Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz

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Will_PWR

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Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« on: 8 Dec 2016, 03:55 am »
I got my Bryston 4B Cubed in October and have been enjoying it very much.

When I first got it I noticed a little transformer buzz but was not too worried about it since I used to own a 4B ST that also had noisy transformers.

I emailed Bryston support to ask if it is normal to hear the buzz when my ears are 2 feet away from the amp.  They told me it is considered acceptable if the buzz cannot be heard more than 3 feet from the amps, therefore mine would be considered acceptable.

But lately with the colder weather, I do more late night listening when my room is really quiet and the buzzing is starting to bother me even from my listening seat.  Especially between tracks, I hear it as if it is room ambiance in the recording.

Anyone else here notice the same issue with their 4B Cubed? 

James, do I just have to learn to live with it?  I don't want to go thru the trouble of sending it back if nothing can be done.



Armaegis

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #1 on: 8 Dec 2016, 05:40 am »
Is the buzz consistent or does it change sometimes? Specifically, if you have dimmers, or maybe if the stove or fridge is running? I'm wondering if it's electrical hash that's making the transformers hum, rather than something inherent to the amp itself.

James Tanner

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #2 on: 8 Dec 2016, 11:49 am »
I got my Bryston 4B Cubed in October and have been enjoying it very much.

When I first got it I noticed a little transformer buzz but was not too worried about it since I used to own a 4B ST that also had noisy transformers.

I emailed Bryston support to ask if it is normal to hear the buzz when my ears are 2 feet away from the amp.  They told me it is considered acceptable if the buzz cannot be heard more than 3 feet from the amps, therefore mine would be considered acceptable.

But lately with the colder weather, I do more late night listening when my room is really quiet and the buzzing is starting to bother me even from my listening seat.  Especially between tracks, I hear it as if it is room ambiance in the recording.

Anyone else here notice the same issue with their 4B Cubed? 

James, do I just have to learn to live with it?  I don't want to go thru the trouble of sending it back if nothing can be done.

That seems excessive - where are you located?  Also I would ask as stated above does it vary in a different outlet?

james


rlee8394


Will_PWR

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #4 on: 8 Dec 2016, 06:06 pm »
The buzzing is constant. It does not vary with volume.  I've tried plugging it into different outlets around the house but it made no difference.

I actually bought the Humdinger linked to above but that made no difference - wasted my money there.   Not the humdinger's fault though since I don't think the problem is dc in the line.  I am not even sure if it is the transformers since if i put my ears close to the amp it sounds like it is coming from the back of the amp but that could just be my ears playing tricks on me due to reflections in the amp.

I used to have a Creek amp that would buzz whenever i turned on my halogen lamp but be dead silent otherwise  With the Bryston the buzzing is there even when the lamp is off and it does not get any louder when the lamp is turned on.
 
This actually bothered me enough that i considered selling it but then i listen to the glorious sound it makes and changed my mind. Plus I don't want to explain to potential buyers that the buzzing is normal when i know that to me it is really bothersome.

James, i am in Ottawa.

James Tanner

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #5 on: 8 Dec 2016, 06:12 pm »
The buzzing is constant. It does not vary with volume.  I've tried plugging it into different outlets around the house but it made no difference.

I actually bought the Humdinger linked to above but that made no difference - wasted my money there.   Not the humdinger's fault though since I don't think the problem is dc in the line.  I am not even sure if it is the transformers since if i put my ears close to the amp it sounds like it is coming from the back of the amp but that could just be my ears playing tricks on me due to reflections in the amp.

I used to have a Creek amp that would buzz whenever i turned on my halogen lamp but be dead silent otherwise  With the Bryston the buzzing is there even when the lamp is off and it does not get any louder when the lamp is turned on.
 
This actually bothered me enough that i considered selling it but then i listen to the glorious sound it makes and changed my mind. Plus I don't want to explain to potential buyers that the buzzing is normal when i know that to me it is really bothersome.

James, i am in Ottawa.

OK - email Mike at Bryston and we will get it in and replaced the transformers for you.

mpickett@bryston.com

james

Will_PWR

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #6 on: 8 Dec 2016, 11:58 pm »
OK - email Mike at Bryston and we will get it in and replaced the transformers for you.

mpickett@bryston.com

james

Thank you James.  Mike has already reached out to me.

dumanski

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #7 on: 16 Dec 2016, 03:01 am »
James are new transformers in 4b cubed plintron ? They look different then before also says made in China on transformer ...

James Tanner

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #8 on: 16 Dec 2016, 10:59 am »
James are new transformers in 4b cubed plintron ? They look different then before also says made in China on transformer ...

We get some of our transformers from Plitron and some from other manufacturers (Eagle Rise) - depends on the model as all our transformers are custom to the specific amplifier.

james

Fab77

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #9 on: 2 Nov 2024, 06:02 pm »
Hello,

I am a new member and I apologize for bringing up this topic :?
I myself have a hum problem on my 4B3 and when I read your message from 2016, I thought that I could have written it in 2024 because my hum problem is so similar to yours !

I wanted to know if a solution had been provided to your amplifier, if so, which one ?

Thanks !

I got my Bryston 4B Cubed in October and have been enjoying it very much.

