[thunderbrick]

The litte bird can stand on every slippery surface you may think of, even if its angled..

You're telling me!  She (it?) usually starts the morning by landing on my head while I'm eating breakfast.  Friggin' HURTS, and that doesn't even include when she craps on me!

My wife, the one who so enthusiastically endorsed buying the 20.1s (which, BTWm are blasting Duke Ellington as I write), thinks the scratch-n'-crap game is sooooooooooo cute!  Talk about a pact with the devil!   

[SteveFord]

Does Jenny the Vulture only land, preen and dump on your head or is your wife fair game?
You must be a very good sport is all I can say - one bird crap on me and it would Frank Perdue Wants You time!

[thunderbrick]

She bough the damned pterodactyl for herself, but "lets" me do most of the work.  The bird, which I TOLD her I didn't want, decided it liked me better.  Now the wife is jealous.

I just can't win..............

[berni]

Does Jenny the Vulture only land, preen and dump on your head or is your wife fair game?
You must be a very good sport is all I can say - one bird crap on me and it would Frank Perdue Wants You time!

Had to google who Frank Perdue is, and I was thinkig about a person like this before. 
Steve and you are calling me the Impaler?  Steve the Roaster!

[SteveFord]

Frank Perdue - it takes a tough man to choke a tender chicken, ha, ha.

Thunderbrick,
I'm sure that your wife makes up for the agita so maybe make the best of a bad situation, carry an open umbrella indoors and buddy up to the mangy pigeon. 
I wonder if Magnepan makes Wash 'N' Wear stain resistant socks? 

[thunderbrick]

Enough of the damned bird, but here's an update on the Maggies.

FINALLY stayed off the road long enough to (properly) biamp the 20.1s using a vintage Dahlquist DQ-LP1 xover, my beloved Moscode 300 and a Parasound HCA 1000a for the LFs.

HOLY CRAP!  Now I know what people mean when they say the 20.1s really sing with more/better power.  Bigger soundstage, depth, height, clarity, bass, you name it.  I'm playing Chris Isaak's "Heart Shaped World" CD LOUD and don't feel fatigued.  Can't wait to try an LP!

[berni]

Great!!
So you decided to blow the bird away with raw power? 

[Emsquare]

FINALLY stayed off the road long enough to (properly) biamp the 20.1s using a vintage Dahlquist DQ-LP1 xover, my beloved Moscode 300 and a Parasound HCA 1000a for the LFs.

HOLY CRAP!  Now I know what people mean when they say the 20.1s really sing with more/better power.  Bigger soundstage, depth, height, clarity, bass, you name it.  I'm playing Chris Isaak's "Heart Shaped World" CD LOUD and don't feel fatigued.  Can't wait to try an LP!

I assume you are now driving the bass panels direct off of the HCA1000a? IMHO, there is something special about connecting the amplifier get a direct hold of that bass panel for the first time. It is not subtle. There's a difference between getting kissed by your aunt (eh) and getting to kiss the hot girl from school. There's just no going back after that.

And you named a mighty fine CD to relate the experience with. Lots of low frequeny overtones, and resonances as rich as butter on that disc. I've been archiving old music for a couple of years and I appreciate that one. I just recently realized I had no Hot Tuna in the rack. This oversight has since been addressed. One of the best live shows I've ever seen was Jorma Kaukonen and Jack Casady playing an amplified acoustic set. Holy cow, it was good.

[SteveFord]

Funny you should mention Hot Tuna as I just went on a Hot Tuna vinyl buying spree.
I got to listen to Burgers and Double Dose first thing this morning which was a good way to kick off the weekend.
Four more are en route so maybe they'll show today which would be perfect.

[mn2hifi]

For most folks the 20.1s are going to be favored over the 3.7s.  I love Maggie speakers.  Started with IIBs then kept my IIIAs for over 20 years eventually bi-amping them with 2 Audio Research D400mkIIs and a Marchand 3-way XO.  Made an amazing difference.  I also use 2 Velodyne 12 in powered subs.  Even got my father MMGs and he loves them.

