[Kevin Haskins]

As an owner of Consonance gear Droplet CDP and TT I can assure you that these Chinese products are very well made and perform flawlessly.
  As I said before its the PRICING that has gone up nothing about quality. One can purchase a lemon from ANY country. since I mentioned Consonance lets look at their pricing. In the US a SET mono block is $5800 new. In Hong Kong its less than half. Why ? IMO the distributor/dealer here jacks the price up to be competitive with gear on the same sonic level.
  IMO if Chinese gear was priced as it COULD be much more would be sold. All I'm saying is that it is NOT the bargin it used to be. I bought mine in China for much much less. shipping was a killer though, so with shipping total cost was STILL less than half.

Well.... without the distributor, how would they sell and support the product? 

[lazydays]

As an owner of Consonance gear Droplet CDP and TT I can assure you that these Chinese products are very well made and perform flawlessly.
  As I said before its the PRICING that has gone up nothing about quality. One can purchase a lemon from ANY country. since I mentioned Consonance lets look at their pricing. In the US a SET mono block is $5800 new. In Hong Kong its less than half. Why ? IMO the distributor/dealer here jacks the price up to be competitive with gear on the same sonic level.
  IMO if Chinese gear was priced as it COULD be much more would be sold. All I'm saying is that it is NOT the bargin it used to be. I bought mine in China for much much less. shipping was a killer though, so with shipping total cost was STILL less than half.

I actually have one of their 2.0 turntables, and got it for $1700 new off Audiogon. Compaired to my final tool it's OK at best. But it's better than a lot of junk out there. Bought it because I could use an SME arm with it, and it would take two arms like the Final Tool. Still it's not too bad a table once you get it ironed out.
here's what I found:
* motor is noisey, and there's not much you can do with it
      a. they used metal pulleys on the motor that had the grooves cut very nice, but maybe a touch too narrow for my needs
      b. the motor on/off switch is mounted ontop of the motor, and is of poor quality
      c. tach on the servo motor is poor quality, and is not adjustable
* table used monofilment fishing line for a drive belt. I tried several other things but the pulleys didn't like it. Later  
      went with a silk/kevlar blend thread. Really helped it out a lot
* platter spindle bearing was way too rough, and the bearing itself left a lot to be desired. I fixed all this myself
* turntable base and arm brackets are prone to picking up feedback and vibrations from motor.
* bolt holes for tone arm mount were not right, and the threads were poor quality (loose)
* platter had run out (not a lot but still it shouldn't be there) Also the bearing that takes up the thrust from
      the weight of the patter was poorly finished. I relapped it, and went with a ceramic bearing instead of the grade
      grade100 ball bearing (the ceramic bearing is a grade 10)
Now with the Final Tool all I did was set it up and play music. Both tables are good tables, but didn't know I'd have to rebuild it right out of the box. The samething could have been said of the Technics turntables. Just level them and setup the tonearm.
    I'm not really down on Chinese gear, but think you get what you pay for. And for the price of a $5800 monobloc (I hope it's two) I think there's a lot better stuff out there for less change
gary

[Vic Trola]

All:

What a great thread and except for the political gumbo, well worth the read.  I am obviously biased about Chinese gear, but not here to promote it.  You can get some great deals on USA made gear if you loo a little deeper. I blogged about this twice: once in a blog entitled "The New Economy" and once in a blog entitled "Systems of the Uninvited" 

Getting great gear at great prices is what it is all about - no matter where it comes from. This is the paradigm that will save this hobby and keep it from falling further into the abyss.

Sorry about the blog promotion, but this topic is a passion of mine! I will gladly remove my post if there are complaints.

[lazydays]

All:

What a great thread and except for the political gumbo, well worth the read.  I am obviously biased about Chinese gear, but not here to promote it.  You can get some great deals on USA made gear if you loo a little deeper. I blogged about this twice: once in a blog entitled "The New Economy" and once in a blog entitled "Systems of the Uninvited" 

Getting great gear at great prices is what it is all about - no matter where it comes from. This is the paradigm that will save this hobby and keep it from falling further into the abyss.

Sorry about the blog promotion, but this topic is a passion of mine! I will gladly remove my post if there are complaints.

