PCB board isolation

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poseidonsvoice

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PCB board isolation
« on: 29 Mar 2011, 12:42 pm »
What decoupling do you recommend for PCB isolation? Grungebusters?

Thanks,
Anand.

jtwrace

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #1 on: 29 Mar 2011, 12:44 pm »
The feet under the washer and dryer isn't enough isolation?  You need more on the PCB?  Hmm.  Strange that you have all this noise from the washer and dryer.   :)

poseidonsvoice

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Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #2 on: 29 Mar 2011, 12:46 pm »
 
The feet under the washer and dryer isn't enough isolation?  You need more on the PCB?  Hmm.  Strange that you have all this noise from the washer and dryer.   :)

:rotflmao:

Anand.

jtwrace

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #3 on: 29 Mar 2011, 12:56 pm »
Just curious if a dual stud rubber standoff (A.K.A Vibration Mount) would be the way to go. 





I'll be interested to see what Steve recommends though. 

Herbie

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #4 on: 29 Mar 2011, 01:44 pm »
Hi, Anand. Printed circuit board isolation is usually achieved satisfactorily with overall isolation of the component that the circuit board is mounted in, e.g., Tenderfeet under the component and maybe a SuperSonic Stabilizer or two on top.

Additional component damping can be achieved internally with rope caulk like Mortite (available at hardware stores) and Permatex Blue RTV Silicone Gasket Maker (available at auto parts stores). Either or both of these can be used to damp PC boards, used sparingly. Grungebuster material is quite effective for internal damping, also.

You don't want to use rubber, Sorbothane, or other sonic "trade-off" damping materials with audio components or associated electronics.

Isolating washing machines and refrigerators and anything else in the house does not isolate audio or electronic components, which must be accomplished at the components themselves. Besides a myriad of other micro-vibrational sources, audio components themselves generate micro-vibrations and should be isolated individually to bring out more of their inherent potential.

You don't want to use rubber, Sorbothane, or other sonic "trade-off" damping materials with audio and video components. Dual rubber standoffs would be great for a refrigerator or washing machine, but not a PC board.

Vibrations generated by a mechanical device like a washing machine will transmit vibrations via the floor and walls, but the nature of the vibrations affecting the audio system will be determined by the materials the vibrations pass through along the way. The wood, joists, structural framework will characterize the vibrations. Vibrations reaching the audio components must be blocked or absorbed by materials and physics that are specifically effective with audio and deliver a sonically neutral end result.

Steve
Herbie's Audio Lab


poseidonsvoice

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Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #5 on: 29 Mar 2011, 02:40 pm »
Steve,

Yes, isolating and treating each of the entities separately is the best solution, i.e. PCB/component isolation w/rope caulk/Mortite/Grungebuster and washer/dryer w/rubber isolators/cork like in the previous thread. The solutions are different for each application of course  :thumb:

FWIW, my washer and dryer are not in the same room as my audio room/ht. They are about 60 feet away from each other. Don't worry, my audio room is isolated by staggered studs, room within a room, fiberglass, RSIC clips, Green Glue, CLD walls on all sides except for the floor which has a Quiet Ground rubber underlayment along with carpet (there is nothing under the floor, just the earth). All wall outlets/speaker outlets have their own MDF enclosures. Even the ceiling lights are affixed in a soffit and isolated from the main ceiling itself. The room also has its direct connection to the HVAC w/mufflers installed in the inlet/outlet, and 2-3 ninety degree bends to minimize transfer of flanking noise, etc...in other words, my room is quiet

Now Shhh.  :lol:

Best,

Anand.

jtwrace

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #6 on: 29 Mar 2011, 02:44 pm »
I can't wait to pick out colors for my perma-guest room.   :hyper:

TomS

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #7 on: 29 Mar 2011, 02:49 pm »
Steve,

Yes, isolating and treating each of the entities separately is the best solution, i.e. PCB/component isolation w/rope caulk/Mortite/Grungebuster and washer/dryer w/rubber isolators/cork like in the previous thread. The solutions are different for each application of course  :thumb:

FWIW, my washer and dryer are not in the same room as my audio room/ht. They are about 60 feet away from each other. Don't worry, my audio room is isolated by staggered studs, room within a room, fiberglass, RSIC clips, Green Glue, CLD walls on all sides except for the floor which has a Quiet Ground rubber underlayment along with carpet (there is nothing under the floor, just the earth). All wall outlets/speaker outlets have their own MDF enclosures. Even the ceiling lights are affixed in a soffit and isolated from the main ceiling itself. The room also has its direct connection to the HVAC w/mufflers installed in the inlet/outlet, and 2-3 ninety degree bends to minimize transfer of flanking noise, etc...in other words, my room is quiet

Now Shhh.  :lol:

Best,

Anand.
That could be scary quiet. I remember being in an ENT's sound isolation booth for some testing once and being able to hear my own heartbeat vividly. Weird...

TomS

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #8 on: 29 Mar 2011, 02:54 pm »
Oops, and back on topic, I remember some very creative (but fragile) arrangement in Jud Barber's Joule Electra phono stage that I had. It was a combination of some very thin acrylic type of tabs (maybe 1"x2") with blue Sorbothane(?) type rings on either end. One standoff connected to chassis on one end of the tab, the other connected to the pcb at the other end. The pcb almost floated in free space, not rigid coupling at all. The whole assembly was light as a feather. I have internal pics somewhere but unfortunatelno idea where they are stored at the moment :(

dknywinnie

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Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #9 on: 29 Mar 2011, 04:53 pm »
One way for the PCB damping is to use thick wool felt damping pads as suggested by Mike Elliott of Alta Vista Audio.

rollo

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Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #10 on: 29 Mar 2011, 06:50 pm »
One way for the PCB damping is to use thick wool felt damping pads as suggested by Mike Elliott of Alta Vista Audio.

  Excellent recco. I use them in the preamp power supplies. Very affective.

charles

jtwrace

Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #11 on: 29 Mar 2011, 06:53 pm »
Wool isolation complete with static electricity? 

rollo

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Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #12 on: 29 Mar 2011, 07:17 pm »
Wool isolation complete with static electricity?

  Nope.


charles

gstew

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Re: PCB board isolation
« Reply #13 on: 21 Aug 2011, 10:29 pm »
I've used the isolation pads from the original teflon Hal-O tube dampers for PCB damping as follows:

1. On the motherboard mounting posts in my computer music server. Cleaned up hash top-to-bottom.

2. On the mounting posts for circuit boards. Same effect as above.

I see they are still available on the page for these dampers.

Highly recommended!

Greg in Mississippi

P.S. Trying to damp circuit boards & motherboards was one of the few times I've achieved 'over-damping'. Having the damping pads on the posts AND additional ones wedged under the boards (or felt under the boards as AltaVistaAudio does on their Counterpoint mods) made the sound dull and slow-sounding. Just use the damping pads on the posts.