[Big Red Machine]

I own a Rogue Perseus as well and look for a little more "soul" as the op states. Question for you more experienced than I.

How much does a source play in achieving the magic we look for? I went to a local forum member's house to listen to his system and he had a Modwright oppo player that sounded fantastic. I'm currently looking at tube dacs to help me get "there" such as the Lampizator line.

Secondly, as far as preamps has anybody heard the Cary SLP 98 that cares to comment?

Sorry Neep if I'm intruding, love the topic!

Couple things.  Don't think that you need a tubed dac to get the clean or relaxed sound.  I went down the Lampi and other tubed dac route before and solid state is just fine.  I found the tubed pre is just enough with a good SS dac.

Had an SLP98 years ago and it was only so so.  Nothing to write home about.  Kinda tubby sounding.

[sfox7076]

I don't necessarily agree about BRM about the DAC, but I agree that the tubed pre is a bigger step.

[mhconley]

I use PS Audio's Digital Link III DAC and GCPH phono-preamp for the sources in my setup and I think they sound wonderful.  The Audio Experience A2 added the dose of musicality I was seeking.  It replaced a Parasound Halo P 3.

Martin

[Big Red Machine]

Nothing wrong with the Lampi dac, just saying that tubed dacs and their benefits may not be as beneficial as the preamp which touches all your sources.

[DTB300]

There is a nice CJ PV-12AL (Line Stage Only) on 'Gon.  Only takes two tubes - 12au7's.  The guy selling owns a service shop, so it should be in great working order.  Not sure on price if it is good or not.  A good old vintage CJ tube pre-amp for that "tubey" sound you are looking for.

[JLM]

If you need to buy a piece of equipment, to give you a certain character, you are asking for distortion, aren't you?
A piece of audio equipment at its best is character-less or basically a piece of wire.
What various equipment aim to do, is to faithfully pass audio through. But since nothing is perfect, the compromise is to not to add anything (distortion), and not to miss any part of the audio (resolution).
Tubes amps tend to be human friendly! where they fail in distortion and resolution terms, is not so harsh on your ears, that's all.
I think others have already responded well, in saying: your problem is elsewhere.

For decades in this pastime I've been on a purist path and would have responded as you have.  But in a search for my ideal active speakers (one channel of amplification per driver, crossover upstream of amps, used primarily in studios) I've come to realize that the studio folks are after accuracy and finding the nits, which typically provides a dry analytical sound.  I've also come to realize (admit) that audiophiles don't necessarily want the truth, they do want emotional satisfaction (whatever that means to each individual).  At least the OP appears to know what he wants.

[sunnydaze]

Couldn't agree more .   Who cares how the desired end result is achieved..... so long as it is acheived.   I'd venture to say most folks in this game never really  get that satisfaction.  These theoretical discussions on '' correct'' approach get tedious after awhile.   

Whatever gets you thru the night.

More than one way to skin a cat.

And all that jazz.....     

[Tomy2Tone]

I think you're right. I haven't really invested in a proper set of tubes and it could potentially save me thousands to do so. I do have a few quad sets of tubes but they were all under $100. It's time to try the genuine NOS Mullards so I placed an order for a quad set ($452 from Upscale Audio). Thanks everybody for the responses!

Let us know how the Mullards workout. At that price I'm assuming they're the cv4003 tube?

I just received some Amperex bugle boys to try in the Perseus and think they bring a wonderful soundstage but not as airy and detailed on the top end as the rca clear tops I've used. I've done a little mismatching and like what I hear with two RCA's in the back and two amperex's in the front. Seems like I still get a great soundstage with some smoothness while retaining the detail. Curious to what you think of the Mullards.

[kentajalli]

For decades in this pastime I've been on a purist path and would have responded as you have.  But in a search for my ideal active speakers (one channel of amplification per driver, crossover upstream of amps, used primarily in studios) I've come to realize that the studio folks are after accuracy and finding the nits, which typically provides a dry analytical sound.  I've also come to realize (admit) that audiophiles don't necessarily want the truth, they do want emotional satisfaction (whatever that means to each individual).  At least the OP appears to know what he wants.

Thanx for your reply to my reply 
Well the OP knows there's something missing, but I doubt if he knows what he wants, or he would not be asking.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I must say, that if a certain piece of equipment adds a certain (let's say) warmth to a dry recording or a mix ( I agree, there are such recordings) in order to cure it, then what would be the effect on a warm recording?
You see if we add a character by a preamp (in this case) then that character would be a fixed feature, it will not change according to what it is fed with.
If a bright sounding speaker opens up a dull recording, then the same speaker would be screeching with a bright recording. Since we can not pick and choose our recordings to match the character of our equipment, we must have characterless equipment, and suffer (and enjoy) whatever recording we are handed.
The term HiFi was coined to indicate "true to original" - we should never loose sight of that.
A little targeted equalization on playback is accepted on overtly bad recordings, but to add something to original (or take away) is sacrilege. 
To do so, has a name - it's called Distortion.
I am an old hand at this too. I built my first active speakers (still working) some 25 years ago, in a tall hexagonal column enclosure, using 2 peerless bass drivers, a Kef B110 midrange driver and a Dynaudio dome HF driver with a discrete single ended active crossover network of my own design, and a Meridian 103D and a Meridian 105 amplifier per side.
Four hefty powersupplies were built into the base of the columns, three for poweramps, and one to power the crossover and line stages of poweramps.
I'll send a picture next time I see them at my brothers house. 

