[vegasdave]

Very glad you like my suggestion - its from experience 

Dave - Do it already!

I don't have the second amp! And I was planning to upgrade to a 14B or 7Bs?

[Rod_S]

I don't have the second amp! And I was planning to upgrade to a 14B or 7Bs?

I think probably the more noticeable upgrade would be to go for more power. I would go for 2 7B SST².

[vegasdave]

Ok, thank you. Sounds good. However, I'm entertaining the thought of bi-amping with 2 14Bs.

[Rod_S]

Ok, thank you. Sounds good. However, I'm entertaining the thought of bi-amping with 2 14Bs.

Dang! That would be the best of both worlds, lots of power and bi-amping, that will sound sweet. What speakers are you using? Something to keep in the back of your mind if your speakers are capable of handling 1000+ watts is to consider just a single pair of 28B-SST². Two of these will be in the same ball park as 2 14B-SST^s price wise. This would be an interesting scenario, would a pair of 28B-SST²'s sound better than bi-amping with a pair of 14B-SST²'s. I don't think this situation has come up here before and it would be great if people could give their thoughts to help you out.

[vegasdave]

Dang! That would be the best of both worlds, lots of power and bi-amping, that will sound sweet. What speakers are you using? Something to keep in the back of your mind if your speakers are capable of handling 1000+ watts is to consider just a single pair of 28B-SST². Two of these will be in the same ball park as 2 14B-SST^s price wise. This would be an interesting scenario, would a pair of 28B-SST²'s sound better than bi-amping with a pair of 14B-SST²'s. I don't think this situation has come up here before and it would be great if people could give their thoughts to help you out.

Oh yeah. I plan on getting B&W 801Ds. This is just on the drawing board. My first move is to get the 801Ds and 1 14B to start out with. That's a good question. What I plan to do is go with the 2 14Bs, and go active with the 10B crossover. This is the grand plan. It'll probably take at least 2-3 years (or possibly more) to come into fruition.

[Rod_S]

Oh yeah. I plan on getting B&W 801Ds. This is just on the drawing board. My first move is to get the 801Ds and 1 14B to start out with. That's a good question. What I plan to do is go with the 2 14Bs, and go active with the 10B crossover. This is the grand plan. It'll probably take at least 2-3 years (or possibly more) to come into fruition.

801D's, very nice. They can definitely use the power, those and the 800D and 800 Diamonds are all rated up to 1000 watts, aparantely the 15" driver is very power hungry. They require a fairly big room too. You should be able to get a really good price on them now that they have been discontinued for a couple years, probably in around the price on the new 802 Diamonds, maybe even a bit less. I see them pop up on Audiogon every now and again.

[vegasdave]

801D's, very nice. They can definitely use the power, those and the 800D and 800 Diamonds are all rated up to 1000 watts, aparantely the 15" driver is very power hungry. They require a fairly big room too. You should be able to get a really good price on them now that they have been discontinued for a couple years, probably in around the price on the new 802 Diamonds, maybe even a bit less. I see them pop up on Audiogon every now and again.

Exactly. I hope so. Well, they shouldn't be more than $10,000-$12,000 since the new price was $18,000. If the price is gonna be the same as a new pair of 802 Diamonds, then the 802 it is. I'd rather have new than used.

[Rod_S]

Exactly. I hope so. Well, they shouldn't be more than $10,000-$12,000 since the new price was $18,000. If the price is gonna be the same as a new pair of 802 Diamonds, then the 802 it is. I'd rather have new than used.

Ah, $18,000, I must have been thinking of the price for the 800D, yeah you should definitely be good with picking up a pair of 801D's in the $10,000-$12,000 range. As for the 802 Diamonds, I can definitely vouch for them, I love mine but they certainly will not give you the bass response you would get from the 801D's. I am giving some serious thought in getting additional 802 Diamonds when it comes time to upgrade my surrounds. Originally I thought I would be fine with 805 Diamonds (save money and it takes up a small foot print) but I have since come to the conclusion that I do not want such an expensive speaker on a stand that might get knocked over. I then moved onto being torn between four 804 Diamonds or four 803 Diamonds for my side and rear surrounds, the 804 is a good bang for the buck in the Diamond serious and the 803 would be able to keep up with my 802's in their frequency respponse. It's going to be a real tough decision when the time eventually comes around.

[vegasdave]

Oh no problem! I wonder why B&W discontinued them. That's cool, but is the bass good? No need for a subwoofer?

Yeah, I don't care for bookshelf speakers. For the reason that you cited and more.

Hmm...yeah, that sounds tough. Can you compare the 2 side by side?

