[jackman]

Yeah. I loved watching Jordan too. My grandparents, who never really got into watching basketball, changed when they started watching Jordan. I used to go to my grandparents' house and hang out, have dinner, and watch games with them, especially when it came to playoff time. Ah.......great memories.
For the longest time, I'd say Jordan was the greatest (easily of that era) and most definitely in the conversation of greatest ever. His influence on the game and even on sports in general is unparalleled. I must admit, now, I think Lebron is better. I think Jordan and Lebron are about equally gifted athletes except in terms of size. In a game of one on one, Lebron would back Jordan down into the paint and win that war the majority of the time........but, it'd still be an extremely close game.
I've always heard that some of the best basketball ever played was the stuff none of us ever got to watch ; The first Dream Team's practices. I don't know how true this is, but in an interview, Magic said Jordan once got mad in practice and dunked on David Robinson and put his arm into the hoop ala Vince Carter style. Even if this wasn't totally true, it isn't entirely out of the realm of imagination. To be a fly on the wall......Can you imagine?

Lebron is a monster talent and I've become a fan.  He is bigger and stronger than Jordan, and he plays great defense.  Jordan was a killer, and I don't think Lebron could have stopped Jordan offensively in his prime.   One thing is certain, I'd rather see the ball in MJ's hands at the end of the game when you need a big shot.  That's when Jordan took over and Lebron often disappears. 

[RDavidson]

I remember watching a couple of Lebron's high school games on ESPN.  It was obvious then that he was one of those rare talents where there was no way he would be a miss at the top pick of the NBA draft.  I don't see that extra something in any of the highly touted college players yet.  Wiggins can jump through the roof but so could a lot of other young guns that were supposed to be the next big thing.  Jabari is awesome but to me he looks like a Paul Pierce clone.  Randle and Smart are great but they don't have that "something" like Lebron had.  Plus, what's with beating teams by 40 points and celebrating a dunk like you saved the earth from the apocalypse.  Does that irk anyone else?

I am not a huge NBA fan anymore but I do love the "Michael Jordan".  I often sit and think about what it would be like to pull players and teams from history to put against each other now.  I'd almost trade my dream stereo system to see Michael Jordan's Bulls play Lebron's Heat.  I would have to include in that package Lebron's Heat against Barkley's Suns and Malone's Jazz.  I don't think Lebron could overcome the truly great NBA players from the 90's.  When I think a young gun is good I think about how Barkley and Kemp used to leap to the rim.  When I think about scorers I think about Bird and Reggie shooting three-pointers.  When I think about real big men I think about centers like Hakeem, Robinson and Ewing dropping buckets from 15 feet away.  I think the league is watered down and people don't know it.  I will however admit, I am wrong most of the time.

I can see the Jabari / Pierce likeness. Pierce would put up a quiet 20-25 points at KU regularly by the time he was a junior. He became such an effortless shooter (scorer), and a great overall athlete. I haven't been able to figure out who Wiggins reminds me of yet. He's MUCH more than a great leaper, though all his highlights are dunks. The kid has a pro level jump shot and is ridiculously fast. He has the foot speed and ball handling ability of many smaller guards. He's excellent on defense as well, and a great shot blocker. I think he and Jabari both will eventually be NBA stars.

I love the Jordan, Bird, Magic, Malone, Robinson, Barkley, Ewing, Olajuwon, Miller, Stockton, Thomas, Abdul-Jabbar, Kemp, Payton,...............and on and on........years as much as the next guy, but today's game is different than back then. Back then you had a lot more traditional players and thus more traditional basketball. Jordan was probably the first completely successful of the "new breed" of super athletic "hybrid" players. He could play guard or forward. It didn't matter. Many of todays great / elite players are the same way. It is how the game has evolved. To be elite, players cannot be 1-2 dimensional and dominate just one position anymore. For example : A player of Kevin Durant's size, back then, would've been pegged as a center or forward. We all know he's obviously more gifted than that. The guy is nearly a 7 footer and can run the court, handle the ball like a guard, and can shoot the three in anyone's face. Same goes for Dirk Nowitzky. It's just the evolution of the players and the game that we're seeing and are having a hard time adjusting to. If you took today's greats versus Jordan era greats, I honestly don't know who would win. That's tough, as I am definitely biased as well, but my gut is telling me that today's greats would win.