[rajacat]

Thanx for your reply to my reply 
Well the OP knows there's something missing, but I doubt if he knows what he wants, or he would not be asking.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I must say, that if a certain piece of equipment adds a certain (let's say) warmth to a dry recording or a mix ( I agree, there are such recordings) in order to cure it, then what would be the effect on a warm recording?
You see if we add a character by a preamp (in this case) then that character would be a fixed feature, it will not change according to what it is fed with.
If a bright sounding speaker opens up a dull recording, then the same speaker would be screeching with a bright recording. Since we can not pick and choose our recordings to match the character of our equipment, we must have characterless equipment, and suffer (and enjoy) whatever recording we are handed.
The term HiFi was coined to indicate "true to original" - we should never loose sight of that.
A little targeted equalization on playback is accepted on overtly bad recordings, but to add something to original (or take away) is sacrilege. 
To do so, has a name - it's called Distortion.
I am an old hand at this too. I built my first active speakers (still working) some 25 years ago, in a tall hexagonal column enclosure, using 2 peerless bass drivers, a Kef B110 midrange driver and a Dynaudio dome HF driver with a discrete single ended active crossover network of my own design, and a Meridian 103D and a Mer :thumb:idian 105 amplifier per side.
Four hefty powersupplies were built into the base of the columns, three for poweramps, and one to power the crossover and line stages of poweramps.
I'll send a picture next time I see them at my brothers house.

Excellent post!

You dissected and explained the issue perfectly.

[Quiet Earth]

I think that all components have a "character". They impart their sonic thumbprint to everything played back through them. To say that a component or a system of components can have zero influence on a recording is kind of wishful thinking IMO.

I think that the recording is not completely finished until it is played back on a system in somebody's home. The people who make recordings know this, and that is why they check their mixes on different kinds of systems. Adjustments are made to please a wide range of users, and there is no absolute right or wrong.

So,,, if neep's power amp is truly neutral or it is somewhat dry and matter-of-fact sounding, then that is its character. If he wants to add a little bloom and texture to it, or get some of that lit from within sound, then I think he can achieve that with a better preamp. His real problem, IMO, is that he is not going to find such a preamp for 2,000 dollars. Preamps that are truly "intoxicating" come with a price tag to match. Unless of course you build one yourself or get a killer deal on something used. Even then, it won't come cheap.

[mick wolfe]

Exactly what I thought when I first saw "Intoxicating" in the initial post. Intoxicating moves you well above the 2K price point.

[Tomy2Tone]

Had an SLP98 years ago and it was only so so.  Nothing to write home about.  Kinda tubby sounding.

Trying to find local dealers that can loan out components for a test run seems to be a nice way to go. I've read nothing but good things about the Melody Pure Black 101 but to hear it before committing to buy it is probably impossible.

Seems a lot of this hobby is trial and error which is why the used for sale section here is always busy. But I guess that's part of the fun that keeps it interesting.

[kentajalli]

I think that all components have a "character". They impart their sonic thumbprint to everything played back through them. To say that a component or a system of components can have zero influence on a recording is kind of wishful thinking IMO.
My wife nags sometimes, but for me to go and look for a nagging wife is somewhat silly.

I think that the recording is not completely finished until it is played back on a system in somebody's home. The people who make recordings know this, and that is why they check their mixes on different kinds of systems. Adjustments are made to please a wide range of users, and there is no absolute right or wrong.
Tone equalization is kosher, if done sparingly, that's all.

So,,, if neep's power amp is truly neutral or it is somewhat dry and matter-of-fact sounding, then that is its character. If he wants to add a little bloom and texture to it, or get some of that lit from within sound, then I think he can achieve that with a better preamp. His real problem, IMO, is that he is not going to find such a preamp for 2,000 dollars. Preamps that are truly "intoxicating" come with a price tag to match. Unless of course you build one yourself or get a killer deal on something used. Even then, it won't come cheap.

You are assuming his poweramp has that character, I doubt if the manufacturers agree with you.
He should improve his source, His CD player, DAC first and then a good preamp is what is needed, but good does not mean one that has a certain character.

[Quiet Earth]

Well, I try not to assume anything,, I was just giving my opinion. I have never encountered a piece of audio gear that did not have an identifiable sonic character.  I guess we can agree to disagree.

Peace. 

[twitch54]

I agree with Early.  The flavor you seek is more easily obtained by changing the amp.

Even though the Op has apparently made his mind up, I agree, an amp change away from Class D would be my choice as well.

[tronan]

You could try building a simple 5687 line stage. Although there are many fancy designs, you can use 1/2 of a 5687 and simply capacitor couple and get great results.