Leaving your hi-rez bubble... It hurts.

Pez · « **on:** 7 Dec 2011, 06:44 pm »

Do you ever find yourself listening exclusively to hi rez material? There have been weeks where I do nothing but listen to hi rez. Sometimes though I have to come up for air and listen to other music in my collection... It always makes me a little sad. I love my other music, but it just doesn't sound as great for the most part. I mean I LOVE hi rez through my SB and redbook still sounds damn good, but it doesn't sound utterly beautiful like hi rez.

As a comparison I was listening to Dire Straiits 'bros in arms' 20th anniversary SACD ripped o 24-176 vs a very good redbook remaster. It was like listening to a bad MP3 vs listening to good redbook as far as the difference between the two. It's quite staggering when I take it into context. I have been listening to redbook for years... As a matter of fact I've been listening to it EXCLUSIVELY for my entire stint in Hifi. I've always appreciated vinyl and other formats, but redbook has been my mainstay for the most part.

Now that I have a decent hi rez collection it is difficult to listen to anything else non-critically even. It just sounds... not mind blowing. Any one else have this experience?

ted_b · « **Reply #1 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 07:20 pm »

Yes! That's why i started this Circle.

Seriously, I have had the same feelings. Lately, with newfound DSD capability, i have been enamored with that sound..like native 24 bit recordings...just too real and musical and tonally accurate. Going back to redbook shows those "breath of life" aspects to be in short supply sometimes....not always, but sometimes!

santacore · « **Reply #2 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 07:41 pm »

Yes, agreed!! It's tough going backwards.

Rclark · « **Reply #3 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 08:05 pm »

Oh man this is gonna be expensive. There's no Amazon.com "buy used" button for hirez.

S Clark · « **Reply #4 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 08:06 pm »

Since utilizing the HAL MS-1, my cd listening is way down, but I still find vinyl to be a very high quality option to Hi Rez. My vinyl hours have probably gone up.

TONEPUB · « **Reply #5 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 08:29 pm »

just get a really good digital player...

saisunil · « **Reply #6 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 08:46 pm »

What alternatives are there for high rez music?
With CDs one can buy used and sell them ... I have at least a hundren good cds that I no longer listen to - I can trade them ...

Hi-Rez music, as it is, is quite expensive - with no option to sell ...
I am on the fence and would like a safe way to get into high rez - yes I have bought one album and downloaded some free / sample high rez music and I like what I hear ...

Thanks

mca · « **Reply #7 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 08:55 pm »

Quote

ust get a really good digital player...

Like?

Freo-1 · « **Reply #8 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 10:29 pm »

Quote from: mca on 7 Dec 2011, 08:55 pm

Like?

For example, a Modwright Oppo BD-83/93/95 with all the mods. I've got a BD-83SE Nuforce with solid state mods, XLR out, which is very good. SACD sounds outstanding with this.

I've also got a Eastern Electric DAC Plus, which is easily one of the best sounding DACs available. Feed it anything at or above 24 bit/48 khz, and enjoy the ride.

Tyson · « **Reply #9 on:** 7 Dec 2011, 10:59 pm »

Quote from: saisunil on 7 Dec 2011, 08:46 pm

What alternatives are there for high rez music?
With CDs one can buy used and sell them ... I have at least a hundren good cds that I no longer listen to - I can trade them ...

Hi-Rez music, as it is, is quite expensive - with no option to sell ...
I am on the fence and would like a safe way to get into high rez - yes I have bought one album and downloaded some free / sample high rez music and I like what I hear ...

Thanks

Amazon has a bunch of hirez SACD's for sale for less than $10/disc. Mainly classical and jazz.

targa02 · « **Reply #10 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 03:41 am »

Like Pez, I often find myself listening only to my hi rez collections. The Redbook stuff sounds flat in comparison.

Rclark · « **Reply #11 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 04:35 am »

I would like to pay $5-$10 per album, with $10 being a new release. Someone pass that along.

wisnon · « **Reply #12 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 09:30 am »

What are you guys talking about?

I have some rbCD compilations that I have passed on to pals and they all keep asking me if they are hi-rez!!!!

Running rbCD thru my lampizator DAC (via modded SB Duet or CD digital out), I miss NOTHING versus, SACD or special hi-rez/XRCD/Gold CDs. Yes, I do switch back and forth and yes I have over 100 SACDs and higher rez discs.

There is a LOT more buried in rbCD if you have the right kind of DAC and transport to cleve it out. The death of rbCD standard is greatly exaggerated.

Maybe I am missing something here?

ted_b · « **Reply #13 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 02:43 pm »

Wisnon,
Are you really wondering what we are talking about, or is your comment facetious? We are talking about information on the disk that is sometimes 100x the quantity of redbook. Often these higher resolutions offer way more musical information, much more richness, much better tonality than redbook (and sometimes they don't). No one here has said that all redbook is bad. Some of my fave recordings (and 90% of my library) are redbook. But I am surprised that some natively recorded hirez discs don't sound better than redbook on your system. It makes little sense, like saying all 480i DVDs are better than any 1080p BluRay. Yes, some can look great on the right display, but math is math. I'd check other aspects of your system to see what is keeping good hirez from reaching its natural potential.

I agree 100% that the death of redbook is greatly exaggerated, but you going way beyond that and are saying also that nothing is missing from all your rb vs hirez. That I am wondering about.