[launche]

Lebron is a monster talent and I've become a fan.  He is bigger and stronger than Jordan, and he plays great defense.  Jordan was a killer, and I don't think Lebron could have stopped Jordan offensively in his prime.   One thing is certain, I'd rather see the ball in MJ's hands at the end of the game when you need a big shot.  That's when Jordan took over and Lebron often disappears. 

I will just say that the whole Lebron disappearing thing is a false narrative.  It may have applied in a instance or two but I think it was mostly a media thing.  Certainly not now if you have watched him in past two years he's there down the stretch attempting to make the right plays.  I hope he never falls victim to feeling like he always has to take the final shot, continue to make the best play.  The Jordan stuff was great but it ushered in a whole generation of ball hogging, shoot first and last players that it's taking decades to recover from and hopefully Lebron is ushering in a new era.

Personally after seeing that game 6 in Boston in few years ago, I said I will rarely question this guys closing ability or so called killer instinct or whatever.  That was as so called Jordan-like as I've ever seen and ranks with the best of my Jordan memories.  When Lebron seems to just say screw it, watch out win or loose it's a nice watch.

Step Curry is also must see TV when he has it rolling. Always loved his game and glad to see him having success at this level.

[RDavidson]

I will just say that the whole Lebron disappearing thing is a false narrative.  It may have applied in a instance or two but I think it was mostly a media thing.  Certainly not now if you have watched him in past two years he's there down the stretch attempting to make the right plays.  I hope he never falls victim to feeling like he always has to take the final shot, continue to make the best play.  The Jordan stuff was great but it ushered in a whole generation of ball hogging, shoot first and last players that it's taking decades to recover from and hopefully Lebron is ushering in a new era.

Personally after seeing that game 6 in Boston in few years ago, I said I will rarely question this guys closing ability or so called killer instinct or whatever.  That was as so called Jordan-like as I've ever seen and ranks with the best of my Jordan memories.  When Lebron seems to just say screw it, watch out win or loose it's a nice watch.

Step Curry is also must see TV when he has it rolling. Always loved his game and glad to see him having success at this level.

Agree about Lebron. The guy is really amazing and only time will tell how his career pans out and how it compares to Jordan's. The media loves to blow up anything even remotely negative these days. And sadly, people love to see stars fall. I really don't get it. I can't stand most of the so-called "news" in our country. Anyway.....sorry for the rant.

I somewhat agree with what you're saying about the "shoot first" mentality inadvertently caused by Jordan. The thing is, Jordan's team mates and coaches relied on him to make the big plays, and he often did BECAUSE HE COULD. This is no different than what was expected from guys like Wilt Chamberlain or Bill Russell. Now we have somewhat of a slew of very good players that are put into that same position, but just can't do it as well as some of the greats. So they look like ball hogging failures, though they're just doing their jobs. After all, that's why these star players get paid the big bucks, not the medium bucks, right? They are supposed to be the guys the team leans on in pressure situations. Think about it. Wouldn't you love to have a guy, like Jordan or Kobe or Lebron, who can finish a game for you reliably? I think the answer is "yes" as you already referenced Lebron in game 6 vs Boston. Is this ball hogging or using one's rare gifts to take over a game? Sometimes taking over a game IS "the right play" when certain talented players are feeling it, but there are only a small few who can and should do this at times.

Step Curry is very fun to watch. What an amazing shooter and overall talent. He may end up with Ray Allen's 3 point shooting record(s) when all is said and done, with the main factor being that Step is better at creating shots than Ray, who is primarily a spot up shooter.

[launche]

I'd rather see the ball move and the outcome of the play be decided by the defense.  Jordan was rare in making so many of those shots.
The game is changing and the days of the one man show at the end is likely coming to an end and if not then it would be because stats would show such an approach to be the lower percentage shot so the defense will live with it.

Ray Allen is not just a spot up shooter couldn't be farther from the truth.  A little Google may be in order if you think that.

[JerryM]

"The Shot" is so predicated that "Assists" are part of the stats.

A great player doesn't always take the shot. A great player ensures that it is taken.

[RDavidson]

I'd rather see the ball move and the outcome of the play be decided by the defense.  Jordan was rare in making so many of those shots.
The game is changing and the days of the one man show at the end is likely coming to an end and if not then it would be because stats would show such an approach to be the lower percentage shot so the defense will live with it.

Ray Allen is not just a spot up shooter couldn't be farther from the truth.  A little Google may be in order if you think that.

