[Bob in St. Louis]

Is someone honestly suggesting importing ~18000 pounds of OSB into an apartment building?

I was going to do the math until I read your post, so thanks for that.
Just for comparative purposes, the curb weight of a 2011 Chevrolet Suburban is 5846 pounds.
Park three of those in your living room and lemme know how that works out for ya.

Bob

[Bob in St. Louis]

Sorry, I can't resist.
The curb weight of a Smart car is 1,600.
That's like parking 11 of them in your living room.

[neekomax]

I was going to do the math until I read your post, so thanks for that.
Just for comparative purposes, the curb weight of a 2011 Chevrolet Suburban is 5846 pounds.
Park three of those in your living room and lemme know how that works out for ya.

Bob

Holy reality check. 

[dwk]

Well, my weight calculation was based on the 350 sheets of OSB number that was posted - 52-53 lbs/sheet.  350 sheets seems astronomical to me - that's a stack almost 15' high. I guess if you're thinking of building 12" thick solid walls though, that's what it would take.

To be a bit more positive, it had been a while since I'd looked at isolation products, and the soundisolationstore link is a good one. I still think the idea of expending all this effort to ultimately end up with a tiny space is misguided, but I do think that it may well be possible to come up with a double-framed room-in-a-room with double-drywall in and out, resilient clips etc that might work OK. You still would have to figure out the floor isolation - maybe a double-layer of floor with each decoupled with IsoJoist would do it. You might have problems with height - you'd lose at least 4 stud widths in a double-floor/double-roof setup, but if you had 9 foot ceilings to start it might work out OK.  The door would ultimately be a weak link, and you still have zero ventilation, but if I was absolutely dead-set on trying something like this, that would be the direction I'd be thinking.
 Since it's non-structural 2x4 24" OC should be fine to support the drywall weight, I'd think.

[timind]

Moving seems like the only plausible solution to the isolation problem, snooker table and all. Seriously though, because of the poor housing market, single family houses are much easier to find on the rental market in much of the country.

[Audiosmoot]

@ Jeffrey Hedback

This does not change the load-bearing rating itself. Apartment building codes require that the flooring support be able to support cars stacked to your ceiling with ease. Modern buildings can actually support several times that. You don't know when someone is going to put a 1-ton safe in their apartment. It seems many other people did not read that part, or they did not believe it but presented no knowledge to the contrary. Again, I reviewed this to some length back before I purchased my Snooker Table (which weighs about 1600 lbs and rests on small feet--not spread about much at all) and yes if you wanted to park a large SUV in your den, your apartment could take the SUV filled entirely with sand bags, and still laugh that you're not yet at the half-way point of what it can really take.

But I thank-you. You've been considerate and your advice is clearly well-meaning. You're also very clearly respected in this community and you've taken the time to assist me with real advice and real encouragement. Thank-you!

@ decal

I've just spent all my responses explaining my thinking, admitting where I do see concern, and relaying that I will sit on this longer and consider my options. Your statement that my mind is made-up does not fit how I feel, and if I've communicated that poorly I apologize. Let me stress that I've been considering this at length, and am now re-invigorating my efforts to consider whole new possibilities. I've also devised many sub-projects to test this one, including the fact I will not be undertaking any project whole-force, but rather discrete steps. (Take note, HT cOz...btw Thank-You for understanding!).

@ dwk

Indeed the logistics are to be considered, and I have. Earlier I mentioned how I wouldn't want to cut-off an area I might later need access to. After a little thought, I laid out the exact order to be able to assemble (and break-down!) without issue. Including in that, for example is this: the initial outer layer requires the least cuts, and they can also be somewhat coarse. These will be made with the original purchase over at Lowe's (it's like a $0.25 a cut). Once this outer shell is assembled I may then make all the further required cuts from within, thereby keeping all the sawdust isolated from the apartment. This worked in a similar fashion during my 'treehouse' project; Some always gets away, but it's minimal.

