Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!

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James Tanner

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Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« on: 18 Mar 2012, 04:59 pm »
OK hearing aids to the rescue :scratch:

james

Don_S

Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #1 on: 18 Mar 2012, 05:10 pm »
Awsome, Bryston hearing aids.  :thumb:  James how soon will they be available?  :no_hear:

OK hearing aids to the rescue :scratch:

james

srb

Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #2 on: 18 Mar 2012, 05:24 pm »
Awsome, Bryston hearing aids.  :thumb:  James how soon will they be available?  :no_hear:

I don't think there would be physical room for the discrete analog output stage!

Steve

spinner

Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #3 on: 18 Mar 2012, 05:52 pm »
 Squared or will they be the regular power packs? I want mine in black please. :icon_lol:

Devil Doc

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #4 on: 18 Mar 2012, 06:08 pm »
I'm glad some of you find the subject so humorous. Some folks find it difficult and embarrassing to talk about their hearing affliction. You guys are making it soooo much easier for them to  talk about it.

Doc

srb

Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #5 on: 18 Mar 2012, 06:16 pm »
The OP subject title, "Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!" is a small attempt at humor in itself.  And then a few very light jokes were made about Bryston actually manufacturing a hearing aid.  I know snark and sarcasm doesn't help the cause.

Steve

James Tanner

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #6 on: 18 Mar 2012, 06:17 pm »
I'm glad some of you find the subject so humorous. Some folks find it difficult and embarrassing to talk about their hearing affliction. You guys are making it soooo much easier for them to  talk about it.

Doc

Sorry I did not realize the offence - I was asked to start a thread on the use of hearing aids while listening to an audio system. I never even considered it before so I guess I have a lot to learn :duh:

James

Laundrew

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #7 on: 18 Mar 2012, 06:20 pm »
I'm glad some of you find the subject so humorous. Some folks find it difficult and embarrassing to talk about their hearing affliction. You guys are making it soooo much easier for them to  talk about it.

Doc

We all eventually "wear-out" over time to varying degrees - just a normal part of what we know as life.

 :D

Be well...

Diamond Dog

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #8 on: 18 Mar 2012, 06:33 pm »

I shudder to think about what it would be like to lose the gift of being able to hear music. Man, we sure do take a lot for granted... 
Thanks for the wake-up call, Devil Doc. :thumb:

D.D.

S Clark

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #9 on: 18 Mar 2012, 07:26 pm »
This is a very serious issue for some of us, and I actually had a moment of hope that Bryston might really be thinking about bringing out an audiophile product. I really should have done this years ago, but I will be purchasing hearing aids sometime this year.  Although my sensitivity to midrange is equal (or perhaps for the lack of hearing above 5Khz) or superiour to most of my audiphile peers, I would like to hear the shimmer of cymbles again, or not have to strain to follow conversations in a crowded restaraunt. I've done dozens of speaker evaluations in a panel with Danny Richie and Gary Dodd.  Interestingly, although evaluations were done independently, most of our evaluation rubriks were very similar, even with similar comments.  Apparently  soundstage, imaging, and even detail are more midrange related that treble. 

Obviously, hearing aid sound quality is a huge issue for me, as I'm sure it is for hundreds/thousands? of hearing impaired music lovers.  I would be ecstatic if Bryston or any company with a grounding in music reproduction were to offer a hearing aid, and would easily reach pretty damn deep into my wallet if I could be assured of a hi fidelity product.  Without the slightest hesitation, my hearing aids would be the most important (and probably most expensive) part of my stereo system.

Scott

Photon46

Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #10 on: 18 Mar 2012, 07:50 pm »
Apparently, there is some interchange of technical r&d among audio engineers in Denmark that have worked in high end audio and hearing aid design. Denmark is a small country and I suppose the best engineers working in similar fields would have some technical cross-pollination. My wife purchased Danish Oticon high-end hearing aids and they've revolutionized her enjoyment of music. She says she hears music again like she used to many years ago. (Hearing loss is highly individual and one person's experience with aids isn't necessarily going to parallel another person's, so take her endorsement of that brand with due skepticism.)

Chromisdesigns

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #11 on: 18 Mar 2012, 08:06 pm »
Etymotic also makes hearing aid components intended for high fidelity listening.  Right now, they are apparently only used by one manufacturer, General.

http://www.etymotic.com/ha/


Chromisdesigns

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #12 on: 18 Mar 2012, 08:13 pm »
It would be interesting to do an experiment with a good headphone amp and phones combination together with a 1/3 octave equalizer to see if whether with adequate electronics you can actually flatten the apparent response.