Google what? Show me what you mean. Honestly, I'd like to be educated if I'm way off the mark with my perhaps overly generalized statement. It's just that RARELY do I see Ray really create his own shot (at least not anymore) in the same sense that Jordan, Kobe, Lebron, or Durant did/do, which in itself is difficult to do out at the 3 point line especially when you're known for being a prolific 3 point shooter. Yeah, he'll roll off screens, catch and shoot. He'll take a couple of quick dribbles and make a jump shot here and there. But he is not an attacking type of guard like Wade, Westbrook, or Rose. To me, BY FAR, he is most deadly (just like any of the great 3 point shooters in history) when he is spotting up on the 3 point line and the ball is kicked out to him......which is why I made the statement that he's primarily a spot up shooter. He's great at it, arguably THE GREATEST.

[launche]

Google what? Show me what you mean. Honestly, I'd like to be educated if I'm way off the mark with my perhaps overly generalized statement. It's just that RARELY do I see Ray really create his own shot (at least not anymore) in the same sense that Jordan, Kobe, Lebron, or Durant did/do, which in itself is difficult to do out at the 3 point line especially when you're known for being a prolific 3 point shooter. Yeah, he'll roll off screens, catch and shoot. He'll take a couple of quick dribbles and make a jump shot here and there. But he is not an attacking type of guard like Wade, Westbrook, or Rose. To me, BY FAR, he is most deadly (just like any of the great 3 point shooters in history) when he is spotting up on the 3 point line and the ball is kicked out to him......which is why I made the statement that he's primarily a spot up shooter. He's great at it, arguably THE GREATEST.

I think you may have forgot all about Ray's Sonic and Buck years when he was young.  In his mid to late thirties I don't expect him to be attacking the rim although he still does it well for his age.  I might add he is an extremely well conditioned athlete, one of the best I've ever seen.  You are doing Ray an incredible disservice if you think he is/was just a guy who stands and shoots.  I've been watching Ray since UCONN and he is one of the most fluid and effortless athletes I've ever seen.  He drives to the basket and it looks like he's just jogging.  He may have the best balance of any player I've ever seen.  His is the best pull up and catch and shoot player I've ever seen, not spot up but moving anywhere on the court with or without the ball and raise for a shot defended or not.

I guess you can check some footage of Ray as a Sonic and Buck.  Calling Ray and spot up shooter is like calling Tom Brady a mobile QB.

[RDavidson]

I think you may have forgot all about Ray's Sonic and Buck years when he was young.  In his mid to late thirties I don't expect him to be attacking the rim although he still does it well for his age.  I might add he is an extremely well conditioned athlete, one of the best I've ever seen.  You are doing Ray an incredible disservice if you think he is/was just a guy who stands and shoots.  I've been watching Ray since UCONN and he is one of the most fluid and effortless athletes I've ever seen.  He drives to the basket and it looks like he's just jogging.  He may have the best balance of any player I've ever seen.  His is the best pull up and catch and shoot player I've ever seen, not spot up but moving anywhere on the court with or without the ball and raise for a shot defended or not.

I guess you can check some footage of Ray as a Sonic and Buck.  Calling Ray and spot up shooter is like calling Tom Brady a mobile QB.

You're correct. I am basing most of my (over generalized) statement on how he plays now, which is obviously still at a very high level regardless of age. Finer points aside, I think we can both agree that he is probably the best shooter we've seen and one of the many great overall scorers we've seen. To be either of these things, a player has to be extremely versatile and even more consistent, which Ray is the poster child of. Step Curry is also a remarkably versatile and consistent shooter/scorer. It'll be interesting to see how his career pans out. His dad played many years in the NBA. Hopefully Step can stay healthy..........(rounding the conversation back to Rose's cursed knees).

Tom Brady is just a pocket passer. Everyone knows that.

[Mike B.]

On a side note, I am a long time Portland Trailblazers fan. I lived in PDX and went to many games. It has been a depressing long dry spell for the team. However, they are off to a strong start this year. Fingers crossed that they stay healthy. As to the comparing of James /Jordan, my view is there is just no one in even close to Jordan. Night after night he showed up and literally took over games. James is not even in the same league as Magic and Larry Legend.   

[JerryM]

On a side note, I am a long time Portland Trailblazers fan. I lived in PDX and went to many games. It has been a depressing long dry spell for the team. However, they are off to a strong start this year. Fingers crossed that they stay healthy. As to the comparing of James /Jordan, my view is there is just no one in even close to Jordan. Night after night he showed up and literally took over games. James is not even in the same league as Magic and Larry Legend.