The only real issue I have ever had with Magnepan ribbons is that you could always tell where the panel mids ended and the ribbon took over.  With the 3.7 that problem has virtually ended. 

So in my case I had a chance for 20.1s but passed and am enjoying the 3.7s.  They are a steal IMO
Having said that I have 20.7s on order so hoping for best of both worlds

[jimdgoulding]

Funny you should mention Hot Tuna as I just went on a Hot Tuna vinyl buying spree.
I got to listen to Burgers and Double Dose first thing this morning which was a good way to kick off the weekend.
Four more are en route so maybe they'll show today which would be perfect.

Steve- I hope you scored Hot Tuna recorded live at The New Orleans House in Berkeley (RCA) and, if so, remember ole Jim's recommendation of Mann's Fate (end of side B) when you hear it.  Unheard of sympathetic playing this side of a few jazz pairings.

[SteveFord]

I have two copies of it on CD but not on vinyl - yet.
Sundazed put out a 180gm version which is up next on my music purchase list.
My favorite Hot Tuna album is still First Pull Up, Then Pull Down which I've listened to countless times since Junior High School.
It was only three years ago that I saw where the title came from: those paper toilet set protector dispensers that you find in public rest rooms.  I burst out laughing when I read it...

[a.wayne]

Would love to hear the 20.7, as I have yet to hear a 20.1 and was impressed , for some reason they just never ever sounded right, 3.6 /3.7  not so ....

 

[tberd]

Would love to hear the 20.7, as I have yet to hear a 20.1 and was impressed , for some reason they just never ever sounded right, 3.6 /3.7  not so ....

 Don't be too quick to blame the speakers. Most guys rooms are waaaay too small for them. Maggies of all models are magic "with the right sized room". Talking about the SMGA's all the way up.

 Years ago I demo'd a pair of heavily used, beat up SMGA's that were 15 plus years old at that time. They were in a large lobby of a local high end shop. I repeat, large lobby that was rather circular in shape. They were sitting on a display shelf maybe 6 inches off the floor with their back about 6-8 inches from the back wall. Not an idea setup for Maggies at all. Speakers were driven by a USED solid state $299 Denon receiver that was rated at 115 watts into 4 Ohms. Cheap CD player, junk interconnect and so on......  The sound at volume level 2 was like Sting himself was singing right there in the room. You could close your eyes and swear he was in the room with you. Jaw dropping system to say the least. It was so good, other sales clerks and customers soon gathered in amazement. I would have to say that was one of the best systems I've heard. BTW, they had the used SMGA's priced at $300 then, LOL. And no they weren't all modded out with fancy caps or anything. Socks had never been off of them. That was my first Maggie experience.

 To be honest, I have the 20.1R's. My room currently is also WAAAY too small from them. The dealer I bought mine from had the older 20's in a much larger room - that blew mine away. I've got better electronics than he does. I'm running ALL tubes with full class A single ended triode monoblock amps. Dealer has me in room size and I've got him in gear. He wins hands down. So my opinion it's not the speakers or gear connected to them, it's all about the room.

tberd

[medium jim]

SET & 20.1's  

Jim

[Goosepond]

Hi tberd,

About a year ago, I jumped on the Maggie bandwagon blind as hell. 

I bought a pair of MG12QR's, fulled modded with outboard Xovers and the Mye stands. I've been won over by them and all my other speakers have been sitting on the sidelines ever since. And I know my room is too small for them! 

But right away (blame it on the forums), I got the itch for the 3.7's or a used pair of 3.6's. I've resisted so far, but who knows.

So I'd be interested in your explanation of what you feel you're hearing (or missing) with your monster 20's in a room too small for them.

I tried to convince myself that it didn't matter. I wanted the big guys and all I could do was listen to them where they were (and smile  ).

Thanks,

Gene

[thunderbrick]

tberd, where are you located?  Can you borrow different/bigger amps?

I've settled in with my 20.1s but have the itch to upgrade amps and my two most trusted sources are telling me two different things.    

Anybody drive 20.1s with Odyssey amps?