I don't have an equalizer anymore, unfortunately, so I can't try it.  But maybe someone out there who is hearing-impaired could do the experiment and report back?  A good starting point would be the graph from your hearing test; invert it for the equalizer.

I've done a bit of reading on this subject since I got hearing aids, and apparently the problem with most current hearing aid designs is they do not really pay much attention to frequencies outside the speech range, and also the dynamic range of the ADC in the aids is not large, so they clip badly trying to boost the frequencies we have lost that are musically important, both bass and treble.
« Last Edit: 18 Mar 2012, 09:19 pm by Chromisdesigns »

S Clark

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #13 on: 18 Mar 2012, 08:34 pm »
It would be interesting to do an experiment with a good headphone amp and phones combination together with a 1/3 octave equalizer to see if whether with adequate electronics you can actually flatten the apparent response.

I don't have an equalizer anymore, unfortunately, so I can't try it.  But maybe someone out there who is hearing-impaired could do the experiment and report back?  A good starting point would be the graph from your hearing test; invert it for the equalizer.

I've done a bit of reading on this subject since I got aids, and apparently the problem with most current hearing aid designs is they do not really pay much attention to frequencies outside the speech range, and also the dynamic range of the ADC in the aids is not large, so they clip badly trying to boost the frequencies we have lost that are musically important, both bass and treble.
That's a very intereting idea...

jaylevine

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #14 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:33 pm »
Sorry I did not realize the offence - I was asked to start a thread on the use of hearing aids while listening to an audio system. I never even considered it before so I guess I have a lot to learn :duh:

James

No offence taken. I wear Widex Passion 440 units with custom ear molds when listening to my stereo. While I can function out in the real world without them, I am about 60db down from normal hearing at 7khz and above. Without these amazing units I would not be able to enjoy my second favorite pastime. BTW these units have 15 channels that are programmed for my specific hearing loss curve.

SHV

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #15 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:33 pm »
After a short look at Rx for high frequency hearing loss, it seems that the best solution with current tech is cochlear implants.  Selective amplification of high frequencies doesn't seem to overcome the problem of damage to the high frequency hair cells in the cochlea.

Steve

ted_b

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #16 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:43 pm »
This is a very telling TED presentation by a briiliant surgeon (and musician) Charles Limb.  Charles Limb performs cochlear implantation, a surgery that treats hearing loss and can restore the ability to hear speech.  But as a musician, Limb thinks about what the implants lack.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTE0MRRXNzs

We have a long way to go, but the goals are quite noble!!

SHV

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #17 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:18 pm »
This is a very telling TED presentation by a briiliant surgeon (and musician) Charles Limb.  Charles Limb performs cochlear implantation, a surgery that treats hearing loss and can restore the ability to hear speech.  But as a musician, Limb thinks about what the implants lack.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTE0MRRXNzs

We have a long way to go, but the goals are quite noble!!

Thanks for posting that link, very interesting.

Steve

JeffO

Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #18 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:30 pm »
No offence taken. I wear Widex Passion 440 units with custom ear molds when listening to my stereo. While I can function out in the real world without them, I am about 60db down from normal hearing at 7khz and above. Without these amazing units I would not be able to enjoy my second favorite pastime. BTW these units have 15 channels that are programmed for my specific hearing loss curve.

A friend of mine runs a company that makes DSP chips for hearing aids.  The capabilities of the new chips are amazing, in some ways they are more powerful than the DSP chips found in audio equipment.  As a demo they have programed one with a phone app so you can change the beamforming, equilization curve and noise reduction on the fly.  The DSP has 24 bit processing and 110 dB dynamic range so if the hearing aid manufacturer has a good implementation the audio quality can be excellent. 


jaylevine

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Re: Hearing Aids - WHAT!!!
« Reply #19 on: 18 Mar 2012, 11:03 pm »
A friend of mine runs a company that makes DSP chips for hearing aids.  The capabilities of the new chips are amazing, in some ways they are more powerful than the DSP chips found in audio equipment.  As a demo they have programed one with a phone app so you can change the beamforming, equilization curve and noise reduction on the fly.  The DSP has 24 bit processing and 110 dB dynamic range so if the hearing aid manufacturer has a good implementation the audio quality can be excellent.

Yes, and the size of these units so impossibly small you cannot tell i am wearing them. BTW the Widex have 107db of dynamic range and also have multiple programs for different situations.