[Rod_S]

Oh no problem! I wonder why B&W discontinued them. That's cool, but is the bass good? No need for a subwoofer?

Yeah, I don't care for bookshelf speakers. For the reason that you cited and more.

Hmm...yeah, that sounds tough. Can you compare the 2 side by side?

I think the reason for them being distcontinued was poor sales, at least that's what the speculation was at the time the new generation Diamond products launched, along with the 801 B&W also stopped producing the HTM1, SMS and D8S (I think that's what the model was).

Not to use a subwoofer, that falls into one of those personal preference categories. I look at it like the whole why use a center channel speaker debate that pops up every now and again when you can set the system to phantom image the center channel data between the mains. I tried that once and although it does work quite well it's not perfect and there are errors and my ears and bain immediately told me somethings not right. My take on the subwoofer thing is, and this is my opinion of course there are very few loud speakers made that can accurately produce the very bottom of the frequency spectrum like a dedicated subwoofer can so in most cases you can always benefit from having a subwoofer. Now, use of the speakers also comes into play, if you are only going to be using the 801D's for stereo music I would say you should be fine without a sub because I would think it's safe to say most most music doesn't go down much below the frequency range of the 801D's. There are many people who don't use subs with the 801's, 800's and even 802's in stereo setups. If you intend to use the speakers in a multichannel home theater environment then I would definitely be using a sub. I would never want the LFE signal mixed with the mains. The LFE signal can often dip well into the teens and in some cases below that and if you really want to feel the impact of that then that's when you need the sub.

Presently I can't compare the 804 or 803 Diamonds to my 802's because my dealer just has a pair of 804S speakers. If he ever gets a pair of 804 Diamonds in and puts them on demo, or a pair of 803 Diamonds I know he would have no problem with me taking them home for a week to try out.

It's now looking like I may have some 805 Diamonds in my future after all. I see Lexicon has announed their next SSP, the MP20, which will be a 12.4 channel processor with speakers 8-12 being 5 heights so that would be a good use of the 805 Diamonds

[vegasdave]

Wow, poor sales? That's hard to believe. I mean it's the 801, a classic! But it is a very big and bulky speaker. So maybe that came into play. My room isn't real big so maybe the 802 would be a better fit after all.

Thanks for the info on subwoofers. I found that interesting.

Well, that sounds good. A home trial is the best for obvious reasons.

Oh ok, well do what you think is best. You have a Hell of a system regardless.

[Rod_S]

Oh yeah. I plan on getting B&W 801Ds. This is just on the drawing board. My first move is to get the 801Ds and 1 14B to start out with. That's a good question. What I plan to do is go with the 2 14Bs, and go active with the 10B crossover. This is the grand plan. It'll probably take at least 2-3 years (or possibly more) to come into fruition.

vegasdave;

I just noticed a pair of 801D's just went up on Audiogon http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?spkrfull&1320026083&/B-W-801-D-

[Mad Mr H]

Dave - Use one 14B and a pair of 7B , Don't (my opinion) Bi amp with a pair of 14's.

The 14 is seen as a pair of 7's in one box, But this is not 100% correct...............

Technically a pair of 7's are higher spec than a 14.

Can you hear this? (Simple answer) on the bass yes, noise floor yes.

On my 2ch I am currently running 4B SST HF, 14B SST Mids, 2x7B SST bass (PMC BB5's active)

(Also allows you to get the 7's right up to the speakers, again an audio advantage)

RE: 800 vs 801.......

.....a long time ago...........When I first got involved with hi end systems many studios used B&W 801's as mains. I was a child and did not really look into the range (pre web). Local stores would not have the hi spec kit........ So I always "thought" the 801 was the top of the range........

Took me a long time to find out the 800 was top (Nautilus very top) of the range.

As I leant more / tested / tried etc speakers the compliment of drivers in the 800 / 802 is in my opinion better than the 801's.

I believe the 801 may have been developed for studio/BBC use where additional bass may have been required / requested (use of a seperate sub in todays world) . For me the 800 / 802 is the better design.

Tannoy / PMC and many others follow this driver compliment. Tannoy in the "Buckingham" series (which I also have) 2"/10"/2x12" . PMC with the use of the "XBD" in the MB2 / BB5 systems.........TWO of the same size bass driver...........This concept has many technical advantages over one larger driver.

Hope thats of help / use.

Andy.

[Rod_S]

Wow, there seems to be a run on used 801D's Dave, there is another pair up on Audiogon now, this pair is black

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?spkrfull&1320280634&/B-W-801D-