The spaced drywall is a common misconception. Again, for anyone interested in sound-proofing, look to the GreenGlue page on triple-leaf systems and their inferiority to solid masses. Earlier, for example, a link was given to light-weight structural pieces at superhoneycombdotcom. That's exactly the thing you don't want when soundproofing against low-frequencies. Nothing betters pure mass. That said, I think I found another use for that site's unique offerings...Thanks Again WGH, cool find!

@ richidoo & nathanm

Thank-you fine sirs for your meritorious consideration!

@ timind

I'm going to look again at the housing market. It seems a long-shot for me...but maybe. The problem is I've yet come across a home with two open expanses (or one huge one, think SOHO loft) fitting to Snooker and Home Theater.

Right now I'm thinking I'll just move again, but man I hate that thought... My lease-end is half-a-year away, and I own a huge amount of things that are difficult to move (11' antique bank-desk, 600lb antique barber's chair, MurphyBed, Snooker Table, antique lumbar collection {salvaged from another project and quality that is very difficult to replace})...Then there's the fact I may not find a suitable substitution anyway.

[persisting1]

Moving will be much easier than doing all that work.  Plus, what happens when you go to watch your favorite movie at reference levels and you get a knock on the door to turn it down?  That would be very sad.

[JohnR]

Perhaps some lateral thinking. Put the sofa on an isolation platform and attach a bunch of bass shakers to it. Mount the speakers closer. Use horns to control directivity. etc.

[SlushPuppy]

For about 10 seconds I thought about reading this thread, but I got distracted and grabbed a beer instead.....

[Rob Babcock]

If you did build that you'd better hope you die of old age before you have to move it!

[Otis Hobbes]

Just joined the forum because of my interest in this project.

As an acoustical physicist (I conduct R&D for the QuietRock/QuietGlue Pro products), I must say that, with all the potential flanking problems, a 1' thick wall will certainly not give you the bang for your buck regardless of what you are putting in it, be it green glue, QuietRock, QuietGlue Pro, etc.  If you are building from an existing wall and don't want to have to do any demolition, you will need a significant air cavity (use lots of that 1' space to for an air cavity that is NOT mechanically connected to the existing wall).  A massive and optimally-damped (NOT overkill on the damping, as damping is NOT linear and will not just keep adding to the performance) panel over a well-built air cavity is going to be the best, most cost-effective way to treat this wall. 

THEN you need to worry about sound flanking through continuous subfloors and penetrated ceilings.  Are you isolating the floor as well (hopefully)?

Best of luck in your project and have a fantastic day!!!

[Hipper]

Sorry, I can't resist either.

This is a Sinclair C5 electric car, weight 66lbs (my CD transport nearly weighs this!). This means you can, by weight anyway, fit in about 273 of them.


<a href="http://tinypic.com?ref=4rdnwy" target="_blank"><img src="http://i52.tinypic.com/4rdnwy.jpg" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic">[/url]

They're available on e-bay.

[nathanm]

How many football fields would fit inside this apartment?
If you stacked each sheet of OSB together it would go from the earth to the moon how many times?

[Bob in St. Louis]

How many football fields would fit inside this apartment?
If you stacked each sheet of OSB together it would go from the earth to the moon how many times?

Measured in area, 350 sheets is about a quarter acre. Doesn't sound very impressive when you look at it that way. But 350 sheets end to end is about a half mile long. That's pretty impressive.

Bob

[neekomax]

How many football fields would fit inside this apartment?
If you stacked each sheet of OSB together it would go from the earth to the moon how many times?

Hahahahahahaha man too funny

[thunderbrick]

And you would move these 1' thick OSB walls HOW?????  A crane maybe, but there isn't enough room to get enough guys in there to move 'em, no matter HOW much beer you promise them!     

And if you floor will support that much what about stairs? And a vehicle to move the OSB???

Thanks for putting our own level of nutso tweaks and obsessions in perspective.   

[Bob in St. Louis]

I've heard that cryo'd OSB makes a difference. 

[Audiosmoot]

Read the post man, I'm talking about building the walls. They don't start out 1' thick. That said...


