[kevin360]

Okay Steve,

Here's another photo, which shows a little more than the previous one (the one a couple of posts up illustrates the absolutely perpendicular relationship between the panels and the side walls). Actually, this photo is inaccurate, because I nudged the 3.7s a little closer to the side walls a few days after taking it. The speakers completely disappear and the room's apparent dimensions swell, but there is still specificity to points in space from which the sounds seem to originate. I don't get the sense of exaggerated scale, but it gets enormous with certain types of material. If the imaging weren't stunning enough, the frequency balance also seems to have improved.

There are a few others who have been fiddling with this setup and we all (so far) find it intoxicating. I had to move my 3.7s a little closer to the front wall in order to get them this close to the sides. My speaker cables limit my 3.7's distance off the front wall to 8'7", which seems fine to my ears.

[jimdgoulding]

Looks like good distance from the wall behind plus you have some diffusion going on back there.  I know what that can do for both stage depth and atmosphere.  That stuff is important to me, too, as I listen to lots of music made on location.  Moving one's chair forward can give a taste of this plus a little added width.  Or, further away, of that.  Bet your sound is wonderful.

[pelliott321]

I recently moved my speakers wider.

from about 4 feet apart (inner edge measurement) and straight ahead to

about 6 feet apart and toed in quite a bit.  Room is 12 feet wide.
I am liking the change but after a couple of weeks I will probably
start moving them closer together very slowly

[sparky62]

Hi, my name is Jim and I am also trying the HK/Limage setup.  Being a lurker, I had read about the HK/Limage a few years ago and like Kevin I dismissed it for breaking to many established rules.      
 
Having the good fortune of a dedicated listening room, I set about taking the spikes out of the Mye stands for easier repositioning, swapping tweets, moving my 3.6s out from the front wall, hoisting my amp onto a dolly to move along with the speakers and moving my listening chair back.  The Maggies are 9’ out from the front wall and less than 1’ from the side walls.  I have yet to get the panels to 40-50% or find the "cathedral" spot, but I like what I am hearing.  The sound stage is absolutely intoxicating!

Since there has not been a single detractor of the setup I do want to post some minor issues that I hear with my system in my room.
There is a slight hollowness (cupped hands) to the overall sound.  I am planning on moving some absorptive panels around and adding diffusion to see if I can reduce this effect.

While I hear what others have mentioned with regard to the frequency balance (good), It feels just a bit on the loose side.  This is probably the panel resonance.  I also hear a slight loss in detail now that the ribbons are pointed straight ahead.  Again, I can live with this, just mentioning what my ears are hearing.

This is a setup that everyone should try compared to the “traditional” setups.  I urge you to try it at least once.

[SwamisCat]

Hi Jim,

I too have been using a Limage set-up for most of the last year. Originally I had a pair of MGIIIa's, and for the past two months a pair of 3.7i's.

In comments over at the Asylum, I too have shared that there are cons as well as pros in my room with the Limage. The pro is absolutely amazing holographic soundstage and depth. For me the biggest negative is what I referred to as a minor lack of "snap" to the sound. This may or may not be the same as your "hollowness" and loss of detail.

When I move the speakers to a more traditional position (say six feet from FW rather than eight to ten) the sound gets more snappy and concise. The Limage is more ethereal.

I have yet to be able to get the best of both worlds -- the snap and dynamic realism of traditional and the holographic soundstage of Limage, and I have tried virtually every placement option imaginable, including reversing the panels (playing them backwards, which is extremely beneficial for older models).

One other tradeoff people may face with Limage is mid or upper bass. In my room, Limage even when extremely close to the SW, provides more lower bass and less in the upper and middle. I solved this with DWM panels.

All this said, I prefer the Limage positioning. It is just that , as you suggest, there are tradeoffs in at least some of our rooms.

[MickeyBoy]

Hi SwamisCat,

Could you tell us the differences in going from the IIIa to the 3.7s? That is a path I am considering. Thanks,

MickeyBoy

[SwamisCat]

I am planning on reinserting the IIIa's in the system next week to refresh my memory. I might even do a mini review of the upgrade, if anyone is interested.

The obvious differences are:
The III's have considerably more low bass. No contest.
The 3.7i's might have better bass though, with more impact in the mid and upper range (I will need to verify my memory is correct)
Highs are pretty similar.
Imaging, soundstaging and depth are quite similar.
Midrange is substantially and clearly superior in just about every way on the 3.7. Less glare, less grain, less (or no) gritty Mylar sound.

It did take about a month of constant playing before the new ones broke in. Until then imaging was terrible, but now it is fine.

After I switch back, it will be interesting to see what else jumps out at me.

[sparky62]

This is another one of those "I can't believe the change that was made" posts.

But... I today I moved my HK/Limage set up 3.6s 1/2" away from the side walls and I could easily hear what I would call a smoothing of the bass response.  Originally they were at 9" from the side walls and I felt the low end (below 40-50Hz) was a bit over bloomed.  Just that 1/2" move started to smooth the bass region.  So I moved another 1/2", and then another and now things are much more even sounding as a bass player moves around the fret (or fret-less) board.

My take on this is that the close proximity to the side wall that the HK/Limage set up uses can make larger than usual differences in positional changes.

The best news is I am listening to soo much music and loving what I'm hearing.   

[brooklyn]

I’ve been using the MMG’s for a while now and before I got them in there permeant location I had tried
them closer to the side walls but not exactly like the HK/Limage set up. What I heard was a hole in the center of the two speakers, I didn’t hear anyone mention that on this thread, did no one experience that with the HK/Limage setup or did I miss something?

[sparky62]

Brooklyn,

In my room (15'w x 36.5'l) my center image was very light when I first brought my 3.6s perpendicular to the side walls.  It was much improved when I moved my listening chair back from 9' to 14' (from the plane of the speakers).  At first I tried to maintain my near-field distance, but that was not satisfactory.  The center fill was not enough, singers were not solidly there.  I moved back and added some corner reflective/absorbent panels.  Center fill is not as up front in your face, as the more conventional setups can be, but the size and depth of the imaging more than makes up for any center lightness.

I am not done with the HK/Limage setup.  I still want to move the 3.6s forward into the 40%-50% range to find Mr. Lee's room tuning magic.  I have to move some more furniture first, to let me move my listening chair back farther... maybe this weekend.

[SteveFord]

They're also using much larger panels than the MMGs so that will do it.
You might want a DMW or CC3 in the center or maybe both?

[brooklyn]

Thanks Steve and Sparky for clearing that up. I spent a lot of time trying to setup my speakers
to sound there best and they do sound pretty darn good to my ears now in there present position.

I would like to try a small sub or the Maggie bass panel at some point but that will be a question
for another post.

I do appreciate the response.