'brick

[tberd]

Hi tberd,

About a year ago, I jumped on the Maggie bandwagon blind as hell. 

I bought a pair of MG12QR's, fulled modded with outboard Xovers and the Mye stands. I've been won over by them and all my other speakers have been sitting on the sidelines ever since. And I know my room is too small for them! 

But right away (blame it on the forums), I got the itch for the 3.7's or a used pair of 3.6's. I've resisted so far, but who knows.

So I'd be interested in your explanation of what you feel you're hearing (or missing) with your monster 20's in a room too small for them.

I tried to convince myself that it didn't matter. I wanted the big guys and all I could do was listen to them where they were (and smile  ).

Thanks,

Gene

 The 20.1R's sound good don't get me wrong. They just need more air volume to sing into. Kind of like test driving a Ferrari in a parking lot??? That larger room allows the sound to be more holographic and spacious if you will. It's more realism that doesn't strain the room far as walls vibrating and corner loading of bass. All those boundry effects and reflections small rooms have that larger rooms get by with.


 I'd recommend you demo a pair of larger what ever model Maggies in YOUR room before you buy. You can try Band-Aids like bass traps and other room treatments. Sorry but a larger room gets you ahead of the game. How many concert halls, auditoriums or movie theaters have bass traps or room treatments? The room shape and design takes care of most of it. Non parallel walls is where it's at.

tberd

[josh358]

Hi tberd,

About a year ago, I jumped on the Maggie bandwagon blind as hell. 

I bought a pair of MG12QR's, fulled modded with outboard Xovers and the Mye stands. I've been won over by them and all my other speakers have been sitting on the sidelines ever since. And I know my room is too small for them! 

But right away (blame it on the forums), I got the itch for the 3.7's or a used pair of 3.6's. I've resisted so far, but who knows.

So I'd be interested in your explanation of what you feel you're hearing (or missing) with your monster 20's in a room too small for them.

I tried to convince myself that it didn't matter. I wanted the big guys and all I could do was listen to them where they were (and smile  ).

Thanks,

Gene

Goosepond, can't speak about the 20.1's, but in my experience there are a number of problems with a small room:

1. Imaging -- the further Maggies or just about any speaker are from surfaces, the larger the acoustic space they can reproduce. You also get fewer side effects like the image wrapping around where the front wall meets the side walls. This can be ameliorated to some extent with diffusers, but they have a low WAF. The listener should also, ideally, be far from surfaces. Absorption is needed when you have to sit close to a wall.
2. Coloration -- early reflections color the sound.
3. Bass emphasis -- if you put a big planar in a small room, the midbass will be elevated. This can be fixed with EQ.
4. Uneven bass -- this again is true of any speaker, actually less so of dipoles like Maggies. Small rooms have uneven bass. They do, however, have a lot of it.

The other plus of small rooms -- low power requirements.

In my experience, anyway (and that of some others).

[josh358]

The 20.1R's sound good don't get me wrong. They just need more air volume to sing into. Kind of like test driving a Ferrari in a parking lot??? That larger room allows the sound to be more holographic and spacious if you will. It's more realism that doesn't strain the room far as walls vibrating and corner loading of bass. All those boundry effects and reflections small rooms have that larger rooms get by with.


 I'd recommend you demo a pair of larger what ever model Maggies in YOUR room before you buy. You can try Band-Aids like bass traps and other room treatments. Sorry but a larger room gets you ahead of the game. How many concert halls, auditoriums or movie theaters have bass traps or room treatments? The room shape and design takes care of most of it. Non parallel walls is where it's at.

tberd

Tberd, I empathize since my room is also too small. Have you tried acoustical treatment, in particular, diffusion? It can make a room acoustically larger.

BTW, most acousticians reject non-parallel walls these days, except in very special circumstances (e.g., reflection-free zones in studio control rooms). They don't have much effect on bass modes, and they make the room unpredictable. They do help with slap echo but slap echo is easy to cure in any room. I built a number of studios with non-parallel walls back in the day, then stopped doing it when I realized it wasn't worth the trouble.