[daimbert]

Hello everyone,

I wanted to get your opinion on which DAC to purchase. I currently I have the Touch feeding into the Warpspeed Optocoupler, which acts as volume control, going into my Quad 12L Active speakers (unbalanced).  I just need a DAC to take my system to the next level. Balanced outputs are not necessary considering the optocoupler only has unbalanced and I honestly have not grounding issues.

So my budget is around $1000. The top three DACs I am looking at are the Eastern Electric Minimax Plus, The Rega DAC, and the Burson D160.

So what you think? Which dac would work well with my current system and which I could keep well into my future upgrades?

Thanks

[Big Red Machine]

You want this one!  $1150.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=102735.0

[mitch stl]

I'd suggest you add the Channel Islands DAC to your list. They are $600 new (or $800 if you add the upgraded power supply).

Great reputation for performance from a solid company.

[radarnyc]

Just keeping things in scale (<$1000 in speaker/amplification), you might want to consider spending a lot less on you DAC. Try to Schiit Bifrost at $349.

[lcrim]

The OP asks for a rec for DAC that is less than a thousand dollars and the very first post suggests a DAC that is $1150.
The online reviews for the Schiit Bifrost @ $350 are quite good.  The Audio-gd NFB 3.1 @ ~$350 is well thought of. Cambridge Audio has just announced the Dacmagic 100 @ $400.
Personally I have 2 Touch w/ the Bolder Cables Analog mod and w/ that and the Soundcheck 3.0 TT mods, the sound is quite good. 
Larry

[Big Red Machine]

Maximize your investment.  Wasting your time with $300 dacs is jut going to keep the carousel spinning.  Nail it out of the gate with an awesome dac and be done with it!!

[JoshK]

Maximize your investment.  Wasting your time with $300 dacs is jut going to keep the carousel spinning.  Nail it out of the gate with an awesome dac and be done with it!!

x2....

[Gopher]

The OP asks for a rec for DAC that is less than a thousand dollars and the very first post suggests a DAC that is $1150.
The online reviews for the Schiit Bifrost @ $350 are quite good.  The Audio-gd NFB 3.1 @ ~$350 is well thought of. Cambridge Audio has just announced the Dacmagic 100 @ $400.
Personally I have 2 Touch w/ the Bolder Cables Analog mod and w/ that and the Soundcheck 3.0 TT mods, the sound is quite good. 
Larry

Most people arbitrarily set a budget, but i think the majority of us can find a hundred bucks for an upgrade that would be substantial.  Whether hes interested in my dac or not, i agree with brms advice to do it right.

[charmerci]

You want this one!  $1150.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=102735.0

Can he first buy the Eastern Electric Minimax Plus then later get it upgraded by Wayne?

[keenween]

I'd suggest you add the Channel Islands DAC to your list. They are $600 new (or $800 if you add the upgraded power supply).

Great reputation for performance from a solid company.

This is what I use with the Squeezebox 3 and I've always really enjoyed the upgrade, but I haven't felt the need to try any other dacs for comparison, so my experience is limited.

[ajayrav]

Can he first buy the Eastern Electric Minimax Plus then later get it upgraded by Wayne?

I don't believe Wayne will mod an EE Minimax plus, since the manufacturer has indicated that they didn't want him to do so.  The original MiniMax DAC, can be purchased used, and subsequently modded by Wayne.  But, as always, it is best to ask him directly.  The mods on the original EE DAC were with the blessing of Eastern Electric....

Ajay

[roscoeiii]

Daimbert,

All you mention would be good choices. I might also add the Wyred4Sound DAC1 to that list. But I think it will likely come down to auditioning these in your system. Synergy is very important. I'd start looking into what your audition/return policy options look like. Depending on where you are located there may be some AC members around with one or another of these DACs.   

[gooberdude]

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=102286.0


The thread above has a good list of dacs.  And i agree with both sides of the fence on this topic.

I have a Tranquility dac & want something better, I also want multi-input to handle more sources. OP - I am right where you are on the decision process, but 1 year down the road...

At this point i'm splitting the middle & having the Tranquility modded and just bought a Grant Fidelity tube dac-11 for $325.  I also wanted a spare preamp or would've gone with the audio-gd  dac recommended above.

If you're only going to have one dac though, spend as close to your $1K budget as possible IMHO.  My new cheap dac is for non-music sources like cable tv box & PS3 for movies. 