BobRex · « **Reply #14 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 02:53 pm »

Quote from: ted_b on 9 Dec 2011, 02:43 pm

Wisnon,
Are you really wondering what we are talking about, or is your comment facetious? We are talking about information on the disk that is sometimes 100x the quantity of redbook.

(Please turn on ironic humor filter here)

100X????? Gee, not going too far into hyperbole are we Ted? I could have accepted 75%, maybe even 82%, but c'mon, a HUNDRED TIMES BETTER?????

Just how do you measure that?

(filter off)

ted_b · « **Reply #15 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 03:07 pm »

Quote from: BobRex on 9 Dec 2011, 02:53 pm

(Please turn on ironic humor filter here)

100X????? Gee, not going too far into hyperbole are we Ted? I could have accepted 75%, maybe even 82%, but c'mon, a HUNDRED TIMES BETTER?????

Just how do you measure that?

(filter off)

Bob, please read my post. Show me where i said that. I didn't say 100x better, I simply said 100x the data (2x DSD is 128x the data of 16/44.1k, period...it is).

Let's stay civil, people.

BobRex · « **Reply #16 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 03:55 pm »

Ted,

You're right - I misread quantity as quality. I apologize.

lokie · « **Reply #17 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 04:33 pm »

I have about100 SACD's and they are gathering dust. I made the decision a couple of years ago to maximize my rbcd listening due to pure economic reasons.

Here's the math: $20 to $40 for an SACD versus $5 for rbcd. FWIW, I also listen to allot of web radio.

My ears are so conditioned to my Audio Note DAC that when I listen to hi rez it sounds a little harmonically funny (not funny haha but funny as in a little strange). Certainly not as holistic. On some sacd's, for example Beck's Sea Change it sounds really cool. I think because he uses so much digital sampling that it is just more copacetic with the higher rez presentation. But on most music I am preferring the AN "presentation" of a more wall of sound (best way I can describe it but probably not very accurate). The SACD's kind of separate the sound in a a hard to describe way. i used to think it was more detail but..?? Let me just say this, when I listen to rbcd's through the AN DAC I don't pay attention to the quality of the sound, I just get immersed in the performance. With the SACD's I'm always thinking... that sounds kind of cool or... , wow, that sure was sparkly. It's almost a left brain versus right brain kind of thing.

Without getting into an argument with people a whole lot smarter than me about all things digital, I would have to say that I'm not convinced that running the music through more math equations and algorithms is going to make it better. it will make it different but better? And maybe you like the difference but I'm not convinced.

Having said this, I'm still not selling my sacd's and am thinking of getting an sacd player again... maybe a sacd/blue ray.

ted_b · « **Reply #18 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 04:40 pm »

Quote from: lokie on 9 Dec 2011, 04:33 pm

I have about100 SACD's and they are gathering dust. I made the decision a couple of years ago to maximize my rbcd listening due to pure economic reasons.

Here's the math: $20 to $40 for an SACD versus $5 for rbcd. FWIW, I also listen to allot of web radio.

My ears are so conditioned to my Audio Note DAC that when I listen to hi rez it sounds a little harmonically funny (not funny haha but funny as in a little strange). Certainly not as holistic. On some sacd's, for example Beck's Sea Change it sounds really cool. I think because he uses so much digital sampling that it is just more copacetic with the higher rez presentation. But on most music I am preferring the AN "presentation" of a more wall of sound (best way I can describe it but probably not very accurate). The SACD's kind of separate the sound in a a hard to describe way. i used to think it was more detail but..?? Let me just say this, when I listen to rbcd's through the AN DAC I don't pay attention to the quality of the sound, I just get immersed in the performance. With the SACD's I'm always thinking... that sounds kind of cool or... , wow, that sure was sparkly. It's almost a left brain versus right brain kind of thing.

Without getting into an argument with people a whole lot smarter than me about all things digital, I would have to say that I'm not convinced that running the music through more math equations and algorithms is going to make it better. it will make it different but better? And maybe you like the difference but I'm not convinced.

Having said this, I'm still not selling my sacd's and am thinking of getting an sacd player again... maybe a sacd/blue ray.

If you are listening to your SACD's via the Audio Note you are listening to the cd layer (unless you rip to DSD like me). If you are listening to your SACD's via your SACD player then apples vs ashtrays (common SACD player's analog outs are probably $1.10 worth of materials). The math I'm talking about is not upsampling ("I would have to say that I'm not convinced that running the music through more math equations and algorithms is going to make it better. it will make it different but better? And maybe you like the difference but I'm not convinced.") as you are describing. There is no "manipulation" for true hirez material on a hirez DAC, only for redbook that the DAC upsamples to 24 bit.

Pez · « **Reply #19 on:** 9 Dec 2011, 04:54 pm »

Quote from: lokie on 9 Dec 2011, 04:33 pm

On some sacd's, for example Beck's Sea Change it sounds really cool. I think because he uses so much digital sampling that it is just more copacetic with the higher rez presentation.

It's funny you say that. To my ears Sea changes SACD is not any better than the standard redbook version. Yet for some reason the DVDa version of the same album sounds much better. As far as the problems you seem to be having with your SACD collection I definitely agree with Ted. There has gotta be something going on with your player. It's not that SACD runs more algorithms as you out it, there is just plain more infomamtion. You can hear the timbre of the way instruments ,especially cymbals, improve drastically with hi Rez.