I use Odyssey amps and their preamp. I've yet to ever see or hear anything from China would ever come close to the sound or build quality. The samething can also be said about their preamp. My amps (except for the transformers a wire) are all made right here in the USA for less that $3K. My preamp (except for the tubes) is all US made, and as far as I'm concerned Hong Kong will have to reinvent the wheel to come close to it. Surprise all those three pieces cost me about $4200!
gary

[woodsyi]

I use Odyssey amps and their preamp. I've yet to ever see or hear anything from China would ever come close to the sound or build quality. The samething can also be said about their preamp. My amps (except for the transformers a wire) are all made right here in the USA for less that $3K. My preamp (except for the tubes) is all US made, and as far as I'm concerned Hong Kong will have to reinvent the wheel to come close to it. Surprise all those three pieces cost me about $4200!
gary

I use ASL (China), Acoustic Reality (Denmark) and Crown (USA) amps on my system.  I have not heard anything from just one country that work better than this combo. 

[max190]

Getting great gear at great prices is what it is all about - no matter where it comes from. This is the paradigm that will save this hobby and keep it from falling further into the abyss.

Vic, good to see you here sir.  Hope all is going well at Pacific Valve.
Very satisfied customer here with my (2) purchases.
Thanks for tip regarding the GE 6189's in my Bada 222.  The midrange opened up, and the amp has more authority in the bass dept.

[stereocilia]

I hope this isn't a stupid question: are there any American cd or dvd players?  I know there are American companies who make cd players, but aren't all the transport mechanisms built and designed elsewhere?

an Ayre is 100% U.S. made
gary

I thought Ayre uses a TEAC (Japanese) transport mechanism...?

Nobody can confirm?

[martyo]

I hope this isn't a stupid question: are there any American cd or dvd players?  I know there are American companies who make cd players, but aren't all the transport mechanisms built and designed elsewhere?

an Ayre is 100% U.S. made
gary

I thought Ayre uses a TEAC (Japanese) transport mechanism...?

Nobody can confirm?

Don't you think at times people confuse made and assembled.
I would say a unit is made in the USA if it was designed, engineered, and assembled in the US. I believe there are components in Hi-fi gear that are no longer even made in the US. Unless they are using what is considered a domestic auto; at least 75% of the parts manufactured in North America and assembled in the US.

I'd be willing to bet that the "Japanese" TEAC drive mechanism has parts from all around the Asia rim.

[lazydays]

I use Odyssey amps and their preamp. I've yet to ever see or hear anything from China would ever come close to the sound or build quality. The samething can also be said about their preamp. My amps (except for the transformers a wire) are all made right here in the USA for less that $3K. My preamp (except for the tubes) is all US made, and as far as I'm concerned Hong Kong will have to reinvent the wheel to come close to it. Surprise all those three pieces cost me about $4200!
gary

I use ASL (China), Acoustic Reality (Denmark) and Crown (USA) amps on my system.  I have not heard anything from just one country that work better than this combo. 

I have a couple small Wave Eights in my bedroom that have had several upgrades done to them. Also keep one ASL preamp stashed away as a spare (it's also had several upgrades too). I had this old but nearly new Conrad Johnson PV10AL line stage laying around, and switched it into the system. The ASL preamp is now catching dust. I have a grand total of $521 in that preamp, and it had just came back from the factory for a complete rebuild. The Wave Eights are fine for the room I use them in, but think I'm gonna replace them soon with Quicksilver 25watt monos. The speakers are a pair of the last Dennis Had Built Soliloquys, and like them for the price ($435). Still My downstairs amps are a lot better (which they ought to be better). When your talking about $5K+ amps/preamp combos; the Odyssey will smoke them everytime.
gary

[lazydays]

I hope this isn't a stupid question: are there any American cd or dvd players?  I know there are American companies who make cd players, but aren't all the transport mechanisms built and designed elsewhere?

an Ayre is 100% U.S. made
gary

I thought Ayre uses a TEAC (Japanese) transport mechanism...?

Nobody can confirm?

Don't you think at times people confuse made and assembled.
I would say a unit is made in the USA if it was designed, engineered, and assembled in the US. I believe there are components in Hi-fi gear that are no longer even made in the US. Unless they are using what is considered a domestic auto; at least 75% of the parts manufactured in North America and assembled in the US.