There's an Ultra-Fi 41 dac for sale here somewhere for $850, includes usb cable.  This or Gopher's look like the best AC deals going.  Too bad audiogon is gonna be foobared a while longer, used to be a good resource.

EDIT: Just noticed OP has the WS optocoupler, all the more reason to feed it the best signal possible.  It is so transparent & wonderful, I've had mine only a few months. Build your system to mate with it and you should end up with a phenomenal system.  Definitely do not buy a $300 dac initially, or...buy both & send one back after a thorough demo. Due to the WS, you will not want to own gear with distortion, hiss, hum, stale/strident sound or insufficient power supplies.  The WS should never be the weak link in the signal chain, making it easier to identify components that are.

[daimbert]

Hello everyone,

Thanks for the advice.  I usually research and buy and keep things for quite awhile. I have been saving up quite awhile and want to just purchase something that has multi inputs, sounds great and will hold its values fairly well if down the line I'd like to upgrade to something different. But most importantly, I also would like to have a product that will grow with my system as I slowly upgrade different areas.

I'm quite confident that whatever I buy will better than what I have but wanted to get good advice from good people.

Thanks

[Stu Pitt]

People threw out recommendations that I think are a bit absurd due to the fact that you haven't stated what you're looking for sonically.  I'm pretty sure everyone recommended what they had, except for the guy recommending what he's selling.

I'll recommend what I have - Rega DAC.  My ears tell me it's the best DAC at $1k and it'll take something along the lines of the Bryston BDA-1 at over $2k to make a worthwhile difference.

If I think it's the best, it must be the best, right?

Seriously...  Let us know what you value sonically - not just tight bass, pleasant mids and clear highs (everyone wants that) - and I'm sure some of can make a meaningful recommendation. 

[daimbert]

Stu Pitt,

You are absolutely right. Maybe this will help. I am a studio musician and play trumpet, bass, guitar, and drums. If I had to name what I was looking for sonically it would have to be realism, placement, soundstage, and musicality. It's a lot I know  I want to feel like Clifford Brown is with me and want to feel the power of the orchestra playing Mahler fifth. Detail is nice but cohesiveness is more important to me. For instance, I have heard the Benchmark Dac and had listening fatigue in five minutes. I found it too analytic and plain boring.

II listen to music all day long, don't even own a television, and listen to an extremely wide selection of music from Mahler, to tabla music, acoustic, and rap. I would like to own a Dac, at a reasonable price, that will allow me to go to a concert in my home.

Hope that made sense.

[firedog]

Check out the Musical Fidelity MF 1 DAC (recently upgraded model) - good sound for the price: $700

Also the CEntrance DACmini  - $795; and the Peachtree Dac -iT ($495).

All get reviews as good sounding and good values.

[avta]

I use an Anedio dac with a Touch. ( www.anedio.com ) My system includes Quicksilver Silver 88 mono tube amps and Harbeth Compact 7 speakers. This dac has a volume control and remote which I like. Anedio allows for a 30 day in home trial so you can get a feel for it's sound in your system. I've been quite pleased with it in general. They recently introduced a newer version of their dac as well as a usb>spdif converter. The new dac is a bit higher in price but likely some better although I have not heard it.

[rollo]

Stu Pitt,

You are absolutely right. Maybe this will help. I am a studio musician and play trumpet, bass, guitar, and drums. If I had to name what I was looking for sonically it would have to be realism, placement, soundstage, and musicality. It's a lot I know  I want to feel like Clifford Brown is with me and want to feel the power of the orchestra playing Mahler fifth. Detail is nice but cohesiveness is more important to me. For instance, I have heard the Benchmark Dac and had listening fatigue in five minutes. I found it too analytic and plain boring.

II listen to music all day long, I do not believe you can find a DAC under $1000 [ unless used ] that will satisfy your desires. The only musical DAC that I believe a musician may like is the MF M-1. Add a Pangea outboard power supply for $100 and for $899 your in. Best part if purchased from Music Direct you get a thirty day return policy.
    I'm with you on the Benchmark. Lean and and over detailed. Personally I have tried most of the lessor costing DACs and to my ears they just have too many tradeoffs. If I were you save your pennies until you can buy a more sophiticated DAC.
    If not the M1 just might hit the nail on the head for you. Just remember when considering any new component the affect on the character of the existing system. We want to have synergy with that not against it.


charles

[Stu Pitt]

Daimbert,

I've heard a lot of DACs at and below the $1k mark.  The Rega DAC was the only one that did everything I wanted.  Some of the budget DACs were quite good for the money, but they sounded like budget DACs to my ears.  The Cambridge DACMagic gets a ton of positive press, and it's for very good reason, but IMO it just can't compete with something along the lines of the $1k DACs, but then again it shouldn't be expected to.

