head Fi for modding these. Good luck.

[adydula]

dap...

I went thru the headphone thing this past year, and went thru several sets, amps, solid state and tube and even built an amp....all that said nothing has really compared to my 2 ch setup for overall realism and quality etc...yes its subjective etc..

But good headphones that are flat in repsonse can provide many a really good experience as well...its just well 'different' for sure...its like in your head etc...

I wound up with LCD2's and would not now spend $2K "ever" on LCD3's not that they arent great...from my experience I dont think the difference is really even close to the extra $1K.

I havent listened to my cans in 3 months but did a few nights ago, and wonder why I spent what I did....it was the 'adventure' and lets see how good cans are now-a-days...

All the best
Alex

[hibuckhobby]

Should you decide to sell your LCD-2's down the road, let me know.
I listen a lot more to phones now than 2 channel, but part of that is the LOUD tinnitus I have in both ears that doesn't seem to impact the sound of phones as much as it does loudspeakers.
Hibuck....

[sandbagger]

I have heard the early proto LCD's the LCD-2's and last year at RMAF the 3's, the 3's were distinctly better than the 2's but I am not so sure I would spend the extra 1K on them.

The Sens 800's I dont care for, sound and fit, the cans are so big they feel like bookshelf speakers on my head.   Now the 600's are nice sounding and much better feel.

At RMAF this year when I could get out of my display room down to CANJAM I listened to a lot of stuff, and thought for the money you cant go wrong with the HIFIMAN HE-500's  even back to back with the HE-6's I didnt think the extra money would be well spent and rather spend it on an amp.   It was a very close decision between then and the LCD-2's

Now I just need a real nice amp, thinking of designing my own tube amp

[DaveNote]

dap7777: I understand your question, perfectly, but in various ways, it is miscast and unanswerable by other people. I presume to write this because I have been there, asked that. And I have owned a number of headphones (bought a pair yestersay), as well as headphone amps, all in addition to much high end speaker based two-channel audio. I did own the HD800 and presently own the LCD-2, as well as several other headphones.

First, you're considering purchasing what is clearly a high end item in headphone terms. There is a law of diminishing returns in high end gear, including heaphone gear. You have to spend an increasing amount of money to get small improvements. For example my main speaker-based system cost about 30 times more than a modest second system I run. The main system is better, but even I can't claim it is 30 times better. To 99.99% of the (non-audiophile) world, they would say the second system is fine and the main system pure lunacy.

Of course, the 99.99% would be right, but it is in the nature of the hobby that audiophiles are nuts, but there is perverse method to their madness. We are seeking something - the last smidgen of improvement, and the price to play is the iron law of dimishing returns.

Second, you are asking a question that ultimately is in the eye of the beholder, which you can see in the various answers you have received. Everybody has a different opinion about gear in general and headphones in particular because everyone has a different preference. For example, I thought my HD800s were great, but they sounded cold and sterile compared to my LCD-2s. I gave the HD800s away. Yesterday I bought Shure SRH750DJ headphones that sound too close for comfort to the LCD-2s at a tenth of the price (see the law of dimishing returns above). Others would disagree.

The bottom line is that only you can say which headphone satisfies your preferences, and only you can decide whether in meeting those preferences the LC-3 is worth its very high price. And if paying a lot for marginal improvements is not your cup of tea, maybe you would be better not to get into the high end hobby. Based on many years in it, I can assure you that you would be saner and richer. Happier? Maybe not so much.

But other opinions about gear are helpful in deciding what, in the absence of being able to demo headphones, might suit your preferences. So here are my comments:

1. As above, I preferred the LCD-2s greater warmth and extended bottom end to the HD800s "accuracy" and (to my ear) much justified notorious lean bottom end. Once I had the LCD-2s, I knew the HD800s would gather dust.

2. I have thought about the LCD-3s given how much I've enjoyed the LCD-2s. So far I have given them a pass for these reasons. First, my use of headphones is limited because I have such good speaker based systems, which overall I prefer to headphones. Second, given that limitation, and other (idiotic) audiophile priorities, I haven't been able to justify even to my spendthrift self spending $2K for headphones that will just not be used that much, and where the ones I have are so very satisfying.

I hope this helps.

Dave

[songlove]

I will say no, Hifiman HE-6 would be best even compared with LCD-3.
He-400 or He-500 would be at lease as good as LCD-2 as well.
 

[songlove]

I will say no, Hifiman HE-6 would be best even compared with LCD-3.
He-400 or He-500 would be at lease as good as LCD-2 as well.

Forget to mention, For HE-6, you have to get a good amp to drive it, Like EF-6, Dark Star, or just find a bargain speaker amp to drive it.
but again, try it by you own before purchasing~~~

[DaveNote]

  Your buying your preference in sound quality when you get down to it. Your pref. in comfort, fit etc....
Look first at what you've heard and liked not the price...you may find extreme comfort and quality of sound in phones that cost $100, $300 or $1000 and save yourself some cash instead of jumping right to 2K or more......

This is great advice. As my earlier post says, I like my LCD-2s and can't justify the extra grand. But there are some excellent low priced cans that give you an LCD-like sound at a fraction of the cost. I found this with the Shure SRH 750DJ, which in not in the LCD league, but has a nice rich bass and very pleasing sound. It lists for about $150 and I got mine on sale at $88. Especially good for background music listening.

Dave