I'd be willing to bet that the "Japanese" TEAC drive mechanism has parts from all around the Asia rim.

according to Ayre all the componets are made in the USA. The new Odyssey Kissmets are all made in the USA except for the Gronenberg wire, and Canadian built transformers. My mono blocs are all US made except for the transformers and wire. (transformers are German as well as the Gronenberg wire). The units are had assembled in Indianapolis as is the cases.
gary

[lazydays]

I hope this isn't a stupid question: are there any American cd or dvd players?  I know there are American companies who make cd players, but aren't all the transport mechanisms built and designed elsewhere?

an Ayre is 100% U.S. made
gary

I thought Ayre uses a TEAC (Japanese) transport mechanism...?

Nobody can confirm?

No they don't. There was a discussion about this over on the Asylum a few months back. The old transport is no longer being made (it was made in the United States) and production was actually shut down till they found a new one. It also is made in the USA. The data came right from the owner of the company
gary

[woodsyi]

I have a couple small Wave Eights in my bedroom that have had several upgrades done to them. Also keep one ASL preamp stashed away as a spare (it's also had several upgrades too). I had this old but nearly new Conrad Johnson PV10AL line stage laying around, and switched it into the system. The ASL preamp is now catching dust. I have a grand total of $521 in that preamp, and it had just came back from the factory for a complete rebuild. The Wave Eights are fine for the room I use them in, but think I'm gonna replace them soon with Quicksilver 25watt monos. The speakers are a pair of the last Dennis Had Built Soliloquys, and like them for the price ($435). Still My downstairs amps are a lot better (which they ought to be better). When your talking about $5K+ amps/preamp combos; the Odyssey will smoke them everytime.
gary

I have heard a Stratos and a Candela before.  They are good and musical, but I prefer the sound of my Hurricanes/Modwright (at least $5K) combo in my room.  I am sure it's a personal taste thing.  So much of this hobby is about personal (relative) preferences after a certain level.  Don't you think?  I am just not comfortable making absolute statements about any gear.  So to set the record straight, you will have to modify your statement to every time minus one in the smoke department. 

[martyo]

I am sure it's a personal taste thing.  So much of this hobby is about personal (relative) preferences after a certain level.  Don't you think?  I am just not comfortable making absolute statements about any gear.

That's a refreshing statement, I totally agree woodsyi.

[Brown]

Just remember 90% of our hobby is 10% mental. Thanks Yogi.

[stereocilia]

I hope this isn't a stupid question: are there any American cd or dvd players?  I know there are American companies who make cd players, but aren't all the transport mechanisms built and designed elsewhere?

an Ayre is 100% U.S. made
gary

I thought Ayre uses a TEAC (Japanese) transport mechanism...?

Nobody can confirm?

No they don't. There was a discussion about this over on the Asylum a few months back. The old transport is no longer being made (it was made in the United States) and production was actually shut down till they found a new one. It also is made in the USA. The data came right from the owner of the company
gary

Thanks.  I wonder if Ayre is the only one using a U.S. made transport. 

[lazydays]

I have a couple small Wave Eights in my bedroom that have had several upgrades done to them. Also keep one ASL preamp stashed away as a spare (it's also had several upgrades too). I had this old but nearly new Conrad Johnson PV10AL line stage laying around, and switched it into the system. The ASL preamp is now catching dust. I have a grand total of $521 in that preamp, and it had just came back from the factory for a complete rebuild. The Wave Eights are fine for the room I use them in, but think I'm gonna replace them soon with Quicksilver 25watt monos. The speakers are a pair of the last Dennis Had Built Soliloquys, and like them for the price ($435). Still My downstairs amps are a lot better (which they ought to be better). When your talking about $5K+ amps/preamp combos; the Odyssey will smoke them everytime.
gary

I have heard a Stratos and a Candela before.  They are good and musical, but I prefer the sound of my Hurricanes/Modwright (at least $5K) combo in my room.  I am sure it's a personal taste thing.  So much of this hobby is about personal (relative) preferences after a certain level.  Don't you think?  I am just not comfortable making absolute statements about any gear.  So to set the record straight, you will have to modify your statement to every time minus one in the smoke department. 

we're talking different animals when speaking of a Stratos amp compaired to something that cost twice as much. Try a pair of Mono SE's or better yet a pair of mono blocs with the glass cieling upgrade. With either of them; it'll be off to the hockshop or Audiogon with them.
gary