[MichaelHiFi]

I was reading yesterday, one of the reasons for the original Infinity SS1 was that it's height negated room ceiling and floor boundaries or something like that.

Me thinks you should upgrade to the 9's. Marvin Gaye might show up. 

[Cheeseboy]

So we have to listen to short R & B superheroes like Stevie Wonder or upgrade to 9's?  We have mitigated that opportunity for improvement and installed a slopped ceiling from 10 ft to 16ft.  We had a Marvin Gaye sighting last month.  Ceiling boundary nodes averted.  If we did have the 9's we would surely have to invest in some bass traps.  With the Ls6 we have big boned bass.  Not yet retaining alot of water.   

[sl_1800]

I have Super V's and tried the Sonic Cap Platinums inline with the upper end amp and I could not take them at all, so harsh. I know some with say they just aren't broke in yet but I can't stand it until they do so they are staying out.

[MichaelHiFi]

I have Super V's and tried the Sonic Cap Platinums inline with the upper end amp and I could not take them at all, so harsh. I know some with say they just aren't broke in yet but I can't stand it until they do so they are staying out.

Agree, I just lived with them, forgot about them, then once they were gone, I was all smiles. I'm pretty sure mine were broken in. About 250hrs. That was enough. Not going back.

[S Clark]

I'm with hope I'm not building a set of LS9's. 

If you decide that you can't avoid going all in and building the 9's, I've got most of a set of cabinets cut out in the garage that I won't be needing.  When almost ready to start veneering, AV123 went broke and cabinets became available cheap. 
Scott

[Danny Richie]

Agree, I just lived with them, forgot about them, then once they were gone, I was all smiles. I'm pretty sure mine were broken in. About 250hrs. That was enough. Not going back.

Once they are burned in then you really shouldn't hear any adverse effect, just a shift in tonal balance. You are pulling the bottom end away from your P-Audio driver. This effects them well up into the mid-bass and lower vocals.

If the use of the cap gives you to thin of a sound in that lower range then increase the crossover point slightly on the sub amp and the tonal balance will come right back to where it was without the Platinum cap in line with your amp.

The cap protects the P-Audio driver from being over driven with low frequency and relieves your main amp of any low frequency duties or current demands.

[Cheeseboy]

If you decide that you can't avoid going all in and building the 9's, I've got most of a set of cabinets cut out in the garage that I won't be needing.  When almost ready to start veneering, AV123 went broke and cabinets became available cheap. 
Scott

If I upgraded to LS9, I wonder if my wife would notice the extra two feet in speaker height before she missed the money in the account.  That would be an interesting wager.  I'd set the odds on the speaker height.

[MichaelHiFi]

Once they are burned in then you really shouldn't hear any adverse effect, just a shift in tonal balance. You are pulling the bottom end away from your P-Audio driver. This effects them well up into the mid-bass and lower vocals.

If the use of the cap gives you to thin of a sound in that lower range then increase the crossover point slightly on the sub amp and the tonal balance will come right back to where it was without the Platinum cap in line with your amp.

The cap protects the P-Audio driver from being over driven with low frequency and relieves your main amp of any low frequency duties or current demands.

From what we heard last night out of the V's, the Sonic caps were killing the sound. It might be the way I implemented the cap by inserting it with connectors hung at either end as I didn't want to destroy the interconnect. Regardless, the wife and I agreed last night that what we were hearing some of the best Hi-Fi we've ever heard, without the caps. Maybe it was evening, too much wine, too tired, but I didn't want to go to bed. I'm sure others will have different take on what's coming out of the V's this weekend. Some good, some bad. But while we put miles on the V-Caps, the sound continues to open up and deepen. I'm anxious to see if any rooms at "T.H.E. Show" can sound this good to our ears. It's always a good reference point even though hotel rooms are challenging to set up and play well.

As I ponder the blister on my finger from pulling a hot tube out of the amp in too much of a hurry, what we have is a system that can be tailored to almost any tonality one wishes. Tube rolling on the Torii, the combinations are vast and the play within the volume controls between the amp and preamp greatly affect the dynamics, then you have the ability to dial in the low end through the plate amps. A co-worker of mine found some tubes while cleaning his office. They were OD3's. I popped them in the Torii and really like how they further tightened the bass response which to be honest wasn't a problem anyway.

And stop the press. The wife told me they sounded slightly better than our former LS6's! I need to travel north to Cheeseboy's (Steve) pad and listen to his LS6's with his Cherry amp. Bet he's rockin!

[Danny Richie]

From what we heard last night out of the V's, the Sonic caps were killing the sound.

It sounds like those caps may not be installed properly. Call me about this later when you have time.

Also, try the Low setting on the damping switch.

[Tyson]

Michael, here's something to try - point the Super V's so they point straight at the listening position.  For me, with the V2's, the sound "locks in" especially on vocals if I do this.  It's funny, I always thought open baffle speakers would be less sensitive to whether you are in the "sweet spot" or not, but I find the opposite - they are very much better when properly dialed in and optimized for that spot.

[Cheeseboy]

The late night sessions are the one where the system sings.  We were'nt rockin last night just kind of mellow.  Of course IDOL was on the stereo.  Don't get me started about the winner.  We listened to the new Paul Simon, new for us at least.  We also had bought a fresh copy of some Whitney Houston.  The deal I have with Helen is that if I have to step inside a Walmart then I'm buyin some music.

Despite all the known weakneses in my system it does sound really f-in good.