I agree. Jordan might not have had the career he enjoyed if not for Magic and Bird. They redefined the League.

When I watch old games of these guys playing, it's a far more physical game. They check a guy and hold his hips; strongly. If a player did that now, it would be an automatic foul.

The dynamic of the game is changing again. Kobe, Wade and James are leading the way.

[RDavidson]

I agree. Jordan might not have had the career he enjoyed if not for Magic and Bird. They redefined the League.

When I watch old games of these guys playing, it's a far more physical game. They check a guy and hold his hips; strongly. If a player did that now, it would be an automatic foul.

The dynamic of the game is changing again. Kobe, Wade and James are leading the way.

I like Wade, but I'd probably substitute Durant on that short list.

[JerryM]

I like Wade, but I'd probably substitute Durant on that short list.

Yes, the Rings Durant gets will be notable.

[launche]

Yeah the game was more physical then but these players would have adjusted.  It's crazy to think these players who are bigger faster and stronger than previous players would not have adjusted to a bit more physical play.  Conversely, today's game with zone and quasi-zone defense, strong side defenses, strong double teams etc..  plus the multi-skilled players of today level it all out IMO.

Durant is of this generation, Wade, James and Kobe of the generation that's coming to a close.  It will be Durant's chance to rule the league any year now if he's able.  He's got all the tools at his disposal, way more than most.

The thing about Wade that goes under the radar is his relative efficiency.  Things that are just starting to get noticed with the new stats gurus.  Before stepping back to Lebron he was right there as one of the most efficient players in the game.  What I love about him and is funny to me is at 6'4" on a good day.  He will post up anybody and I mean anybody, I laugh when I see him posting up 6'8" -6'10" players.  A  nod to his defense as well as he soon will have the record for all time blocks as a guard and he blocks everybody not just other guards.

[TF1216]

I can't help but feel players of old had more will, determination, and grit than we see today. Players would certainly had adjusted and I think they wouldn't be nearly as good as they are today. However, it aches me to think this, a player like Lebron would have been even better. He would have been forced, early on, to use his size and hops to excel at the small forward position.  The hard nose game may have grounded him too; keeping him in Cleveland to script a storyline different than Jordan's and Kobe's who came before him. His path could have broken the new breed of player RDavidson pointed out that existed today. (I never thought how Jordan caused but it makes sense.)

I'd watch a regular season game from 15 years ago before watching a game from today. Players don't have the same likability factor anymore. I'm not sure if its the style of game or their arrogance on the court but regular season games are tough to watch. I'm getting. Old 

[RDavidson]

I can't help but feel players of old had more will, determination, and grit than we see today. Players would certainly had adjusted and I think they wouldn't be nearly as good as they are today. However, it aches me to think this, a player like Lebron would have been even better. He would have been forced, early on, to use his size and hops to excel at the small forward position.  The hard nose game may have grounded him too; keeping him in Cleveland to script a storyline different than Jordan's and Kobe's who came before him. His path could have broken the new breed of player RDavidson pointed out that existed today. (I never thought how Jordan caused but it makes sense.)

I'd watch a regular season game from 15 years ago before watching a game from today. Players don't have the same likability factor anymore. I'm not sure if its the style of game or their arrogance on the court but regular season games are tough to watch. I'm getting. Old 

I'm with you. I definitely miss the Jordan, Magic, Bird era too, but I've warmed back up to the NBA a bit over the last couple of seasons after years of not really caring (after Jordan left). There's been some fantastic basketball. A few of my favorites to watch are Kevin Durant, Lebron James, Kevin Love, Steph Curry, Chris Paul, Dirk Nowitzki, Tim Duncan, James Harden (though I can't stop thinking his beard must be uncomfortable), Paul Pierce, and Deron Williams. OKC is probably my favorite team, but I also like watching the T-Wolves and Clippers quite a bit. There are some up and coming teams that are very fun to watch (Clippers, Raptors, T Wolves) that didn't used to get a lot of TV time. Catch one or two of those "odd ball" / non-Heat, non-Lakers, non-OKC, non-Bulls games and I think you might find yourself enjoying the NBA again. I think a lot of the mainstream hype/news/players kept me from wanting to watch the NBA. It just kinda turned me off. Like I said, I'm warming back up to it.