People love the Musical Fidelity gear.  To me, every MF piece I've ever heard sounded too Hifi and just flat out boring.  Some call it Musical Fatality, and I whole heartedly agree.  It does everything right except carry a tune IMO.  A lot of people will get bent out of shape about that, but that's just my opinion.

The Benchmark is a great DAC in a lot of ways, but I think it's too bleached sounding.  If I was mastering music and needed to hear every single imperfection, I'd use it, then use something else to give it a final listen.  It certainly wouldn't be a sit down with a Guinness and listen to some tunes DAC for me.

I bought the Rega DAC for a lot of reasons.  To my eats, it makes sense of music better than any digital source I've owned and heard within my budget.  For example, Hendrix's Little Wing is one of my favorite songs.  Through everything else, it's a sonic mess.  It sounds congested, uncohesive, compressed, and so on.  Not through the Rega.  It's hard to describe, but to me it just sounds right.  It makes total sense of what's going on.  I used to only be able to listen to it once before I was tired of it.  The first time I heard it through the Rega, I listened to it 4 times in a row to make sure I was really hearing what I was hearing.  In Metallica's Orion, which is an instrumental track, there's 2 bass guitar solos that a lot of people mistake for guitar solos.  I knew they were bass solos, but they never truly sounded like bass.  With the Rega, it's pretty obvious to me that it is in fact a bass guitar.  Even the Benchmark didn't make it sound real.  That's contrary to the Benchmark's claim to fame.

The Rega DAC isn't the most detailed, biggest soundstaging, etc. DAC out there.  It does more than an acceptable job at these things, but it doesn't draw attention to itself through them.  It sounds slightly warm and smooth, but not artificially so.  It sounds natural to my ears.  I think it sounds like a very good turntable.  A very good turntable isn't overly warm, lush or romantic sounding.  What great turntables do is give a great sense of cohesiveness, weight, and groove to music.  They've got a swagger to them; a presence.  The Rega DAC has all that to my ears.   I'm a vinyl fan, but I'm not one of those 'vinyl is always better' or digital sucks' guys.  I think vinyl conveys a musical message that most digital gear misses on.  The Rega DAC's got it IMO.  Not because Rega's claim to fame is turntables, but because it's got it.  My Rega Apollo had it too, but the DAC takes it far further.

Tone Audio's Jeff Dorgay compared the Rega DAC's sound to the Rega P9.  He didn't give specifics though.  I think he's absolutely right in his assessment, but would have liked him to elaborate on why.  Maybe he hears what I hear in it, or maybe he hears something else.

The Rega DAC has does something nothing else in my system has done - it got my wife's attention.  She didn't know I bought it (not that I sneaked the thing in).  The first night I had it was the first time I saw my wife's foot tapping to the music.  When I turned it off, she asked why I turned it off.  She asks me to play some music on a somewhat regular basis now.  Not that that should validate my agruement, but it gives a basis to it.  She's no audiophile, and she's never asked to to turn the stereo on until after I had the Rega DAC.  I guess it just sounds like music should sound to her.  I haven't asked her about it nor pointed this out to her.

I'm not trying to push the Rega DAC on you.  Just giving you some insight into it.  The rest of my system is a Bryston B60 integrated amp, Audio Physic Yara Evolution Bookshelf speakers, and an Apple TV gen 1.  All files are stored on the ATV's internal hard drive, and are Apple Lossless.  No high-res, and I use optical, as that's the only digital out on the ATV.

Music Direct has the Rega DAC and has a 30 return period.  They have several others too.  If you're interested in it, this may be your safest bet.

I didn't hear the Eastern Electric DAC, as I'm not big on messing with tubes.  I've read that it's warmer and smoother than the Rega, which may be too much to my ears.  I've heard the Peachtree stuff.  It sounds pretty good, but I can't get into them.  They just sound like they're trying to hard to my ears; too hifi not not groovy enough perhaps?  The Wired 4 Sound stuff is pretty good, but it doesn't do much for me.  Can't put my finger on it.  A lot of people like the DACs in this paragraph, and for very good reasons.

I haven't heard the Burson DACs, so no comment.

I could elaborate more on the Rega DAC, but I feel I'm rambling.  Hopefully I didn't sound like some fanboy.