Alright I'm convinced. My original plan was to put the speakers in the main room along with the Snooker table. This would require raising these floor standers so that they project over the table (the cieling is 126", the speakers are 70" tall and the table is 32" tall). I would then need to raise my sofa (and position it into place--along one side of the table--when listening) by building a large rolling shelf (the original reason for purchasing the industrial casters).

The arrangement is like so:

20'8" x 13'7" (I think) room with adjoining kitchen and long hallway. Google iLume in Dallas, click suites...click floorplans...click on third floor...click on room 3155 (almost dead-center of the right-side wall facing Cedar Springs)...then mirror-image the room (it's wrongly shown)...that's my space. I attached a photo (mirror-corrected already) so hopefully that's viewable. Note that the bedroom is open to the main layout...The bedroom walls shared with the hallway and the kitchen are both only 8' tall...the remaining 3' to the cieling is an open space (kinda like a basement may have those high-up windows to the street, only no window). This allows even more room for the sound to breathe (and hopefully be trapped).





The snooker table sits centered in the main area with approx 5' per side for stroke (it's 10x5 feet). Along the wall that runs the full-length of the apartment, facing the kitchen opposite, will be my sofa. Again, it will be placed on casters. These will enable swinging it into the listening position--lengthwise between the kitchentop and snooker-table. That will give about 11' behind my listening position. The mains will need to be kept in the corners normally, and rolled or lifted into position (pre-marked) for listening. As noted, they will need to be on stands to reach-over the table. They would then have about a foot (maybe a touch more) clearance from the ceiling. There is room for them to be 8 feet apart and 6 feet from the sidewalls, as well as 3 feet from the rear. That puts them about 8.5 feet from the listening position. I will treat two walls with 2 to 4" OSB/GreenGlue: the apartment-length wall and the main-room's side-wall opposite it. Curtains will line the back wall (windows). The apt door will be sealed with all manner of soundisolationdotcom products.

I will place bass-traps in the three corners of the den, the corners of the bedroom and possibly build them elsewhere. The bass units will only most likely fit under the snooker table so if anyone has an idea (a) ifthat would over-time impact [shift] the leveling of my table {which is crucial  for play and pricey to fix} or (b) how it will impact the bass itself...let me know!

There now several annoyances and concerns, but all manageable. They include:


There is no obvious place for a center channel.
The cinema screen will likely need to be a projector and pull-down screen versus my TV (unless that too rolls into place). Stereo listening [music only] is still my primary concern, however.
The mains must be positioned each time.
The subs must be placed under the billiard table.
The equipment rack will likewise need to be under the billiard table (will they vibrate too much?).
The sofa must be moved each time.
The sofa will be too high for normal seating. Even when in position one will need to climb up onto it (step-ladder).
The room cannot be as well isolated (especially the cieling!).
The room will be costlier to isolate where possible (larger surfaces).
Outside noises will intervene (the windows face a busy street).
Kitchen and Laundry rooms of my apartment (and adjacent) will intervene.
The stove has no true air-vent--just a blower that pushes everything out into the room. I don't know the long-term impact of cooking-related airborne oils and smoke (all cooking produces this, whether you see it or not) on my transducers.
I will worry about pool-player friends bumping my audiophile equipment--in a normal theater no one walks around the equipment constantly as is the case when they adjoin a billiard table. My subs, for example, cannot be too close to the table's edge or they might get kicked.

Wish me luck!

PS I just bought the Cairn KO-2 and the EVS 10k balanced ultimate attenuators!

[Bob in St. Louis]

Wish me luck!

Best of luck buddy!! Please take pictures. 

Bob

[richidoo]

A tongue in cheek suggestion:

Trade the snooker table in for "Attack from Mars" pinball machine and put it into the 11x11 bedroom. I guarantee you and all your friends will love it the first time you hit a S-U-P-E-R   J-A-C-K-P-O-T!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lZH8jHCzUg

Then tweak the HT to perfection in the big room where it will work best.