On saturday I'm looking forward to hear what got Michaels wife changing her tune.   Thank heavens MorganC is out of town.  The seat in the sweetspot will be available.

 "You gotta fill out the form, then stand in line" 

[MichaelHiFi]

Michael, here's something to try - point the Super V's so they point straight at the listening position.  For me, with the V2's, the sound "locks in" especially on vocals if I do this.  It's funny, I always thought open baffle speakers would be less sensitive to whether you are in the "sweet spot" or not, but I find the opposite - they are very much better when properly dialed in and optimized for that spot.

I haven't tried that and like you, I wouldn't have thunk that would improve the image. In fact, as the caps break in, it "feels" like the image is improving. When I switch between DAC's, the image changes in a significant way. Sort of tell me something about DAC's 

My 2 year old experimented yesterday with the volume control on the preamp. While I was in another room, he rotated it to the right, then all the way to the right. Yes, full on  It doesn't appear he had done any damage, except to himself, his 2nd timeout of his life.  I wonder if only having 26 watts per channel saved my ass, err, drivers?

I'll rotate them to face the sweet spot tonight for S & G. I think for the gathering, they'll face forward for the wider sweet spot.

[WC]

My 2 year old experimented yesterday with the volume control on the preamp. While I was in another room, he rotated it to the right, then all the way to the right. Yes, full on  It doesn't appear he had done any damage, except to himself, his 2nd timeout of his life.  I wonder if only having 26 watts per channel saved my ass, err, drivers?

Must be a pretty good kid.  My 2 yr old has had a lot more than two time outs. 

[MichaelHiFi]

Must be a pretty good kid.  My 2 yr old has had a lot more than two time outs. 

  Me thinks this is just the beginning. He's 2 on Sunday. 

[MichaelHiFi]

It sounds like those caps may not be installed properly. Call me about this later when you have time.

Also, try the Low setting on the damping switch.

Here's the link to a pic of the cap connector. My though in that to perform this mod properly, one might solder the cap(s) inside the amp at the female side of the input connectors. Adding another set of connectors to an interconnect seems like a really bad idea.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=6548#

[Danny Richie]

Here's the link to a pic of the cap connector. My though in that to perform this mod properly, one might solder the cap(s) inside the amp at the female side of the input connectors. Adding another set of connectors to an interconnect seems like a really bad idea.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=6548#

That monster cable end could be a problem too. Also, what is that little black box between the interconnect and the cap?

[Ric Schultz]

You HAVE to get rid of all those extra connectors on the output of the preamp.  After researching your preamp it looks like it has separate output transformers for both unbalanced outs and balanced outs.....so here is what to do to blow your mind:  Run your unbalanced interconnect directly from the rca jack on the preamp directly to your main amp.  If you want to re-try the Sonicap Platinum then solder it inside the main amp right on the input jack in line with the wire running to the input stage.  Then make an interconnect (or reterminate your current cable) so it has a female xlr on one end and the rca on the other.  You only use pins 2 as hot and pin one as ground.  Plug it into the balanced outs on your pre. and the other end goes to the servo amps.  Now your mind will be blown.  Now each output is driven by its own transformer and no extra connections are there at all.  That Monster two to one thang is really monstrously bad.  Another way to get a roll-off on your coax would be to not use the Sonicap on the input but make the coupling cap in the main amp smaller in value so it limits the bass.  This way you are not adding anything.  A smaller value coupling cap might sound better too.  Audience has small value Teflon caps that could work in a tube amp.  You probably need something like .05 or smaller.

[Danny Richie]

I think Ric has a really good idea.

[persisting1]

That preamp is far from inexpensive.  Hope it's not the problem.

[MichaelHiFi]

You HAVE to get rid of all those extra connectors on the output of the preamp.  After researching your preamp it looks like it has separate output transformers for both unbalanced outs and balanced outs.....so here is what to do to blow your mind:  Run your unbalanced interconnect directly from the rca jack on the preamp directly to your main amp.  If you want to re-try the Sonicap Platinum then solder it inside the main amp right on the input jack in line with the wire running to the input stage.  Then make an interconnect (or reterminate your current cable) so it has a female xlr on one end and the rca on the other.  You only use pins 2 as hot and pin one as ground.  Plug it into the balanced outs on your pre. and the other end goes to the servo amps.  Now your mind will be blown.  Now each output is driven by its own transformer and no extra connections are there at all.  That Monster two to one thang is really monstrously bad.  Another way to get a roll-off on your coax would be to not use the Sonicap on the input but make the coupling cap in the main amp smaller in value so it limits the bass.  This way you are not adding anything.  A smaller value coupling cap might sound better too.  Audience has small value Teflon caps that could work in a tube amp.  You probably need something like .05 or smaller.

You're right, there's work to be done.

Again, my thought was to move the coupling cap inside the amp chassis at the input. But you have an even better idea with a coupling cap replacing the amps cap. But being an electronic dummy, couldn't the Sonicap I have now simply replace the amps cap, wherever that might hide?

I hate ruining a perfectly expensive cable, but the tradeoff would be worth it. Another idea is that I lose the interconnect and simply run a wire from the hot position of the speaker post to the plate amp terminal jack. What would be the better solution for ultimate sound?

And the "little black box" is simply a piece of plastic meant for chassis application (shield). It's a monstrously cheap connector but understand I NEVER liked the idea of T-ing off the pre with 2 cables. As good as it sounds now, there's definitely room for improvement.

And there's nothing wrong with the pre. It's brilliant.

Thanks Danny and Ric for your insightful posts.