When I first got it I noticed a little transformer buzz but was not too worried about it since I used to own a 4B ST that also had noisy transformers.

I emailed Bryston support to ask if it is normal to hear the buzz when my ears are 2 feet away from the amp.  They told me it is considered acceptable if the buzz cannot be heard more than 3 feet from the amps, therefore mine would be considered acceptable.

But lately with the colder weather, I do more late night listening when my room is really quiet and the buzzing is starting to bother me even from my listening seat.  Especially between tracks, I hear it as if it is room ambiance in the recording.

Anyone else here notice the same issue with their 4B Cubed? 

James, do I just have to learn to live with it?  I don't want to go thru the trouble of sending it back if nothing can be done.

Mag

Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #10 on: 2 Nov 2024, 11:10 pm »
Hello,

I am a new member and I apologize for bringing up this topic :?
I myself have a hum problem on my 4B3 and when I read your message from 2016, I thought that I could have written it in 2024 because my hum problem is so similar to yours !

I wanted to know if a solution had been provided to your amplifier, if so, which one ?

Thanks !

My recollection when I had a hum in my system was caused by the cartridge connected to tone arm on Turntable. Normally my Bryston amps are quiet. I don't normally use a turntable. IIRC I brought this TT out from the closet.

Fab77

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #11 on: 3 Nov 2024, 09:54 am »
Thanks for the answer, but the problem is not there. It is internal to the amplifier in my opinion.

The amplifier connected alone in the general electrical panel of the house on a socket associated with its 20A circuit breaker (all the other circuit breakers in the panel being off, only the 4B3 is powered), it hums.

I have been in email contact with Adam Tanner then Mike Pickett for this hum problem.
Several leads and tests without conclusive results were done in France, the 4B3 was sent back to Bryston in Canada to finally end up changing it for a new model.
Unfortunately, after unpacking and connecting, the brand new 4B3 hums like the previous one  :cry:

Before disturbing Mike Pickett again, I wanted to carry out new tests. In particular, to eliminate any problem with my electrical installation, I took my brand new 4B3 under my arm and went to several friends in different cities. The 4B3 also hums at their place with the same constancy !

I sent an email to Mike two weeks ago to tell him about all my tests which unfortunately have no positive effects on the hum and to see what he thinks about all that. I am waiting for a response from him.

Important clarification, the distance between my listening position and the front of the 4B3 is 2.60 meters (8.53 feet if my conversion is correct).
I hear the hum in the low-level passages of classical or jazz music, the silences between the titles of an album and in the silences of the dialogues of films or when there is simply no music.

As I indicated in my presentation as a new member, I am a sound technician and therefore I have a good ear. 
So I thought it was just me and that I was being too demanding :? But family and friends who don't have the same hearing and sound experience as me also hear the hum !

I will eventually create a new post to explain everything that was done and the disappointing results so that you understand my distress...

James Tanner

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #12 on: 3 Nov 2024, 01:27 pm »
Hi Fab

I contacted the factory - please email Jim - jspence@brystyon.com

Fab77

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #13 on: 3 Nov 2024, 04:09 pm »
Hello James,

Thanks for your message !
I just sent an email to Jim and copied you.


Hi Fab

I contacted the factory - please email Jim - jspence@brystyon.com

Speedskater

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #14 on: 4 Nov 2024, 01:52 pm »
Do the loudspeakers hum/buzz or is it the amplifier itself with the hum/buzz?

Fab77

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #15 on: 4 Nov 2024, 10:23 pm »
The hum is coming from the amplifier, there is nothing in the loudspeakers.

jcn3

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #16 on: 5 Nov 2024, 01:48 am »
The hum is coming from the amplifier, there is nothing in the loudspeakers.

since you had it coming from two different amplifiers, it's probably not the amplifier, but the power coming into your home.  dirty/noisy power can cause transformers to hum.

Clive197

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #17 on: 5 Nov 2024, 09:49 am »
I would suspect that it’s DC on the power line. Relatively easy to resolve with a DC power filter. I have one built in my power block. Just a suggestion.

Fab77

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #18 on: 6 Nov 2024, 02:14 pm »
Before bothering the French distributor and Bryston, I carried out several tests which confirmed my idea that the problem does not come from my electrical installation :
- disconnection of the entire house at the main electrical panel (so no device works) then connection of the 4B3 alone directly to a socket on the main electrical panel : presence of hum
- testing the 4B3 at three friends who live in three different cities to definitively rule out any problem related to my electrical installation : presence of hum at both
- connecting the 4B3 to an "Accuphase PS-550" mains conditioner at a friend's house in another city: presence of hum

since you had it coming from two different amplifiers, it's probably not the amplifier, but the power coming into your home.  dirty/noisy power can cause transformers to hum.

Fab77

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Re: Bryston 4B Cubed transformer buzz
« Reply #19 on: 6 Nov 2024, 02:19 pm »
I considered this avenue and ruled it out after test of an "IFI Audio DC Blocker - 10A" filter : presence of hum.
Also, from my internet research, it appears that the 4B3 has a DC blocker at the power input which effectively eliminates the problem. Afterwards, maybe I'm wrong?

I would suspect that it’s DC on the power line. Relatively easy to resolve with a DC power filter. I have one built in my power block. Just a suggestion.